Hi guys. I have both of these cards: The SB16 + NEC XR385 sounds really good, and has passed the hanging note bug test. I haven't tried the YMF719 + NEC XR385 yet.
My question is: Are there any particular advantages on using one or another? Maybe in terms of compatibility, eg. with SB Pro games?
YMF7x gets my vote.
Y2K box: AMD Athlon K75 (second generation slot A)@700, ASUS K7M motherboard, 256 MB SDRAM, ATI Radeon 7500+2xVoodoo2 in SLI, SB Live! 5.1, VIA USB 2.0 PCI card, 40 GB Seagate HDD.
WIP: external midi module based on NEC wavetable (Yamaha clone)
wrote:YMF7x gets my vote.
Why is that fillosaurus?
SbPro compatibility. Although SB16 offers 44 KHz sampling in stereo, for games that support SB16, it only outputs mono if you select SB Pro in games setup. IMO, better have 22 KHz stereo Sb Pro than double the sampling rate yet have mono sound.
Y2K box: AMD Athlon K75 (second generation slot A)@700, ASUS K7M motherboard, 256 MB SDRAM, ATI Radeon 7500+2xVoodoo2 in SLI, SB Live! 5.1, VIA USB 2.0 PCI card, 40 GB Seagate HDD.
WIP: external midi module based on NEC wavetable (Yamaha clone)
What games have:
- Stereo samples
- Don't support the SB16 directly?
- Don't support the GUS which is often the best choice for tracker based games / demos
I hear this "not compatible with SB Pro" quite often, but it's really not an issue.
On the other hand I also don't know of that many games that offer full 44 KHz sampling rate in Stereo. I thought Terminal Velocity did, but it only dies 44KHz MONO or 22KHz Stereo and that's a very late game.
@Mau1wurf1977
I think the issue here is the choice between SB16 and Yamaha SAx. For all practical purposes, I prefer Yamaha.
Y2K box: AMD Athlon K75 (second generation slot A)@700, ASUS K7M motherboard, 256 MB SDRAM, ATI Radeon 7500+2xVoodoo2 in SLI, SB Live! 5.1, VIA USB 2.0 PCI card, 40 GB Seagate HDD.
WIP: external midi module based on NEC wavetable (Yamaha clone)
wrote:@Mau1wurf1977
I think the issue here is the choice between SB16 and Yamaha SAx. For all practical purposes, I prefer Yamaha.
Yeah but what are the practical purposes? As Mau1wurf1977 said the "SB16 is not fully SB Pro compatible" thing is a non-issue, and the YMF's are not 100% compatible anyway from memory.
You have to build a cable to fit a full sized DB onto the YMF, and the YMF's DOS software sucks in my experience.
Sound Blaster all the way!
It comes down to the specific soundcard. My 2 SB16 Vibra do not have an internal DB connector. And I have a Sonata S163 Yamaha OPL3-SAx card which has a suitable placed DB connector, so I did not need to build a cable.
So far I have only 3 ISA cards with well placed connector. One is the Sonata, other 2 are Reveal SoundFX, with Opti929 chipset and Terratec Base-1 (which has the connector placed at an odd 90 degree angle, which means I cannot close the computer case).
This is why I work on my project (external MIDI module), so I can use the XR385 with all of my soundcards.
Last but not least, SB Pro compatibility REALLY is an issue to me. To name a game which has SB Pro support, but does not have SB16: Lands of Lore - Throne of chaos; And I can think of others too.
Of course, for later DOS games with SB16 support, is not a problem anymore.
Y2K box: AMD Athlon K75 (second generation slot A)@700, ASUS K7M motherboard, 256 MB SDRAM, ATI Radeon 7500+2xVoodoo2 in SLI, SB Live! 5.1, VIA USB 2.0 PCI card, 40 GB Seagate HDD.
WIP: external midi module based on NEC wavetable (Yamaha clone)
wrote:It comes down to the specific soundcard. My 2 SB16 Vibra do not have an internal DB connector. And I have a Sonata S163 Yamaha O […]
It comes down to the specific soundcard. My 2 SB16 Vibra do not have an internal DB connector. And I have a Sonata S163 Yamaha OPL3-SAx card which has a suitable placed DB connector, so I did not need to build a cable.
So far I have only 3 ISA cards with well placed connector. One is the Sonata, other 2 are Reveal SoundFX, with Opti929 chipset and Terratec Base-1 (which has the connector placed at an odd 90 degree angle, which means I cannot close the computer case).
This is why I work on my project (external MIDI module), so I can use the XR385 with all of my soundcards.Last but not least, SB Pro compatibility REALLY is an issue to me. To name a game which has SB Pro support, but does not have SB16: Lands of Lore - Throne of chaos; And I can think of others too.
Of course, for later DOS games with SB16 support, is not a problem anymore.
What about having both the SB16 + DB50XG/XR385 setup and an Older Soundblaster 2.0/Pro for games that need it?
wrote:SB Pro compatibility REALLY is an issue to me. To name a game which has SB Pro support, but does not have SB16: Lands of Lore - Throne of chaos; And I can think of others too.
Luckily the game was on EA sale and I picked it up from GOG.com together with heaps of other EA classics.
One thing I wonder is: When you say "SB Pro support". Could you define this?
While the SETUP utility does indeed only offer Sound Blaster, Sound Blaster Pro and Gold Standard (??? Adlib Gold ???) and no Sound Blaster 16, all the PCM samples I can hear are mono. Which is exactly my point.
The Sound Blaster 16 came out in 1992 and there are basically no games that had Stereo PCM samples for the Sound Blaster Pro...
YMF719 sounds a hell of a lot cleaner than any SB16 I've ever heard...with the exception of maybe the AWE64...which has no internal DB connector. My vote goes for the YMF-719. I don't know which games are incompatible with the YMF-719, but surely they must be few and far between. Just for the record, there were numerous times I couldn't even get PCM sound going on a real SB card.
"Will the highways on the internets become more few?" -Gee Dubya
V'Ger XT|Upgraded AT|Ultimate 386|Super VL/EISA 486|SMP VL/EISA Pentium
EA? Maybe they own the copyright now, but that game is a Westwood classic.
Y2K box: AMD Athlon K75 (second generation slot A)@700, ASUS K7M motherboard, 256 MB SDRAM, ATI Radeon 7500+2xVoodoo2 in SLI, SB Live! 5.1, VIA USB 2.0 PCI card, 40 GB Seagate HDD.
WIP: external midi module based on NEC wavetable (Yamaha clone)
wrote:EA? Maybe they own the copyright now, but that game is a Westwood classic.
Yea it was on sale with all the other EA games. Got every single DOS game they had on offer. I then burn the discs and install it on my MS-DOS Time-Machine.
Coming back to the Sound Blaster Pro 2. Just want to be sure that people understand that the Sound Blaster 16 if fully compatible as far as FM music is concerned (to the SB Pro 2). Stereo and all of that.
It's Stereo PCM that the Sound Blaster 16 will only play as Mono. With the Sound Blaster 16 being released in 1992, find me a game that uses Stereo PCM for the Sound Blaster Pro and doesn't have support for the Sound Blaster 16. I believe I made a thread about this once and I got no replies...
The main worry I have is that this "it's not compatible with the Sound Blaster Pro" is being brought up again and again, yet people misunderstand the meaning of it and don't realize that the practical examples don't really exist.
wrote:Just for the record, there were numerous times I couldn't even get PCM sound going on a real SB card.
There could be a ton of reasons for this like a resource conflict, CPU too fast, wrongly configured game, corrupt files. If you are sure that this can be ruled out, maybe open a new thread with specific examples and we can investigate these behaviours in more detail.
@Pingaloka
Buddy, I suggest you try the Yamaha. You said you already tested the SB16. Then decide which card will you use. Everybody has an opinion, the one that matters most is your own. If you like Yamaha, then use it. If you like more the SB16, then use it.
Y2K box: AMD Athlon K75 (second generation slot A)@700, ASUS K7M motherboard, 256 MB SDRAM, ATI Radeon 7500+2xVoodoo2 in SLI, SB Live! 5.1, VIA USB 2.0 PCI card, 40 GB Seagate HDD.
WIP: external midi module based on NEC wavetable (Yamaha clone)
wrote:@Pingaloka
Buddy, I suggest you try the Yamaha. You said you already tested the SB16. Then decide which card will you use. Everybody has an opinion, the one that matters most is your own. If you like Yamaha, then use it. If you like more the SB16, then use it.
Yes, absolutely right fillosaurus.
I really like Sound Blaster in terms of functionality and hardware wise. Before getting the 486 I now have, I bought the Yamaha Sound Card because I was not expecting a nice sound card with the computer. But I got the Sound Blaster Ct2230 with no hanging note and the XR385 fitted perfectly. So the yamaha is waiting inside the closet. I've even made the ribbon cable so it fits the daughter card. But just haven't tried it yet. I guess I'm afraid that it sounds better than the Sound Blaster 16, I don't want to get rid of it! 🤣
But sure, I'll try it in a near future and compare both of them
I'm waiting to get a cable for the Mt-32 so I have more material even to compare.
wrote:Coming back to the Sound Blaster Pro. Just want to be sure that people understand that the Sound Blaster 16 if fully compatible as far as FM music is concerned. Stereo and all of that.
This statement is only half true, being applicable just to the Sound Blaster Pro 2. Games expecting the dual-OPL2 configuration of a Sound Blaster Pro 1 are not going to provide stereo FM playback with an SB16.
wrote:This statement is only half true, being applicable just to the Sound Blaster Pro 2. Games expecting the dual-OPL2 configuration of a Sound Blaster Pro 1 are not going to provide stereo FM playback with an SB16.
Well yes, but neither will be any other "SB Pro compatible card". Or any other card at all for that matter?
But yes, I always forget about the first SB Pro 😀
wrote:This statement is only half true, being applicable just to the Sound Blaster Pro 2. Games expecting the dual-OPL2 configuration of a Sound Blaster Pro 1 are not going to provide stereo FM playback with an SB16.
Well yes, but neither will be any other "SB Pro compatible card". Or any other card at all for that matter? Is there any SB Pro dual OPL2 clone / compatible card?
But yes, I always forget about the first SB Pro 😀
