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Proprietary 3D API's

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Reply 80 of 91, by dr.zeissler

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Lot's of informations here... I currently use ATI 4.10.2440 on my onboard RageIIc. I am using Win95b with DX5 drivers installed.
I do not want to upgrade to a higher DX-Version because games that require DX6 do not run on that low end machine either.

The RageIIc does not support opengl, so there is no way of getting gl-doom/gl-quake to run in it. I use winquake/doom95 instead.

Are there better drivers for my setup? what would be you recommendations? Does the RagePro Tweaker 1.0 support the RageIIc?

Thx
Doc

Retro-Gamer 😀PowerMac 6100-66/Houdini 486/66 - G4 Cube 450/Rage128pro OS9.0.1 - Macintosh LC/Apple IIe Card OS6.0.8 - Acorn A4000 Archimedes - Unisys CWD 486/66 + Aztech Washington

Reply 81 of 91, by marxveix

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RageIIc does not support OpenGL, but it is possible to use OpenGL wrapper, it should work. RagePro Tweaker versions are mostly for RagePro.

RagePro Tweaker version 1.0 to 1.2 has readme with this info , under rage2.
This release of the Rage Pro Tweaker does not detect what type of card you have. Some of the 3D options will work, and the overclocker should work - except for the reset to defaults option. The opengl drivers do not work on the Rage II or II+ so the opengl options will not work.

Use also Rage2-Tweaker, but it may need some extra files for windows. I have more experience with RagePro, my first graphics card. I have tested Rage2c with Direct3D and 3DCiF just little, it works, but i would like to get more fps, at least without overclocking and tweaking. Rage Pro has PCI and AGP option, it is possible to disable integrated graphics and use some available free slot for faster graphics card.

I have not used 4.10 dx5 drivers now, dx7a setup file seems not that big ,compared to dx6.1 and dx5.0
http://falconfly.3dfx.pl/directx.htm

I uploaded all three RagePro-Tweaker versions and one Rage2-Tweaker here to download.
https://www.upload.ee/files/12871985/rage2-ra … weaker.zip.html

Good that we have RageXL working 3DCIF driver, Thin clients and server motherboards have RageXL integrated graphics, also rage2c and rage pro on older motherboards.

I have HP t5000 series thin client - t5300 with transmeta crusoe tm5600 cpu and ati xl graphics, this would be nice dos and win9x machine, it just need bigger ide 44-pin dom and then i am ready to start. Usb 1.1 is bit slow, but for mouse and keyboard it is good and even for usb stick, it is sometimes ok.
https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/hp/t5300/

Reply 82 of 91, by dr.zeissler

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Thx, I really love that machine and I like the RageIIc because it offers native Win3x drivers. Amithlon seems to works too.
I have only two PCI-Slots, one is equipped with a PowerVR (PCX1) card, the other is used with a ESSSolo1 PCI.

Greetings
Doc

Retro-Gamer 😀PowerMac 6100-66/Houdini 486/66 - G4 Cube 450/Rage128pro OS9.0.1 - Macintosh LC/Apple IIe Card OS6.0.8 - Acorn A4000 Archimedes - Unisys CWD 486/66 + Aztech Washington

Reply 83 of 91, by dr.zeissler

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Has anyone ever got more than 16colors in Win3x out of the Rage2LT-Pro.
Even WFW-Drivers, patched VESA-Drivers do not work. I only get garbage on screen.

Doc

Retro-Gamer 😀PowerMac 6100-66/Houdini 486/66 - G4 Cube 450/Rage128pro OS9.0.1 - Macintosh LC/Apple IIe Card OS6.0.8 - Acorn A4000 Archimedes - Unisys CWD 486/66 + Aztech Washington

Reply 84 of 91, by f1etch

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Hi

Amazing work here!
I have a HP T5700 Thin Client, with an ATi Rage XL (PCI, 8MB) built in to it. One of the reasons I got this particular one was for the 3DCIF possibility.
Unfortunately, it seems the upload.ee links earlier in this thread have all expired, so I'm unable to try the driver packages posted by marxveix on page 4 with the "Rage XL downgrade option"

I've tried the "ATI_3D_CIF_compatible_Rage_XL_driver_for_Win9x-ME_r3.zip" from Gona's site, but it doesn't work with the T5700 I have.
Driver installs with no errors, but on reboot, get errors about display not being configured correctly, and it defaults to 640x480x16.
Device manager shows as RageXL PCI, and says the device is working properly.
This was on a clean install of 98SE. More than happy to try anything anyone would like to suggest to coax that to life.

I tried the J5.30.1-B02 drivers downloaded from Phil's site, and that works fine in windows, but pretty sure that's the unmodified package, so no XL downgrade option/3DCIF support

Any chance of a re-upload of the packages with the XL downgrade option?
If not, a list of which files I need to downgrade?

As there seem to be a few people with the T5000 series Thin Clients, this could help a few of us!

Thanks loads,

F1etch

Reply 85 of 91, by marxveix

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Hi F1etch,

My 5.38.2582-3dcif files are also here (upload.ee uploaded files expire after some time).
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/Tweak … ge-MarxVeix?w=1

Thank you Takedasun!, seems that you have uploaded my other and earlier 4.11.2582 / 4.11.2611 builds also there with my win9x opengl package (ragepro-opengl.zip) that is not latest by now, but still has many OpenGL ICD for Rage cards.

My other earlier builds and tryouts:
w82582en.zip
4.11.2611_rage-3dcif.zip
MACXW4_4.11.2582_Fast_B_est_now_XL_Beta.zip
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/Tweak … e%20PRO_CIF?w=1

Win9x Rage OpenGL files (not my latest and not complete, still we miss many).
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/OGL_RagePro?w=1
ATi RagePro OpenGL files

NB! For the 2573/2582 and probably some other, older drivers:
MACXDD16.DL_ (.DLL) can be latest 5043 or older with other/older versions of MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL)
RAGE2C - latest working MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) is 5033 or older and ATI3DCIF.DL_ (.DLL) can be latest 2696 or older
RAGEPRO (MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) can be latest 5035 or older and ATI3DCIF.DL_ (.DLL) can be latest 2696 or older
RAGEXL working (MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) is 5029 and working ATI3DCIF.DL_ (.DLL) is 2692

Rage2C, RagePro, RageXL all work with MACXDD16.DL_ (.DLL) 5043 or older, (MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) 5029 and ATI3DCIF.DL_ (DLL) 2692
Rage2C 3D-Demo might not always work correctly and Knight demo is only for RagePro/LTPro/XL, but games are working for ATi Rage2C
Maybe there exist even newer MACXDD16.DL_ (.DLL) , but more important is ATI3DCIF.DL_(.DLL) and MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) file versions.

MACXDD16.DL_ (.DLL) 5043 (renamed atid16ad.dll) , (MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) 5029, ATI3DCIF.DL_ (DLL) 2692 are used in 5.38.2582-3dcif

Original sp10912.exe has 5035 and w9x_rpro_5386b6a.zip has 5034 version of MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL), so it makes Rage2C 3DCiF Freeze, like Gona has tested those and other Rage drivers, downgrade to 5033 or older and it will work there as well with Rage2C, but best to use is (MACXDD32.DL_ (.DLL) 5029 and ATI3DCIF.DL_ (DLL) 2692 ones, at least in latest MACXW4 drivers.

My 4.11.2611 3dcif driver i also update some day, maybe soon, but for Rage XL use 5.38.2582-3dcif.
If my driver also does not work, then send your vendor and device id info from that Rage XL, like here:
https://www.oocities.org/ziyadhosein/inf.htm
RAGE XL AGP 2X = ati2mpad, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_474D&SUBSYS_107C10CF, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_474D
RAGE XL AGP 2X = ati2mpad, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_474D&SUBSYS_806A1002, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_474D
RAGE XL PCI = ati2mpad, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_474F
RAGE XL PCI = ati2mpad, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752

My AGP Rage XL is 474D (VEN_1002&DEV_474D)

NB! J series info for 3DCIF (4.11.2611_rage-3dcif.zip).
J series works only with multiple and different driver installations 5.40x + j series or macxw4+j series, something like that, i just did not test it with clean installation, all new installations with just j series driver, it does not work, because of the mix of the driver files, Thank you Gona.

For my HP Thin Client - T5300 i haven't bought bigger ide 44-pin dom yet, so it is still in dos mode. I have similar, T5700 has faster CPU 😀
Re: VIASBCFG - VIA SBPro configuration tool for VIA VT8231 & VT82C686/A/B chipsets (v0.12d)

For those who have more than one accelerator in one PC can use 3D Control Center (for Direct3D) and OpenGL Switcher (for OpenGL)
http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=807&menustate=0
http://www.3dfxzone.it/dir/3dfx/utilities/?objid=3

I hope F1etch will get it work, let us know, Thank you!

With gratitude,
MarxVeix

Reply 86 of 91, by marxveix

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dr.zeissler wrote on 2021-04-06, 09:02:

Has anyone ever got more than 16colors in Win3x out of the Rage2LT-Pro.
Even WFW-Drivers, patched VESA-Drivers do not work. I only get garbage on screen.

Doc

Hi dr.zeissler,

These are Mach64 drivers for Win 3.x, i myself have been using dos/win9x all the time with Rage cards and without, i have never used Win 3.x. Some say that RagePro/LT/XL are also working with Win 3.x, at least PCI versions, this also mentions AGP one, someone should confirm, what works and what not and how?
http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=328

If you get this driver working then there is also file 64ply303.exe - ATI Player v3.03 for Windows 3.1x for that driver.

Windows 3.1X
- For use with ATI Windows 3.1X Display Driver v3.03.
Download file: 64W31303.EXE
- This software requires Video for Windows 1.1e.
Download file: VFW11E.ZIP

Older versions of Mach64 drivers need also load64.zip, i have seen 1.55 and 2.x drivers for Win 3.x. Rage2 era cards, like Rage2LT-Pro should be more bulletproof for Win3x, at least what i know, more than Rage3 era cards, but Rage3 (Rage Pro/LT/XL) cards are also Mach64 variations and i hope they work as well somehow.

I hope you find working driver or solution.

With gratitude,
MarxVeix

Reply 87 of 91, by f1etch

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Hi Marxveix

Thanks for the links, and the info. I'll give those drivers a try and let you know how it goes.
About your 44 PIN DOM - I found it difficult to find a good capacity at a reasonable price, so I ended up going with a short 44pin cable, an mSATA to 44pin IDE adaptor, and a 64GB mSATA for my T5700
Seems to be working really well so far, didn't cost much, and fits inside the case. I read a couple of threads here about others doing the same, which was encouraging.

Thanks loads,

F1etch

Reply 88 of 91, by dr.zeissler

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marxveix wrote on 2021-07-22, 00:17:
Hi dr.zeissler, […]
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dr.zeissler wrote on 2021-04-06, 09:02:

Has anyone ever got more than 16colors in Win3x out of the Rage2LT-Pro.
Even WFW-Drivers, patched VESA-Drivers do not work. I only get garbage on screen.

Doc

Hi dr.zeissler,

These are Mach64 drivers for Win 3.x, i myself have been using dos/win9x all the time with Rage cards and without, i have never used Win 3.x. Some say that RagePro/LT/XL are also working with Win 3.x, at least PCI versions, this also mentions AGP one, someone should confirm, what works and what not and how?
http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=328

If you get this driver working then there is also file 64ply303.exe - ATI Player v3.03 for Windows 3.1x for that driver.

Windows 3.1X
- For use with ATI Windows 3.1X Display Driver v3.03.
Download file: 64W31303.EXE
- This software requires Video for Windows 1.1e.
Download file: VFW11E.ZIP

Older versions of Mach64 drivers need also load64.zip, i have seen 1.55 and 2.x drivers for Win 3.x. Rage2 era cards, like Rage2LT-Pro should be more bulletproof for Win3x, at least what i know, more than Rage3 era cards, but Rage3 (Rage Pro/LT/XL) cards are also Mach64 variations and i hope they work as well somehow.

I hope you find working driver or solution.

With gratitude,
MarxVeix

Thx! I'll try it.

Retro-Gamer 😀PowerMac 6100-66/Houdini 486/66 - G4 Cube 450/Rage128pro OS9.0.1 - Macintosh LC/Apple IIe Card OS6.0.8 - Acorn A4000 Archimedes - Unisys CWD 486/66 + Aztech Washington

Reply 89 of 91, by dr.zeissler

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Sorry I messed it up. ATI-Drivers from 5.20 CD do work in Win3x just fine. Drivers are for mach64 but are fully compatible with my RageLTpro.
I have two identical mini-desktops with the same board, one worked the other not. I had to fix/upgrade the VGA-Bios on one Board, now both are working.
I have to check what is the best Win9x driver for the RageLTpro. Normally I would go for a DX5-Solution but some drivers do require dx6.

For the best dx6-driver I would recommend:

- good D3D compatibility
- working opengl support
- ati3dcif not broken.

what would be your advice?
Thx!

Retro-Gamer 😀PowerMac 6100-66/Houdini 486/66 - G4 Cube 450/Rage128pro OS9.0.1 - Macintosh LC/Apple IIe Card OS6.0.8 - Acorn A4000 Archimedes - Unisys CWD 486/66 + Aztech Washington

Reply 90 of 91, by f1etch

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Hi

Tried the 5.38.2582-3dcif drivers linked to, but still get the same problem - Drivers install, but on reboot, its 640x480x16,
and errors of "There is a problem with your display settings. The adapter type is incorrect, or the current settings do not work with your hardware."

The info for the XL PCI in my T5700 is
PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002&REV_27

It appears in device manager as RAGE XL PCI (4752)

I tried installing the "j5_12_bigzr1" and that works, seems to use ATI2DRAE.DRV 4.12.2647 and ATI2VXAE.VXD 4.12.2648

Thanks,

F1etch

Reply 91 of 91, by marxveix

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f1etch wrote on Yesterday, 14:58:
Hi […]
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Hi

Tried the 5.38.2582-3dcif drivers linked to, but still get the same problem - Drivers install, but on reboot, its 640x480x16,
and errors of "There is a problem with your display settings. The adapter type is incorrect, or the current settings do not work with your hardware."

The info for the XL PCI in my T5700 is
PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002&REV_27

It appears in device manager as RAGE XL PCI (4752)

I tried installing the "j5_12_bigzr1" and that works, seems to use ATI2DRAE.DRV 4.12.2647 and ATI2VXAE.VXD 4.12.2648

Thanks,

F1etch

By now, if you have installed both macxw4 + j series, can you try 3d-demo (j series drivers installed and working), does it show ATi 3D spinning logo? If yes, then you can run 3dcif games and j series makes your d3d + opengl also work.

Added second 4752 to the MACXW4.INF with your subsys.
"RAGE XL PCI (4752HP-TC)"= MACXW4_PCI_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752

Try this with manual driver installation, device manager and select manually RAGE XL PCI (4752HP-TC).
https://hingetee.ee/meedia/test/5.38.2582-3DCIF.ZIP

Please try first 3D-DEMO without installing this 5.38.2582-3DCIF again, maybe you already have working 3dcif/d3d/opengl with two driver installations.