VOGONS


First post, by Pee wee

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Hi guys,

I hope you are all well. Pls, I have a Pentium II at 300 Mhz and a "Riva TNT2" graphics card. But I never had a "Voodoo". I would like to know if is worth it a "Voodoo" or better the "Riva TNT2".

I would appreciate any clarification.

Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 of 15, by BitWrangler

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The TNT2 is contemporary with the Voodoo 3 and they trade blows on benchmarks of popular games of the era. So you're not really missing that much. If you got a hankering to play older glide API games, then a voodoo might begin to make sense. For that particular scenario, the cheaper route would be to get the cheaper 8MB Voodoo 2 to run alongside the TNT2. (No 2d output onboard)

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Reply 3 of 15, by bloodem

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BitWrangler wrote on 2021-11-29, 15:39:

For that particular scenario, the cheaper route would be to get the cheaper 8MB Voodoo 2 to run alongside the TNT2. (No 2d output onboard)

The only problem is that Voodoo 2 cards (even the 8 MB versions) usually sell for much more than the Voodoo 3 AGP versions. Depending on how long one is willing to wait, a Voodoo 3 can still be snatched for $60-$70, while a Voodoo 2 usually sells for well above $100 (I've seen damaged Voodoo 2 cards sell for 60 - $70 😁 ). If you're really lucky, you might be able to find one locally, for a very low price... but, as of 2021, these kinds of deals are the unicorns of the retro world. 😀

Having said that, I do agree that it's not worth "upgrading" from a TNT2 to a Voodoo 3 (if we are indeed talking about a TNT2 and not a TNT2 M64!), unless you are specifically interested in playing Glide games, or if you are simply looking for the experience of finally owning a Voodoo card (which can be a great experience, I admit). 😀

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Reply 5 of 15, by Con 2 botones

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If you are talking about Voodoo 1 or 2, there´s no need replace the TNT2. As BitWrangler mentioned, you can have both Voodoo (1 or 2) and TNT2 working together in the same system, which is ideal (best performance in direct3D thanks to TNT2 and also compatibility with Glide API oriented games).

In the case of Voodoo Banshee or Voodoo 3...yes, you would have to pick one or another. My personal choice would be Voodoo3, especially if you find one inexpensive or given away (not likely 😉 ).

Reply 6 of 15, by leileilol

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PARKE wrote on 2021-11-29, 17:23:

A Pentium II at 300 Mhz is not powerful enough to get the best out of either a Voodoo 3 or a fast TNT2 as far as I have seen. Not worth to 'upgrade' imo.

This mindset completely disregards the improved drivers and the fillrates. I don't think any enthusiast in 1999 held off and waited for the P3 867+ to come out so they can max out the now-2-gens-old 3d hardware they just upgraded to.

I'd throw a V3 in the P2 300 myself.

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Reply 7 of 15, by Baoran

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PARKE wrote on 2021-11-29, 17:23:

A Pentium II at 300 Mhz is not powerful enough to get the best out of either a Voodoo 3 or a fast TNT2 as far as I have seen. Not worth to 'upgrade' imo.

In my opinion it isn't always about getting best out of the card. It is more about if it is useful for what you want to use the pc for.
I am sure most people would say that I am not getting best out of the card when I have put a voodoo 1 card in my 486 pc to make the original tomb raider playable in it.

Reply 8 of 15, by Tetrium

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Pee wee wrote on 2021-11-29, 15:29:
Hi guys, […]
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Hi guys,

I hope you are all well. Pls, I have a Pentium II at 300 Mhz and a "Riva TNT2" graphics card. But I never had a "Voodoo". I would like to know if is worth it a "Voodoo" or better the "Riva TNT2".

I would appreciate any clarification.

Thanks in advance.

This will depend on how much it would cost you vs how much can you or are you willing to afford?
TNT2 and Voodoo3 are roughly similar in performance, so the only thing you'll upgrade to is the ability to run games using glide.

I've read some pretty good responses in this thread already. If it were for free as in if you had all parts already laying around, I think I'd have a slight preference for the Voodoo3 over the TNT2 because of glide (and in your case I can imagine wanting to at least use a Voodoo once, because I didn't have a Voodoo back when they were new (I used a TNT1)).
But personally I wouldn't expect significant change in performance.

With current prices though..it's a bit nuts if you ask me.

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Reply 9 of 15, by Tetrium

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Baoran wrote on 2021-11-30, 09:02:
PARKE wrote on 2021-11-29, 17:23:

A Pentium II at 300 Mhz is not powerful enough to get the best out of either a Voodoo 3 or a fast TNT2 as far as I have seen. Not worth to 'upgrade' imo.

In my opinion it isn't always about getting best out of the card. It is more about if it is useful for what you want to use the pc for.
I am sure most people would say that I am not getting best out of the card when I have put a voodoo 1 card in my 486 pc to make the original tomb raider playable in it.

You may not be getting the best out of the Voodoo1 using it on a 486, but you might be getting the best out of the 486 by using the Voodoo1 in it 😜

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Reply 10 of 15, by dr.zeissler

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With a voodoo3 you probably get the most out of that P2-300! Voodoo cards tend to deliver high performances on higher resolutions. (e.g. 1024x768 where other cards fall back.)
You should also consider using the upgraded mini-gl drivers that produce even better framerates and better filtering/textures. It's important to have a good FPU.

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Reply 11 of 15, by PARKE

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leileilol wrote on 2021-11-30, 06:49:

This mindset completely disregards the improved drivers and the fillrates. I don't think any enthusiast in 1999 held off and waited for the P3 867+ to come out so they can max out the now-2-gens-old 3d hardware they just upgraded to.
I'd throw a V3 in the P2 300 myself.

With your mindset he could also -add- a Voodoo 3 PCI.
But I was indeed only thinking in terms of performance.

Reply 12 of 15, by leileilol

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PARKE wrote on 2021-11-30, 12:50:

With your mindset he could also -add- a Voodoo 3 PCI.
But I was indeed only thinking in terms of performance.

A V3 PCI wouldn't make sense *with* a TNT2. Voodoo3 only works as primary video, and switching between two primaries I always find cumbersome with the cable swapping that'd have to happen. I wouldn't bother with that. Just have a Voodoo2 along the ride with the TNT2 by that point.

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Reply 13 of 15, by dr.zeissler

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A V2SLI with a TNT2 will be a good but expensive solution and keep in mind, some games like diablo2 only benefit from the voodoo3 and are therefore better than on 2xV2 even if they are 12MB so in total 24MB against 16MB of the voodoo3.

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Reply 14 of 15, by RandomStranger

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bloodem wrote on 2021-11-29, 15:58:

Having said that, I do agree that it's not worth "upgrading" from a TNT2 to a Voodoo 3 (if we are indeed talking about a TNT2 and not a TNT2 M64!), unless you are specifically interested in playing Glide games, or if you are simply looking for the experience of finally owning a Voodoo card (which can be a great experience, I admit). 😀

I wouldn't underestimate the M64. By my experience when it isn't bandwidth limited it keeps up well with the full TNT2 (non-pro or ultra).
Some of my tests with a 1.6GHz Northwood (TNT2/TNT2M64 [fps]):
Quake 640x480@16 64/61fps; 800x600@16 both 36fps
Quake 2 640x480@16 42/40fps; 800x600@16 both 36fps
Tomb Raider 2 both hits 30fps in both 640x480 and 800x600 in both 16 and 62bit.
Need for Speed 4 640x480@16 64/64; 640x480@32 34/32; 800x600@16 49/44; 800x600@32 32/27
Quake III Arena 640x480@16 73/70; 640x480@32 42/40; 800x600@16 46/44; 800x600@32 28/27
Colin McRae Rally 2 640x480@16 25/15; 640x480@32 15/6; 800x600@16 22/12; 800x600@32 12/4

In modern games, like CMR2 (or Medal of Honor: AA) the full TNT2 has double the framerate, but for games up until around 1998-1999 they are fairly even.

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Reply 15 of 15, by Carrera

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Back in the day when I was beta testing drivers for 3Dfx I found it annoying that people were pushing the whole 32 bit thing when, at the time, there were very little things other than benchmarks that used it.
3Dfx did rest on their laurels too long though and it kicked them... hard....

I bet if you are careful and lucky you will get a Voodoo2 SLI setup that will work for most of your Glide needs...