FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby BeginnerGuy » 2018-6-15 @ 00:52

Pretty sad that the idea of discussing having to use the evil crack word about a steam game should even come up.

I started a few discussions last night on steam and it's unbelievable the amount of lemmings that will go on full assault in defense of valve for not just leaving us a legacy steam app that simply allows us to continue playing our games (no other features necessary).
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby DosFreak » 2018-6-15 @ 01:09

I'm not even sure why the Steam forum exists, the Internet would be better off without it. It's basically an echo chamber of ignorance.

Probably would have better luck on cs.rin.ru to identify all the current steam emulators and which aren't compatible with XP and what needs to be done to make them compatible. (I'm only mentioning the forum for those with legit games that want to continue using them on their OS)
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby infiniteclouds » 2018-6-15 @ 04:28

BeginnerGuy wrote:Pretty sad that the idea of discussing having to use the evil crack word about a steam game should even come up.

I started a few discussions last night on steam and it's unbelievable the amount of lemmings that will go on full assault in defense of valve for not just leaving us a legacy steam app that simply allows us to continue playing our games (no other features necessary).


Was there any reason give for your thread being locked?? I see no moderator response and I saw no flaming from apologists or you going on whatsoever. What gives?!
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby gdjacobs » 2018-6-15 @ 04:42

Hasn't GoG patched around copy protection issues on some of the titles they publish? I wonder if they just use what's in the wild or develop their own.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby badmojo » 2018-6-15 @ 06:06

This is probably a dumb question but are there many XP only games? I.e. that don't run on Win10? All the old stuff I've tried on 10 work like a charm - better than Win7 actually.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby infiniteclouds » 2018-6-15 @ 06:35

badmojo wrote: All the old stuff I've tried on 10 work like a charm - better than Win7 actually.


You're not the first person to say this... does anyone have any idea why this would be?
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby xjas » 2018-6-15 @ 06:48

Before everyone whips themselves into a frenzy, know that quite a lot of Steam games are actually DRM-free. No, your average Cow'a'dooty cash cow triple-A types usually aren't, but if you mainly use Steam for indie games you might be pleasantly surprised.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby infiniteclouds » 2018-6-15 @ 06:57

One of the topics was locked with 'piracy discussion' -- no one was advocating piracy in that thread -- as an excuse. However, Beginner's own topic was locked without reason or explanation and there was not a mention of piracy in it.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby BeginnerGuy » 2018-6-15 @ 07:16

infiniteclouds wrote:
BeginnerGuy wrote:Pretty sad that the idea of discussing having to use the evil crack word about a steam game should even come up.

I started a few discussions last night on steam and it's unbelievable the amount of lemmings that will go on full assault in defense of valve for not just leaving us a legacy steam app that simply allows us to continue playing our games (no other features necessary).


Was there any reason give for your thread being locked?? I see no moderator response and I saw no flaming from apologists or you going on whatsoever. What gives?!


Are you talking about the thread on steam community forums where i was advocating for a legacy client for xp users?? I have no idea why that was locked, I'll have to check on it when i get to my desktop. Maybe because I opened it in the wrong section.

I'd like to form a group if possible on steam for xp users. I have little faith it will get us anywhere but hey why not.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby infiniteclouds » 2018-6-15 @ 10:07

BeginnerGuy wrote:
infiniteclouds wrote:
BeginnerGuy wrote:Pretty sad that the idea of discussing having to use the evil crack word about a steam game should even come up.

I started a few discussions last night on steam and it's unbelievable the amount of lemmings that will go on full assault in defense of valve for not just leaving us a legacy steam app that simply allows us to continue playing our games (no other features necessary).


Was there any reason give for your thread being locked?? I see no moderator response and I saw no flaming from apologists or you going on whatsoever. What gives?!


Are you talking about the thread on steam community forums where i was advocating for a legacy client for xp users?? I have no idea why that was locked, I'll have to check on it when i get to my desktop. Maybe because I opened it in the wrong section.

I'd like to form a group if possible on steam for xp users. I have little faith it will get us anywhere but hey why not.


Yes sir. https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/ ... 429/?ctp=2 Suggestions forum -- seems like the right place to me. I have no idea why this was locked.

Apparently even the likes of Ubisoft and EA offer legacy versions of Origins/UPlay for Windows XP. That is saying something.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby BeginnerGuy » 2018-6-15 @ 13:17

infiniteclouds wrote:

Yes sir. https://steamcommunity.com/discussions/ ... 429/?ctp=2 Suggestions forum -- seems like the right place to me. I have no idea why this was locked.

Apparently even the likes of Ubisoft and EA offer legacy versions of Origins/UPlay for Windows XP. That is saying something.


Weird. I have no idea, I didn't make any comments that were deleted even though I was getting agitated by the responses since nobody actually reads the OP or existing posts before they reply with the same nonsense over and over again. I've concluded that it's futile to even attempt to communicate in an open steam forum, I feel the same way DosFreak does about those forums now.

I'm not educated enough with the production of "commercial software" to leave a a solid enough counter-argument to stop these people. They claim that a legacy client would require continuing support, which as far as I know is completely false. I consider old programs I've developed for old OSes that are still posted online but no longer supported by me to be "legacy", they work "as-is", and I've always assumed it to be as such.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby Scali » 2018-6-15 @ 14:28

BeginnerGuy wrote:I'm not educated enough with the production of "commercial software" to leave a a solid enough counter-argument to stop these people. They claim that a legacy client would require continuing support, which as far as I know is completely false. I consider old programs I've developed for old OSes that are still posted online but no longer supported by me to be "legacy", they work "as-is", and I've always assumed it to be as such.


This is true for standalone software to a certain extent (it could be possible that legacy software will not work anymore when other parts of the system are updated, such as the OS, drivers, hardware etc).
The problem with Steam is that it is an online platform, so there are two sides here:
- The Steam client software
- The server-side Steam services

As soon as you want to log in to Steam, you need to contact a service. When you want to download/install a game, you need to contact a service etc.
So the problem here is that if they want to keep supporting legacy clients, they have to keep the services stable as well... at least to the point that a 'legacy' Steam service exists alongside a 'cutting-edge' one.

I think this is the biggest problem in the software world today: nearly everything relies on web services.
A lot of software can't even be downloaded anymore. You get a simple installer 'shim', which downloads and installs the actual software when you run it. Of course this will break at some point in the future.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby DosFreak » 2018-6-15 @ 15:09

BeginnerGuy wrote:I'm not educated enough with the production of "commercial software" to leave a a solid enough counter-argument to stop these people. They claim that a legacy client would require continuing support, which as far as I know is completely false. I consider old programs I've developed for old OSes that are still posted online but no longer supported by me to be "legacy", they work "as-is", and I've always assumed it to be as such.


It's not that complicated. The people that don't know what they are talking about make it seem so but it really isn't.

The Steam client is bloated anyway with features I dare to say most people don't need or want and could use a redesign. If Valve care they would perform a redesign and during that redesign disable the functionality that they do not care to support on older Operating Systems. So for <=Vista they could disable everything except for launching Steam and downloading and playing games. As for authentication they could use OpenSSL instead of relying on Microsoft files that aren't updated. If they didn't want to even do that then they could go the lazy route and post the Steam .dlls you could drop in the game folder to at least play your game without Steam. (The only issue then is 3rd party DRM). If they didn't want to do any of the above they could do the bare bare minimum and use the current steam client, put it into permanent offline mode and call it a day. None of what I just posted is very difficult or would take much to support.....except if you work at Valve and you can work on anything you want when you feel like it and you don't have to answer to a boss or your (former?) customers. It's a glorified game launcher for crying out loud.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby KCompRoom2000 » 2018-6-16 @ 05:01

Good thing I don't use Steam at all (since I'm not much of a modern PC gamer :lol: ). All of my XP-era games are physical CD/DVD copies so it looks like I'm good to go.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby badmojo » 2018-6-16 @ 05:39

badmojo wrote:This is probably a dumb question but are there many XP only games? I.e. that don't run on Win10? All the old stuff I've tried on 10 work like a charm - better than Win7 actually.


So are there? If not then what's the problem?
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby dirkmirk » 2018-6-16 @ 10:58

I had problems running Max Payne & Max Payne 2 recently, game doesnt start need to run in win98 or xp comptability mode than run a patch to get the sound to work.

Grand Theft Auto 4 was a pain in the ass to get working a while back, im sure theirs heaps more.

Pathetic they cant even have games running without patches.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby Dominus » 2018-6-16 @ 11:49

vvbee wrote:Only interested if this affects wine.

Shouldn't. Wine can be a Windows 10 bottle.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby ZellSF » 2018-6-17 @ 14:42

In other news, water is wet. Steam always was a short-term DRM rental service with ever changing terms.

If you buy a game with DRM and no crack available, I think that's on you.
badmojo wrote:
badmojo wrote:This is probably a dumb question but are there many XP only games? I.e. that don't run on Win10? All the old stuff I've tried on 10 work like a charm - better than Win7 actually.


So are there? If not then what's the problem?

From my experience, 99%+ of 32-bit Windows games run as well on 10 as on XP. That estimation is without resorting to emulators and virtualization. dgVoodoo2 and ReShade means many of them look better on 10 than XP too. Obviously 10 gets you compatibility with Direct3D10+ titles as well.

It is however more work and probably requires better hardware. Sound quality also won't be as good on many titles as XP was the last OS with hardware sound acceleration.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby infiniteclouds » 2018-6-18 @ 00:27

Being that Steam has many DRM-free games on there already -- in that you can install the game and launch the .exe without Steam - they should just include offline executable installers for these titles. Negates the need for a legacy client altogether. Download the installer from your library on your main machine, then copy it over to your XP machine.

I think we have a better chance of seeing this than a legacy client.
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Re: FYI: Steam drops XP/Vista in 2019

Postby mr_bigmouth_502 » 2018-6-18 @ 08:48

So much for playing CS 1.6 on period hardware. Mind you, you could easily play a cracked copy on non-Steam servers, but those servers are full of cheaters.
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