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Reply 1400 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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RetroGC wrote on 2023-03-07, 15:32:
HI, sorry for bothering again... I'll probably win first prize :( I've found (i think) right XMI files for delta V soundtrack ( […]
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HI,
sorry for bothering again... I'll probably win first prize 🙁
I've found (i think) right XMI files for delta V soundtrack (I think the one on mirsoft is incomplete/wrong beause .mid files mixe together GM and gravis ost).
with some of those XMI, your software crash... maybe you could take a look.
Thank you.
Aldo

Hi,
Can you provide more info about where/when you got the crash? I could not reproduce a single crash with either file. So my best guess is that not the player itself but your Midi out driver crashes. And since Midi out drivers are in-process dlls when they crash they crash the application itself. So to confirm/refute my theory you should try to play these XML files also with the internal Bassmidi driver and then with other Midi out ports.
Looking at the Midi data itself it seems that there are rather strange incomplete SysEx messages in these files so that could be an explanation why some Midi drivers cannot handle them.
So you should also try to disable Main menu -> SysEx Options-> Enable SysEx in files.

@Edit:
Here is a demonstration video about my test run:
https://youtu.be/k9q2pFTm3ik

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Reply 1401 of 1815, by RetroGC

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Hi,
first of all thank you for your answer. With bass midi driver I've crash anyway, while disabling "sysex in file" midiplayer works fine and iit's not crashing, so that's the cause but I've wroung output (for example first track is mute while second track use wrong instruments).
Thank you.
Aldo

My Videogames Music Channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/RetroGamesClub

Reply 1402 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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RetroGC wrote on 2023-03-08, 07:02:
Hi, first of all thank you for your answer. With bass midi driver I've crash anyway, while disabling "sysex in file" midiplaye […]
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Hi,
first of all thank you for your answer. With bass midi driver I've crash anyway, while disabling "sysex in file" midiplayer works fine and iit's not crashing, so that's the cause but I've wroung output (for example first track is mute while second track use wrong instruments).
Thank you.
Aldo

Hi,
You still have not given more detailed info about what the "crash" means on your side and when it happens. What is the difference between what you have seen on my testing video and what you have experienced ?
In the first half of my video I used Bassmidi without problems and as you could see with SysEx messages enabled. Have you used the same files as you attached above?

@Edit:
I have added a check so that FSMP ignores SysEx messages with zero length payloads. Test it, maybe it can cure your problems:
https://falcosoft.hu/midiplayer_62_test.zip

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Reply 1403 of 1815, by RetroGC

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HI, thank you, I'm going to try. In my case software crash and appear the windows dialog boxe (software stop working). I'm using windows 7 32 bit with (black viper?) optimized registry settings.
Yes, I'm using the same file. Some of this files has wrong lenght too, but inside hoot, maybe with right adv they're fine... but hoot midioutput is not "bit perfect" like yours.
Thank you.
Aldo

P.S.: I attach the hoot XML config to understand which files are for GM

<romlist archive="deltav_at">
<rom type="file" offset="-1">HOOT.EXE</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="-1">MIDI.ADV</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x10">XMI00021.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x11">XMI00011.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x12">XMI00012.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x13">XMI00004.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x14">XMI00001.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x15">XMI00005.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x16">XMI00003.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x17">XMI00031.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x18">XMI00028.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x19">XMI00029.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x1A">XMI00030.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x1B">XMI00026.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x1C">XMI00016.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x1D">XMI00014.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x1E">XMI00015.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x1F">XMI00023.XMI</rom>
<rom type="file" offset="0x20">XMI00024.XMI</rom>
<rom type="shell" offset="0">HOOT.EXE NONE MIDI.ADV</rom>
</romlist>

Attachments

  • Filename
    deltav_at.zip
    File size
    155.82 KiB
    Downloads
    46 downloads
    File comment
    full hoot ost
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

My Videogames Music Channel:
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Reply 1404 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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RetroGC wrote on 2023-03-08, 10:22:

...
P.S.: I attach the hoot XML config to understand which files are for GM

I'm almost sure that none of the problematic files are meant to play on pure GM devices so the above list is definitely not right.
None of the XMI players/converters I have tried so far succeeded in converting the strange incomplete SysEx messages to meaningful ones but inferring from the raw data they are meant for Roland gears since the recognizable starting bytes are 'F0 41'.

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Reply 1405 of 1815, by RetroGC

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Just hoot, with game's "ADV files" is able to reproduce them correctly.... but somethines there's that sort of few millisecond out of sync that drive me crazy with that software.
Thank you for your support.
Aldo

My Videogames Music Channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/RetroGamesClub

Reply 1406 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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RetroGC wrote on 2023-03-08, 10:55:

Just hoot, with game's "ADV files" is able to reproduce them correctly.... but somethines there's that sort of few millisecond out of sync that drive me crazy with that software.
Thank you for your support.
Aldo

Have you tested with the above linked version of FSMP?
BTW, How can I use HOOT.EXE to play these XMI files?

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Reply 1407 of 1815, by RetroGC

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I've tested the attached 6.2 and I've just replaced: no more crash. Btw, some XMI is mute (like the first: XMI00021.XMI) and some sound wrong. I've 9 files of the list which seems to work correctly but I'll compare them later: Now I'm recording. The package zip I've attacched is from hoot player. To be played inside hoot you'll need the complete Bethesda XML configuration file. I've configured hoot player to use midiout device and I'm using the latest 2023 revision. I'm recording this OST with Integra-7, Integra-7 PCM Expansion Set and Sound Sonority XXL for now, later I'll decide which hardware I'll use to upload the OST on my channel.
Aldo

P.S.: Concerning hoot I even tryed to contact the developer trough twitter without success... I'll try again, I've seen there's a kind of board on the site to describe the problem I've with midi

My Videogames Music Channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/RetroGamesClub

Reply 1408 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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RetroGC wrote on 2023-03-08, 11:17:

...Btw, some XMI is mute (like the first: XMI00021.XMI)

XMI00021.XMI is not mute, it just starts playing at 2:07. You can set 'Play from First Note' option on the playlist's context menu if you want to jump to that position immediately after start.

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Reply 1409 of 1815, by dank0

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Hello Falcosoft.
i am using your player with dosbox and i am using it with vst plugs Roland/munt/yamaha. but i dont like all the time look for my plug directory, it will be nice to have small bookmark area in the VST window - check the image

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AMD K6-II 500, Nvidia TNT2 AGP, 256 MB RAM

••••••••••••••••••••••••••••
•• WANTED: ROLAND SCP-55 ••
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Reply 1410 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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dank0 wrote on 2023-03-15, 22:24:

Hello Falcosoft.
i am using your player with dosbox and i am using it with vst plugs Roland/munt/yamaha. but i dont like all the time look for my plug directory...

Hi,
You do not have to. That's why Main Menu -> Configuration Presets exists. You can switch between configuration presets many ways but maybe the fastest is Ctrl + Alt + Preset number.
More info:
Re: Falcosoft Soundfont Midi Player

BTW, do not forget to check the 'Autoload at Startup' checkbox before saving a preset. And you should also fine tune other settings before saving presets like sample rate, custom patch definition, SysEx reset type etc. since for different synths different options are ideal.

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Reply 1411 of 1815, by MSThalamus

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Really enjoying the Falcosoft Midi Player!

I am occasionally running into clipping, though. Reading through the thread, I've learned to enable both "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" and "Use 32-bit sample data" in order that the Master Volume slider can be moved down to prevent clipping. That's working just fine via the UI, but I've set my emulator box up as headless.

I'd like to be able to send SysEx messages for this from the game client, and IIRC notes as of 4.5 showed this could be done. I already have such messages working to switch presets (e.g. F0 66 04 02 F7 for preset 2), so I looked for such a message for master volume. I found http:// midi.teragonaudio.com/tech/midispec/mastrvol.htm and from it put together messages such as F0 7F 7F 04 01 00 40 F7 (for 50% volume), but although MDF shows that it sent the bytes, nothing happens when I send the message. Do I have the 0xLL and 0xMM bytes backward, or am I missing something else simple, or does Midi Player use a completely different format for this? Thanks much!

Reply 1412 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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MSThalamus wrote on 2023-03-18, 16:03:

Really enjoying the Falcosoft Midi Player!

I am occasionally running into clipping, though. Reading through the thread, I've learned to enable both "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" and "Use 32-bit sample data" in order that the Master Volume slider can be moved down to prevent clipping. That's working just fine via the UI, but I've set my emulator box up as headless.

I'd like to be able to send SysEx messages for this from the game client, and IIRC notes as of 4.5 showed this could be done. I already have such messages working to switch presets (e.g. F0 66 04 02 F7 for preset 2), so I looked for such a message for master volume. I found http:// midi.teragonaudio.com/tech/midispec/mastrvol.htm and from it put together messages such as F0 7F 7F 04 01 00 40 F7 (for 50% volume), but although MDF shows that it sent the bytes, nothing happens when I send the message. Do I have the 0xLL and 0xMM bytes backward, or am I missing something else simple, or does Midi Player use a completely different format for this? Thanks much!

Hi,
In this case you simply have to disable the "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" option. If "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" is enabled then MidiPlayer filters out Volume/Balance SysEx messages from Midi input and also from Midi files. This way it can ensure that your set Midi Master Volume level is preserved regardless of incoming Midi messages.
If "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" option is disabled then no such filtering happens.

BTW, you should be aware that GM/GS/XG etc. reset messages (either from Midi files or from the player itself) resets the Midi Master Volume back to 100% if Use SysEx for Volume/Balance is disabled ( thus no filtering happens) .

Last edited by Falcosoft on 2023-03-18, 17:09. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 1413 of 1815, by MSThalamus

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Falcosoft wrote on 2023-03-18, 16:46:

Hi,
In this case you simply have to disable the "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" option. If "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" is enabled then MidiPlayer filters out Volume/Balance SysEx messages from Midi input and also from Midi files. This way it can ensure that your set Midi Master Volume level is preserved regardless of incoming Midi messages.
If "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" option is disabled then no such filtering happens.

Thanks for answering so quickly! I want to be sure to thank you for this Midi Player! It's an incredible product, and I so appreciate your work to provide it! 😁

That makes sense and I can confirm that it does work. But, as I understand it, if I disable "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" then the Master Volume can't prevent clipping as it's applied after the clipping would have already occurred (as shown by the levels not decreasing when the Master Volume slider is moved). It would be great if there were a way to adjust Master Volume remotely (through a differently formatted message?) when "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" is enabled, for this very scenario, i.e. a headless emulation box experiences clipping in one particular game, a MDF command could be added to a batch file to adjust this as the game is launched, similarly to what I'm already doing to switch presets. Just an idea-- again I very much appreciate the player as it is!

thanks!

Reply 1414 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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MSThalamus wrote on 2023-03-18, 17:08:

Thanks for answering so quickly! I want to be sure to thank you for this Midi Player! It's an incredible product, and I so appreciate your work to provide it! 😁

That makes sense and I can confirm that it does work. But, as I understand it, if I disable "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" then the Master Volume can't prevent clipping as it's applied after the clipping would have already occurred (as shown by the levels not decreasing when the Master Volume slider is moved). It would be great if there were a way to adjust Master Volume remotely (through a differently formatted message?) when "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" is enabled, for this very scenario, i.e. a headless emulation box experiences clipping in one particular game, a MDF command could be added to a batch file to adjust this as the game is launched, similarly to what I'm already doing to switch presets. Just an idea-- again I very much appreciate the player as it is!

thanks!

No, it does not work this way.
Enabling or disabling Use SysEx for Volume/Balance option has no direct relation to clipping prevention in any way. There is no clipping prevention magic involved.
If Use SysEx for Volume/Balance option is enabled then the player sends the same Master Volume SysEx messages when you move the Volume slider as you do through Midi input. That's it.
This has only indirect relation to clipping because this way you alter the volume of the Synth itself before the mixing phase.
The normal volume slider (when Use SysEx for Volume/Balance option is disabled) alters the volume after the mixing phase.

The "Use 32-bit sample data" option has direct relation to clipping since 32-bit float samples cannot clip in the strict sense.
Normalized floating point samples are in the -1.0/+1.0 range but float values over this range can be represented without information loss.
In these cases you usually experience some kind of compression effect/artifact instead of clipping.

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Reply 1415 of 1815, by MSThalamus

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Falcosoft wrote on 2023-03-18, 17:20:
... This has only indirect relation to clipping because this way you alter the volume of the Synth itself before the mixing phas […]
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...
This has only indirect relation to clipping because this way you alter the volume of the Synth itself before the mixing phase.
...
Normalized floating point samples are in the -1/+1 range but float values over this range can be represented without information loss.
In these cases you usually experience some kind of compression effect/artifact instead of clipping.
...

Sorry, I think I'm doing a poor job of explaining myself. What I'm experiencing then must be the compression/artifacting instead of clipping.

I do have "Use 32-bit sample data" enabled as well. When "Use SysEx for Volume/Balance" is enabled, I can move the Master Volume slider down, and presumably before mixing the computed value is then above -1 or below 1, thereby preventing this artifacting? Either way, moving the slider down when this is enabled visibly lowers the maximum extent of the levels indicators and prevents the unpleasant noise when they peg all the way up. It would be great if this slider could be moved remotely when this is enabled, but I understand the work item may not be possible/worth taking on.

To be clear, I'm not meaning to argue with you. I was just concerned I was doing a lousy job explaining my thoughts.

thanks again!

Reply 1416 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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MSThalamus wrote on 2023-03-18, 17:37:

... Either way, moving the slider down when this is enabled visibly lowers the maximum extent of the levels indicators and prevents the unpleasant noise when they peg all the way up. It would be great if this slider could be moved remotely, but I understand the work item may not be possible/worth taking on.
...
thanks again!

When you send a GM Master Volume SysEx message trough Midi input then you "move that slider" (It' just not visible).
Namely then you alter the same pre -mixing synth volume. Notice that the levels indicator also changes when you send your Volume messages remotely.

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Reply 1417 of 1815, by MSThalamus

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Falcosoft wrote on 2023-03-18, 17:47:
MSThalamus wrote on 2023-03-18, 17:37:

... Either way, moving the slider down when this is enabled visibly lowers the maximum extent of the levels indicators and prevents the unpleasant noise when they peg all the way up. It would be great if this slider could be moved remotely, but I understand the work item may not be possible/worth taking on.
...
thanks again!

When you send a GM Master Volume SysEx message trough Midi input then you "move that slider" (It' just not visible).
Namely then you alter the same pre -mixing synth volume. Notice that the levels indicator also changes when you send your Volume messages remotely.

Right you are (of course)! With "Use SysEx..." disabled, I was able to send a message to set volume to 0 that clearly muted the levels indicator. My other messages didn't turn it back up, but I assume I put the bytes together wrong-- I should be able to sort that out.

Thanks so much for helping a noob! 😀

Reply 1418 of 1815, by Terrapin

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I was looking for a way to post feedback/suggestions on the Falcosoft website. I hope here works!

This is my favorite soundfont MIDI player 😁
A few thoughts on it:

1. Would it be possible to create an additional (optional) window for soundfont selection?

I think that would make things much more user-friendly and more easily accessible for those rummaging through many soundfonts to see what sounds best with different MIDI tracks. I currently have to go into settings, browse and select a soundfont for use, then save to commit changes for the use of a different soundfont. And it seems I have to restart whatever MIDI is playing (in an external media player, with loopMIDI running and ported via Falcosoft settings, along with [Putchzlowitz Vista?] MIDI Mapper) in order to hear the full effect of the new soundfont. Which brings me to my next topic...

2. I have noticed that when I change the current soundfont, whilst playing a MIDI file in an external player, there seems to be a sound layer missing or something? I have to restart the track in order to hear the soundfont utilized in full effect. Is there any way around this or something I'm missing that causes this to happen?

I don't think it happens when changing the soundfont and playing MIDI files 'internally' via Falcosoft MIDI Player's playlist function. Or if it does, it isn't quite as noticeable. While playing externally and changing the soundfont, it seems that the audio reverts to a sort of basic sample set. Where it sounds somewhat like the selected soundfont, but sort of dull and missing a layer of effects, reverb and chorus maybe as well. But, the soundfont volume is still apparent.

3. I haven't recreated this issue in a while (and can't recall what I was using before in place of Putzlowich's Vista MIDI Mapper...), but when I have Coolsoft Virtual MIDI Synth installed and using the portable version of Falcosoft MIDI Player, for some reason Coolsoft opens on it's own and sort of just does it's own thing while using Falcosoft. Not sure how or why this happens, but just thought I'd mention it in case anyone wants to test this to see if it's a common issue - or if it's just an issue on my end with me still using Windows 7 🤣.

Thanks so much for working on this software and providing it for use! I have a whole lot of fun using it to test different soundfonts with retro game tunes and MIDI arrangements for various music genres. As well and utilizing it for use with games in Dosbox. I can literally sit for hours playing one MIDI track at a time and changing soundfonts, adjusting levels, enjoying the changes of samples and sound. I'll check back if I spot any other minor things that catch my attention... and keep fiddling to make sure I'm not creating my own issues lmao.

Also, I stumbled on this guide a while back and have made it my go-to for setting up Falcosoft in various ways. I feel it could be a very nice guide to pin on the Falcosoft site.
Although it did pop up with a security risk for some odd reason just now.
https://www.thecrankyhermit.shoutwiki.com/wik … IDI_setup_guide

Reply 1419 of 1815, by Falcosoft

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Terrapin wrote on 2023-03-24, 19:14:
I was looking for a way to post feedback/suggestions on the Falcosoft website. I hope here works! […]
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I was looking for a way to post feedback/suggestions on the Falcosoft website. I hope here works!

This is my favorite soundfont MIDI player 😁
A few thoughts on it:

1. Would it be possible to create an additional (optional) window for soundfont selection?

I think that would make things much more user-friendly and more easily accessible for those rummaging through many soundfonts to see what sounds best with different MIDI tracks. I currently have to go into settings, browse and select a soundfont for use, then save to commit changes for the use of a different soundfont. And it seems I have to restart whatever MIDI is playing (in an external media player, with loopMIDI running and ported via Falcosoft settings, along with [Putchzlowitz Vista?] MIDI Mapper) in order to hear the full effect of the new soundfont. Which brings me to my next topic...

2. I have noticed that when I change the current soundfont, whilst playing a MIDI file in an external player, there seems to be a sound layer missing or something? I have to restart the track in order to hear the soundfont utilized in full effect. Is there any way around this or something I'm missing that causes this to happen?

I don't think it happens when changing the soundfont and playing MIDI files 'internally' via Falcosoft MIDI Player's playlist function. Or if it does, it isn't quite as noticeable. While playing externally and changing the soundfont, it seems that the audio reverts to a sort of basic sample set. Where it sounds somewhat like the selected soundfont, but sort of dull and missing a layer of effects, reverb and chorus maybe as well. But, the soundfont volume is still apparent.

3. I haven't recreated this issue in a while (and can't recall what I was using before in place of Putzlowich's Vista MIDI Mapper...), but when I have Coolsoft Virtual MIDI Synth installed and using the portable version of Falcosoft MIDI Player, for some reason Coolsoft opens on it's own and sort of just does it's own thing while using Falcosoft. Not sure how or why this happens, but just thought I'd mention it in case anyone wants to test this to see if it's a common issue - or if it's just an issue on my end with me still using Windows 7 🤣.

Thanks so much for working on this software and providing it for use! I have a whole lot of fun using it to test different soundfonts with retro game tunes and MIDI arrangements for various music genres. As well and utilizing it for use with games in Dosbox. I can literally sit for hours playing one MIDI track at a time and changing soundfonts, adjusting levels, enjoying the changes of samples and sound. I'll check back if I spot any other minor things that catch my attention... and keep fiddling to make sure I'm not creating my own issues lmao.

Also, I stumbled on this guide a while back and have made it my go-to for setting up Falcosoft in various ways. I feel it could be a very nice guide to pin on the Falcosoft site.
Although it did pop up with a security risk for some odd reason just now.
https://www.thecrankyhermit.shoutwiki.com/wik … IDI_setup_guide

Hi,
If you want to test multiple soundfonts then you should not change them this way. Adding another window could not help much since changing the soundfont stack requires the re-initialization of the Bassmidi stream. That's why you experience badly sounding Midi when you use an external player and you change soundfonts while the external player is playing through the Midi In port of FSMP . All the Midi messages that are sent to that point (program change, reverb, etc.) are lost when the Midi stream is reinitialized. So you can get missing instruments, missing reverb etc. depending at what point you change the soundfont stack. When FSMP itself plays the Midi tracks then it can re-send the messages since the Midi files are loaded and known by it. But when you send Midi messages through Midi input then FSMP cannot re-send them magically.

But the point is there is another, simply better way to test multiple soundfonts.
You can find multiple how to videos about this on my site (and also a description):

1. Make sure Midiplayer is set to use Bassmidi as output. 2. Load your default Soundfont. Default soundfont is always loaded at […]
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1. Make sure Midiplayer is set to use Bassmidi as output.
2. Load your default Soundfont. Default soundfont is always loaded at Bank 0 as base.
3. Load your additional soundfonts you wish to test to the other slots. Make sure the bank numbers are different (and below 10).
4. If you have enough RAM you can preload the soundfonts into memory for smoother transition.
5. Start playing your Midi files and switch between the different soundfonts by pressing Ctrl + the corresponding Bank number

http://falcosoft.hu/midiplayer_howto.html#a11
and also
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBhTH1Z9s4I

This way you do not have to open any new windows and more importantly you do not have to change the soundfont stack ( and this results in that the Bassmidi stream does not have to be reinitialized).
So only the used soundfont changes , nothing more.

Ps: I do not think there are any problems with FSMP+Coolsoft VMS. If FSMP is using its own internal Bassmidi mode then VMS is not involved in any way. But if you disable Bassmidi mode then FSMP uses the traditional WinMM Midi Out ports (and VMS is one of them). So if you set FSMP's Midi Out port to be VMS then that is absolutely normal that VMS opens when FSMP opens.

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