Phil's DOS 386/486 Time Machine \ VOGONS

Phil's DOS 386/486 Time Machine

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First post, by PhilsComputerLab

Posted on 2014-11-02, 09:39

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Here are some images of the current state of my Time Machine 😀

What is a Time Machine? The combination of new and old parts in combination with slow-down tricks to achieve the best of both worlds:

Authenticity and compatibility with old DOS games but also the convenience and reliability of new hardware (reliable and quiet ATX PSU, Optical PS/2 mouse, USB storage if wanted, modern storage options...)

While I have 386 and 486 hardware I just prefer using my Time Machine for convenience.

The "original" machine has been documented in this video: http://youtu.be/-NLEIwzavtg

I believe I built that one in July 2013.

Here the current config:

- Gigabyte GZ-X7 case which comes with a Gigabyte 400W PSU
- DFI Super Socket 7 motherboard
- 16 MB SDRAM
- Pentium 200 MHz running at 66 x 1.5 = 100 MHz
- AGP FX5200
- Sound Blaster AWE64 Gold (220-7-1-5-300)
- Roland MPU-401AT (2/9-330)
- GOTEK USB floppy emulator
- Newish IDE DVD-RW
- SATA Hard Drive hot-swap bay
- SATA to IDE adapter

After trying all sorts of storage options I've settled on using SATA to IDE adapters for pretty much everything. The drives all have a 32 GB capacity limit (set with SeaTools). I can also use notebook drives, here I use this StarTech adapter that converts a notebook drive into the physical form factor of a desktop drive. The BIOS detects it fine. HDD activity lights on the case but also on the SATA Hard Drive hot-swap bay.

Strengths:

- Everything "just works"
- Great digital sound quality + AWE synth + all sorts of MIDI options (Currently I got MT-32 (Old), CM-32L, SC-55 and MU80 connected to the MPU-401AT)
- Simple configuration,tried and tested with tons of games
- Caches off > average 386DX
- L1 cache off, L2 cache on > Fast 486DX
- 100 MHz clock speed avoids many compatibility issues
- FX 5200 clones VGA and DVI which I use for capturing DVI while playing on VGA

Weaknesses:

- The DFI board turns the CPU fan on and off
- The DFI board is quite slow (not an issue for what I do)
- AMD K6-II+ or K6-III+ has more options for faster performance (not an issue for what I do)

Last edited by PhilsComputerLab on 2014-11-02, 12:11. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 1 of 13, by GeorgeMan

Posted on 2014-11-02, 11:32

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Very nice!
The only thing that bothers me is.... that this kind of black exterior painting is fingerprint-attractive and photo-phobic as well 😜 xD

Reply 2 of 13, by PhilsComputerLab

Posted on 2014-11-02, 12:11

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GeorgeMan wrote:
Very nice!
The only thing that bothers me is.... that this kind of black exterior painting is fingerprint-attractive and photo-phobic as well 😜 xD

Fixed 🤣

Last edited by PhilsComputerLab on 2014-11-02, 12:20. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 3 of 13, by GeorgeMan

Posted on 2014-11-02, 12:20

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Haha alrighty then!

Reply 4 of 13, by MMaximus

Posted on 2014-11-02, 18:04

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Nice looking system. What games do you usually play on this?

Also, I haven't tried any SATA to IDE adapter yet - is it just a generic model or do some work better than others ?

Lastly, why do you now prefer HDDs instead of CompactFlash cards? Haven't had any problems so far using CF cards with Dos...

Reply 5 of 13, by Skyscraper

Posted on 2014-11-02, 18:42

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The Pentium 200 is nice, slow enough (even at full speed) to not trigger the Turbo Pascal speed bug. (in most cases)

Main PC: Dual Xeon X5690@4.6ghz, Evga - SR-2, 48gb memory, Intel X25-M g2 SSD and a Nvidia GTX 980 ti.
Retro PC #3: K6-2 450@500mhz, PC-Chips m577, 256mb sdram, AWE64 and a Voodoo Banshee.

Reply 6 of 13, by PhilsComputerLab

Posted on 2014-11-02, 18:51

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MMaximus wrote:
Nice looking system. What games do you usually play on this?

Also, I haven't tried any SATA to IDE adapter yet - is it just a generic model or do some work better than others ?

Lastly, why do you now prefer HDDs instead of CompactFlash cards? Haven't had any problems so far using CF cards with Dos...

I mostly use this system to add "new" GOG.com DOSBox based releases to the hard drive, test them, do recordings, do captures. I don't really play games, enjoy playing with hardware, documenting, making videos much more...

There are all sorts of types of SATA to IDE adapter. The ones I use plug directly into the back of a SATA drive and give you IDE and molex power. I tested them in all sorts of systems, from 386 to Pentium 3 and very happy.

HDDs and CF cards both have their strengths, there is a reason why Artex has options for both in his Time Machine 😀

Benefits of HDDs:

- Using SeaTools you can create a 128GB drive, the maximum for Windows 98 FAT32
- 64GB and 128GB CF cards are not cheap
- Windows 95 and 98 performance is fantastic (CF cards struggle here)
- Scales well with faster machines, Pentium, Pentium II, Pentium III 1.4 GHz
- I did run into issues with the PCI SATA controller in combination with MPU401 in some games / some motherboards

Benefits of CF cards:

- Small capacities are cheap
- Great option for DOS only machines
- XT, 286, 386 and 486 great for CF cards
- Easier to handle and silent although new SATA drives are also very quiet

Skyscraper wrote:
The Pentium 200 is nice, slow enough (even at full speed) to not trigger the Turbo Pascal speed bug. (in most cases)

Must admit I haven't done much testing with it running at 200 MHz. Always had it running at 100 MHz and never had issues so that's why I'm sticking with it 😀 K6-III+ is more flexible however and what I would recommend anyone building a Time Machine because you can set the multiplier via software from 2x to 6x. If your FSB is set to 66 that means you can set the machine from 133 to 400 MHz giving you a nice range of performance levels for some of the later 3D games and some Voodoo 2 action 😀

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Reply 7 of 13, by Nahkri

Posted on 2014-11-02, 19:42

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philscomputerlab wrote:

- The DFI board is quite slow (not an issue for what I do)

Since u use a Intel processor maybe a mainboard with intel chipset should be faster.

Mb:JetWay 542C Ali Aladdin 5
Pr:Amd K6-3+:400MHZ @ 550 mhz
Ram:256mb
3D:Voodoo 3 3000 16MB
Sound:Turtle Beach-Montego A3dExtreme(Aureal Vortex 1)
Hdd:Maxtor Fireball Plus 8 40g,7200rpm,2mb cache
Os:Windows 98SE

Reply 8 of 13, by Half-Saint

Posted on 2014-11-02, 20:38

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Is it possible to enable/disable cache on a K6-III via software?

Reply 9 of 13, by PhilsComputerLab

Posted on 2014-11-02, 22:39

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Nahkri wrote:
philscomputerlab wrote:

- The DFI board is quite slow (not an issue for what I do)

Since u use a Intel processor maybe a mainboard with intel chipset should be faster.

Intel and SIS are fastest, at least amongst the boards I reviewed. But slow is good in my case 😀

Half-Saint wrote:
Is it possible to enable/disable cache on a K6-III via software?

Internal CPU cache can be enabled / disabled via software with Intel and AMD chips. Motherboard cache has to be done through BIOS.

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Reply 10 of 13, by chinny22

Posted on 2014-11-04, 16:59

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First time I think I've seen your PC's all together I think! Unsurprisingly its all nice and neat. Not going to say nice build, that's stating the obvious

Reply 11 of 13, by spolon

Posted on 2014-11-17, 17:47

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I liked very much , congratulations.
Very interesting video walkthrough that you created . Brought me good memories . 😎

Renan Spolon
www.muquiranas.com

Reply 12 of 13, by ratfink

Posted on 2014-11-22, 12:03

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Interesting you use an fx5200. Is it solely a dos machine or do you run some form of windows too?

Reply 13 of 13, by PhilsComputerLab

Posted on 2014-11-22, 12:35

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ratfink wrote:
Interesting you use an fx5200. Is it solely a dos machine or do you run some form of windows too?

Pure DOS. The main reason I use it is because it clones the image through VGA and DVI which it ideal for capturing DVD while viewing VGA.

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