Ask in Marvin. This forum is for DOS games.

In order for any AWE based card to properly produce music in "real" mode DOS, you need to load the Aweutil utilty.
Here are some links to other topics where the same problem was discussed. Maybe you will find the answer there:
AWE64 Diagnose / AweUtil error
Issues with an AWE32?

From the top off my head, here are a couple of possible reasons:

• You have an outdated Aweutil version. Download a later version and see if it solves your problem.
• Aweutil takes up a lot of memory (about 28k). Make sure you have enough memory available.
  You can also try and load Aweutil into high memory via the LH command in your Autoexec.bat file - just make sure the statement "DOS=HIGH" is in your Config.sys file and that you have loaded Himem.sys as well.
• Aweutil requires a motherboard that supports Non Maskable Interrupts (NMI). It's possible that its either disabled in your BIOS or your motherboard doesn't support it.
  For the former, the problem is usually because the system's memory parity checking has been turned off. You can try by activating memory parity error checking in your system's BIOS setup.
• I would first try and get it to work under DOS 6.22 and then under Windows 98SE. With the latter, make sure you are in MS-DOS mode and not a DOS command prompt (DOS window) when loading these utilities.
  Under Windows 98SE MS-DOS mode, you do not require CTCU (only CTCM), since it "reads" the settings from a file called "ctpnp.cfg", which is usually saved under your C:\Windows directory. This file is updated everytime you boot into Windows, but you can make the file "read-only" to prevent Windows from updating the file (should you wish to use different settings than what is under Windows).

Hope you sort out the problem.

Only AWEUTIL /S is required, this does not consume memory.

bjt wrote:

Only AWEUTIL /S is required, this does not consume memory.

Correct, if your only desire is to play back FM synthesis under DOS.
My understanding from the OP is that he wanted General MIDI synthesis playback under DOS and to support that for Real Mode DOS games, you have to load Aweutil with the /EM:GM parameter (Protected Mode games require native support).

Moved to Marvin.

jesolo wrote:

From the top off my head, here are a couple of possible reasons:

• You have an outdated Aweutil version. Download a later version and see if it solves your problem.

I think I have the newest version but I'll try older versions later.

[*]Aweutil takes up a lot of memory (about 28k). Make sure you have enough memory available.
You can also try and load Aweutil into high memory via the LH command in your Autoexec.bat file - just make sure the statement "DOS=HIGH" is in your Config.sys file and that you have loaded Himem.sys as well.

I have about 600kb of conventional free. But I have a lot of stuff I'm high memory right now. I might try moving some stuff down to conventional just to see what happens.

[*]Aweutil requires a motherboard that supports Non Maskable Interrupts (NMI). It's possible that its either disabled in your BIOS or your motherboard doesn't support it.
For the former, the problem is usually because the system's memory parity checking has been turned off. You can try by activating memory parity error checking in your system's BIOS setup.

I think this might be the problem. The motherboard is an Asus. I don't have the model at the moment. I don't see any options for NMI or memory parity in the bios. I do see an option for level 3 cache ECC. Enabling that doesn't change anything.
If it doesn't support NM I does it make sense that the AWE32 I tried worked fine? Or does that card use a different method for GM?

[*] I would first try and get it to work under DOS 6.22 and then under Windows 98SE. With the latter, make sure you are in MS-DOS mode and not a DOS command prompt (DOS window) when loading these utilities.
Under Windows 98SE MS-DOS mode, you do not require CTCU (only CTCM), since it "reads" the settings from a file called "ctpnp.cfg", which is usually saved under your C:\Windows directory. This file is updated everytime you boot into Windows, but you can make the file "read-only" to prevent Windows from updating the file (should you wish to use different settings than what is under Windows).[/list]

Hope you sort out the problem.

Yeah I've just been focusing on the dos 6.22. I even disabled the cdrom driver. Does it matter if himem is loaded in this case? I will have to check if it's loaded.

Only other thing I can think of is to try this card in my old pentium 166 pc that has the AWE32 in it.

If I can't get this card to work is there any other sb that would work with this motherboard? Would an older SB16 work better for dos games and would it need NMI support?

K15 wrote:

[*]Aweutil requires a motherboard that supports Non Maskable Interrupts (NMI). It's possible that its either disabled in your BIOS or your motherboard doesn't support it.
For the former, the problem is usually because the system's memory parity checking has been turned off. You can try by activating memory parity error checking in your system's BIOS setup.

I think this might be the problem. The motherboard is an Asus. I don't have the model at the moment. I don't see any options for NMI or memory parity in the bios. I do see an option for level 3 cache ECC. Enabling that doesn't change anything.
If it doesn't support NMI does it make sense that the AWE32 I tried worked fine? Or does that card use a different method for GM?

Is your AWE32 an older non Plug 'n Play version or a Plug 'n Play card like the AWE64?
If a Plug 'n Play card, and your AWE32 does work on this motherboard, then your AWE64 should work as well (provided you are using the same resources on both cards - CTCU defines that under DOS 6.22).
Both the AWE32 & the AWE64 use the EMU8000 synthesis chip. So, the underlying hardware is basically the same. If one works on the same motherboard, then so should the other.
If, however, your AWE32 is not Plug 'n Play, then I think that your AWE64 problem could be a resource configuration issue. Check your BIOS settings to ensure that you haven't reserved any legacy addresses and that CTCU has assigned the correct resources. Address x620 is usually the standard address for the EMU8000 synthesizer.

K15 wrote:

Yeah I've just been focusing on the dos 6.22. I even disabled the cdrom driver. Does it matter if himem is loaded in this case? […]
Show full quote

[*] I would first try and get it to work under DOS 6.22 and then under Windows 98SE. With the latter, make sure you are in MS-DOS mode and not a DOS command prompt (DOS window) when loading these utilities.
Under Windows 98SE MS-DOS mode, you do not require CTCU (only CTCM), since it "reads" the settings from a file called "ctpnp.cfg", which is usually saved under your C:\Windows directory. This file is updated everytime you boot into Windows, but you can make the file "read-only" to prevent Windows from updating the file (should you wish to use different settings than what is under Windows).[/list]

Yeah I've just been focusing on the dos 6.22. I even disabled the cdrom driver. Does it matter if himem is loaded in this case? I will have to check if it's loaded.

Only other thing I can think of is to try this card in my old pentium 166 pc that has the AWE32 in it.

If I can't get this card to work is there any other sb that would work with this motherboard? Would an older SB16 work better for dos games and would it need NMI support?

Himem.sys must be loaded to allow programs to store data in extended memory. Without it, you will also not be able to load DOS into the High Memory Area (via the DOS=HIGH command in your Config.sys file).
EMM386.exe (by loading it as a device= command in your Config.sys file) allows you to use extended memory as expanded memory. One of its functions is to also allow you to load device drivers into the Upper Memory Blocks (via the LH command in your Autoexec.bat file).
Have a look on the internet of the different parameters that you can use with both of these.

A "standard" Sound Blaster 16 does not have the EMU8000 synthesis chip and therefore doens't require Aweutil to be loaded (and by that, also no requirement for NMI). It only has the OPL3 FM synthesis chip (or with later models Creative's CQM synthesis) and the normal digital sound playback.
Some models did, however, have a Wave Blaster connector whereby you could attach a MIDI daugtherboard that will essentially give you General MIDI synthesis - The Wave Blaster II (also produced by Creative) uses the same EMU8000 synthesis chip like the AWE32/64 and therefore sound the same in terms of General MIDI playback.

There are, however, much better external General MIDI daughterboards, but be prepared to cough up a few dollars, if you can find one. The Roland Sound Canvas (refer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roland_Sound_Canvas) and Yamaha XG (refer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_XG) derivatives are the most popular choices for games.
You can also look at a more recent daughterboard (the DreamBlaster S1) that has been produced - http://www.serdashop.com/waveblaster. There is also the X1.

Just be aware of the so called MIDI hanging note bug on some Sound Blaster 16 & AWE32 models (refer http://www.vogonswiki.com/index.php/Hanging_note_bug).

Well I did some more troubleshooting. The AWE64 does not work in the older P166 computer I have. I played with the BIOS settings a bit, no change.

AWE32 is fully functional in both PCs, the AWE64 is not.
I'm pretty sure it's hardware issue at this point. One of the chips on the board get's quite hot;

http://i.imgur.com/TVRHmwJ.jpg

I'm thinking it's responsible for routing the MIDI to the EMU8000, and is why it's not working and AWEUTIL refuses to load no matter what I do, but it loads with the AWE32 on both PCs.

jesolo wrote:

Is your AWE32 an older non Plug 'n Play version or a Plug 'n Play card like the AWE64? If a Plug 'n Play card, and your AWE32 do […]
Show full quote

Is your AWE32 an older non Plug 'n Play version or a Plug 'n Play card like the AWE64?
If a Plug 'n Play card, and your AWE32 does work on this motherboard, then your AWE64 should work as well (provided you are using the same resources on both cards - CTCU defines that under DOS 6.22).
Both the AWE32 & the AWE64 use the EMU8000 synthesis chip. So, the underlying hardware is basically the same. If one works on the same motherboard, then so should the other.
If, however, your AWE32 is not Plug 'n Play, then I think that your AWE64 problem could be a resource configuration issue. Check your BIOS settings to ensure that you haven't reserved any legacy addresses and that CTCU has assigned the correct resources. Address x620 is usually the standard address for the EMU8000 synthesizer.

The AWE32 is PnP as well. I've tried various IRQ/DMA and port settings for the AWE64.

Himem.sys must be loaded to allow programs to store data in extended memory. Without it, you will also not be able to load DOS […]
Show full quote

Himem.sys must be loaded to allow programs to store data in extended memory. Without it, you will also not be able to load DOS into the High Memory Area (via the DOS=HIGH command in your Config.sys file).
EMM386.exe (by loading it as a device= command in your Config.sys file) allows you to use extended memory as expanded memory. One of its functions is to also allow you to load device drivers into the Upper Memory Blocks (via the LH command in your Autoexec.bat file).
Have a look on the internet of the different parameters that you can use with both of these.

A "standard" Sound Blaster 16 does not have the EMU8000 synthesis chip and therefore doens't require Aweutil to be loaded (and by that, also no requirement for NMI). It only has the OPL3 FM synthesis chip (or with later models Creative's CQM synthesis) and the normal digital sound playback.
Some models did, however, have a Wave Blaster connector whereby you could attach a MIDI daugtherboard that will essentially give you General MIDI synthesis - The Wave Blaster II (also produced by Creative) uses the same EMU8000 synthesis chip like the AWE32/64 and therefore sound the same in terms of General MIDI playback.

There are, however, much better external General MIDI daughterboards, but be prepared to cough up a few dollars, if you can find one. The Roland Sound Canvas (refer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roland_Sound_Canvas) and Yamaha XG (refer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_XG) derivatives are the most popular choices for games.
You can also look at a more recent daughterboard (the DreamBlaster S1) that has been produced - http://www.serdashop.com/waveblaster. There is also the X1.

Just be aware of the so called MIDI hanging note bug on some Sound Blaster 16 & AWE32 models (refer http://www.vogonswiki.com/index.php/Hanging_note_bug).

Yeah I have himem and EMM386 all set up on my hard drive, but the DOS 6.22 boot disk I've been using only has himem. Shouldn't matter either way I'm pretty sure the card is just bad.

What bad luck. I'll look around town, hopefully I can find a cheap SB16 card.

jesolo wrote:

bjt wrote:

Only AWEUTIL /S is required, this does not consume memory.

Correct, if your only desire is to play back FM synthesis under DOS.

...or games with native AWE support.

...or use an external midi module.

I decided to just use the AWE32 I already have. I would have preferred to have both PCs with functional cards, but oh well.

I have another issue though. Most DOS games seem to work fine if I launch them from within windows 98 SE. But if I boot straight into DOS, they crash really easily (usually within 5 minutes with a freeze).

I have himem and EMM386 loaded, as well as AWEUTIL with /EM:GM.

It's not a huge issue, I can just use windows. Sometimes it's harder to keep enough conventional memory free though.

K15 wrote:

Well I did some more troubleshooting. The AWE64 does not work in the older P166 computer I have. I played with the BIOS settings […]
Show full quote

Well I did some more troubleshooting. The AWE64 does not work in the older P166 computer I have. I played with the BIOS settings a bit, no change.

AWE32 is fully functional in both PCs, the AWE64 is not.
I'm pretty sure it's hardware issue at this point. One of the chips on the board get's quite hot;

http://i.imgur.com/TVRHmwJ.jpg

erm...you may notice that this card does not have neither instrument ROM nor 512kb DRAM chip, and main chip doesn't have AWE logo, so, i think that your AWE64 is...fake 🤣 and in fact it's a plain SB16, so you won't be able to get MIDI music working, unfortunaly.

wbc wrote:

erm...you may notice that this card does not have neither instrument ROM nor 512kb DRAM chip, and main chip doesn't have AWE logo, so, i think that your AWE64 is...fake 🤣 and in fact it's a plain SB16, so you won't be able to get MIDI music working, unfortunaly.

I tend to agree with wbc. Based on the picture, despite the model number being CT4520 (as stated in the original post), this might actually be a Sound Blaster 16 WavEffects model.
Towards the end of the lifetime of the ISA range of sound cards, Creative bundled the Waveguide/Waveffects software with a standard Sound Blaster 16 sound card. So, you still got your MIDI sound, but only in Windows and only using the software based wavetable synthesis. Under DOS, you're stuck with CQM (FM) synthesis.
If you post another picture, then we can perhaps see what other chipsets are on the sound card.