Doornkaat wrote on 2022-03-19, 13:36:

Oh man, I wish I'd never asked. I like that look so much I got to figure out how to get some back cover for mine.

If you find somebody with a big enough 3D printer I could take some measurements for you 🤔 But that seems kind of excessive....

On another note I got some upgrades planned and parts are on the way:

• I figured I shouldn't let that Voodoo card sit at ~50°C or more all the time and ordered a fan controller and some silent fans
• I thought (and read) a lot about a second sound card for Windows and settled on a Terratec DMX xFire 1024 because they are really cheap, supposed to be of good quality and should provide compatibility with almost all 3D audio games up to Win98
• I will replace the spinning hard drive with a mSATA drive from an old notebook, with the help of a cascade of adapters 🥳

In case you were wondering i also *did* play some games on this machine.
On DOS I've been switching between Prince of Persia 2 (on Level 7 atm) and Ultima Underworld (explored most of Level 1). On Windows 95 I either play Magic The Gathering or Chessmaster 6000.

That's a very nice offer but I don't think I'll find somebody with a 3D printer that large.
I guess I'll have to find some other approach.
Since my case isn't in the best condition I might mod it a bit so it'd require another cover anyway.
We'll see!😃

OMG, that case gives me the most awkward erection. The goofy teenager doing a book report in front of class kind.

To address the 3d printer thing, you can always cut the part up into sections and glue them together. With a bit of practice and patience, it will look awesome.

GrafWasili wrote on 2022-03-09, 09:03:

Finally I came across a good deal for an old server case. Was it too big? Maybe.... But it had swinging doors, two 3.5" external drive bays, eight 5.25" external drive bays, lots of non-blue LEDs, an important looking lock mechanism and *wheels*!

Nice case! I have a dual Coppermine BX system that is disgustingly fast running NT 3.5, NT 4, and Solaris. A cube like that would be the right amount of sexy to go with it.

Update time!

Part 1:
Introducing the Front Panel mSATA SSD Holder

I found this nice hard disk bay adapter with front panel and with some more adapters I now have a SSD attached to the Ultra133 IDE controller. The front panel also has a red LED but none of the adapters used have a built-in connector for one. Another detail to take care of at a later time...

In case you didn't know I do love adapters and my true purpose is collecting all of them! (if there isn't already a dedicated adapter appreciation thread on vogons there should be one...)

That case is awesome.
I remembered it instantly when I came across this beast:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/PC-Gehaeuse-Server-Al … D-/203883599933

Pretty much the same machine, I guess.

I was very much tempted but anything beyond 50 is out of my craziness, sadly.
Working on it 😜

Part 2:
The Sound of the Future

So after chinny22 recommended installing a second sound card I tried to find may way through the jungle that is hardware accelerated 3D audio. Since this machine is trying to be a jack of all trades anyway I looked into Sensaura based cards which implement EAX as well as A3D at least up to a certain revision.

When I discovered the Terratec DMX Xfire 1024 with its huge list of features and its very low market price the decision was easy.

What was not so easy was making it play along nice with the SB16 on Windows 95. After my first foolish attempts, trying to install drivers from an image of the retail driver CD, I ended up with two sound cards not working.

For future reference here's what worked for me:
- starting point: both cards in their slot, but removed in Windows Hardware Manager, Xfire drivers not installed/uninstalled, skip installing new hardware after boot
- setting IRQ and DMAs for Soundblaster to reserved/legacy in BIOS
- unpacking drivers for Xfire from their website: http://terratec.ultron.info/Audio/DMXXfire/Up … .06.00.2885.exe (nice move to still have drivers available after 20 years)
- start hardware discovery via Control Panel -> Add Hardware and point to directory with unpacked drivers
- disable Xfire Game Device (that's the cards OPL/SB emulation) in Hardware Manager, manually set IRQ and DMA for Sound Blaster in Hardware Manager

After another reboot and with a patch cable running from the SB16 line out to the Xfire line in + unmuting the Xfire line in in the mixer I got the setup I was aiming for - at least in Win95.

I still need to check out how far DOS support goes. It would be nice to use it for mixing CD audio with the line in from the SB16, so there won't be any need for repatching audio when switching from Windows. It also has two connectors for CD audio, so there wouldn't be any need for an additional mixer when using multiple optical drives. Thinking of it, it also has digital audio connectors, have to try these out as well...

The Xfire also adds another Waveblaster header but it's known to not work under DOS, so I'm not sure what card I would add there...

EDIT: Oh, I almost forgot: The Xfire has internal headers for all external in and outs, which means more front panel action 🥳

Cuttoon wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:02:

Pretty much the same machine, I guess.

Yeah definitely the same case but sold by a different company ("Artist"?).

Actually a nice bundle having that tape drive, funky dual power supply and some useful cards... Must be the reason people are bidding for it. Mine was from ebay, too, but went pretty much unnoticed.

GrafWasili wrote on 2022-04-06, 22:10:

Part 2: The Sound of the Future […]
Show full quote

Part 2:
The Sound of the Future

So after chinny22 recommended installing a second sound card I tried to find may way through the jungle that is hardware accelerated 3D audio. Since this machine is trying to be a jack of all trades anyway I looked into Sensaura based cards which implement EAX as well as A3D at least up to a certain revision.

When I discovered the Terratec DMX Xfire 1024 with its huge list of features and its very low market price the decision was easy.

xfire1.jpg

What was not so easy was making it play along nice with the SB16 on Windows 95. After my first foolish attempts, trying to install drivers from an image of the retail driver CD, I ended up with two sound cards not working.

For future reference here's what worked for me:
- starting point: both cards in their slot, but removed in Windows Hardware Manager, Xfire drivers not installed/uninstalled, skip installing new hardware after boot
- setting IRQ and DMAs for Soundblaster to reserved/legacy in BIOS
- unpacking drivers for Xfire from their website: http://terratec.ultron.info/Audio/DMXXfire/Up … .06.00.2885.exe (nice move to still have drivers available after 20 years)
- start hardware discovery via Control Panel -> Add Hardware and point to directory with unpacked drivers
- disable Xfire Game Device (that's the cards OPL/SB emulation) in Hardware Manager, manually set IRQ and DMA for Sound Blaster in Hardware Manager

After another reboot and with a patch cable running from the SB16 line out to the Xfire line in + unmuting the Xfire line in in the mixer I got the setup I was aiming for - at least in Win95.

xfire2_2.jpg
xfire3_2.jpg

I still need to check out how far DOS support goes. It would be nice to use it for mixing CD audio with the line in from the SB16, so there won't be any need for repatching audio when switching from Windows. It also has two connectors for CD audio, so there wouldn't be any need for an additional mixer when using multiple optical drives. Thinking of it, it also has digital audio connectors, have to try these out as well...

The Xfire also adds another Waveblaster header but it's known to not work under DOS, so I'm not sure what card I would add there...

EDIT: Oh, I almost forgot: The Xfire has internal headers for all external in and outs, which means more front panel action 🥳

I used to own the DMX Xfire 1024 when it was new and still do.
(Think atm it's slaving away in my dad's "E-Mail and windows card games" Athlon XP rig. Even for a half-deaf fossil who would never notice, shitty onboard sound seemed beneath us...)

Well, back then, I also fell for its "huge list of features".
Yes, it will somehow reproduce both A3D and EAX which was great back then.

But, at least for EAX, don't expect it to be too much of "hardware accelerated 3D audio".
Maybe I was just young and stupid back then. But IIRC, on a 900 (or later 1400?) MHz Athlon TB, there was a noticeable performance gap with the 2003 game Vietcong between the Terratec and an later acquired SB Live when using EAX.
Guess with EAX, the retail SB Live for its time was hard to beat.

So, the Xfire 1024 is great in many respects, but maybe do the EAX comparison with an SB Live some time - did not buy one of those for quite some time, but as numerous as those are, can't be too rare as well.

Thanks for the walkthrough in installations - may come in handy some time, if I insist on using midi with a SB16.
The ESS solo PCI cards are less advanced, but everywhere (including half a dozen on the heap) and might be a good combination. Probably the same drill with windows.

No experience with the Terratec in DOS back then. Maybe some DOOM in the win95 box, that must have worked.

There also was a simply "DMX" card with ESS Canyon 3D chip, but no idea whether that was any good.

GrafWasili wrote on 2022-04-06, 22:33:

Cuttoon wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:02:

Pretty much the same machine, I guess.

Yeah definitely the same case but sold by a different company ("Artist"?).

Fun fact, while there was a German OEM brand "Artist", as I recently found out, the "Artist Server" was merely a product line of German b2b OEM Maxdata.
Btw., they also had 19" rack editions.
https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/m … 450556-228-3522
20 € is nothing, but it looks heavy AF. Should I go get it?

GrafWasili wrote on 2022-04-06, 22:33:

Actually a nice bundle having that tape drive, funky dual power supply and some useful cards... Must be the reason people are bidding for it. Mine was from ebay, too, but went pretty much unnoticed.

It's great, especially the funky dual power supply would have made my day.
Sometimes it's the category (he actually sold it as a case), sometimes it's timing, description or just dumb luck.
I was hoping for a (really) cheap catch because of the immense shipping costs - I had cleared with the seller that he'd use a different carrier for much less.
But anything below a hundred is still a steal in today's market for any somewhat more qualified PII system. You can spend that much on a motherboard alone.

GrafWasili wrote on 2022-04-06, 20:25:

Update time! […]
Show full quote

Update time!

Part 1:
Introducing the Front Panel mSATA SSD Holder

I found this nice hard disk bay adapter with front panel and with some more adapters I now have a SSD attached to the Ultra133 IDE controller. The front panel also has a red LED but none of the adapters used have a built-in connector for one. Another detail to take care of at a later time...

ssd3.jpg
ssd1.jpg

In case you didn't know I do love adapters and my true purpose is collecting all of them! (if there isn't already a dedicated adapter appreciation thread on vogons there should be one...)

Is that an M2 SSD in a 2.5" interposer in a 3.5" adapter, mounted in a 5.25" bay? Wow, starting to see that you mean business about loving adapters! 🤣

Man I hate adapters and try to keep things as native as possible, maybe we should meet up and I'll take say any DVI to DP cables you have and I'll give you the plastic adapters instead 😉

Looking at the spec sheet the Xfire does A3D .10 and EAX 2 which makes scene as that's where the open standard ends.
Basically for A3D 2.0 you need a Aureal card and EAX 3 or greater a Creative card (a few exceptions do exist)

You can go with a SBLive and have EAX3 and A3D 1.0 but people say the A3D side of things is no where as good as anything from Aureal
or go the other was and get a Vortex 2 for A3D 2,0 and EAX 1 and suspect it's the same story, great A3D average EAX

What the Xfire does have that the other cards don't is been a little different which is part of this builds charm, I'd be reluctant to swap it unless the currant card stops you doing something you want to do.

oops it's already been a year and no updates... Logged in for a question and thought I might as well reply to some old reactions here.

Also Updates will be coming at some point, I did some more shopping and tinkering since then and documented everything photographically.

In fact I'm in the process of having additional drive rails 3D printed right now because those are nowhere else to be found and I will hopefully be able to share the files on here.

Cuttoon wrote on 2022-04-06, 22:40:

I used to own the DMX Xfire 1024 when it was new and still do. (Think atm it's slaving away in my dad's "E-Mail and windows card […]
Show full quote

I used to own the DMX Xfire 1024 when it was new and still do.
(Think atm it's slaving away in my dad's "E-Mail and windows card games" Athlon XP rig. Even for a half-deaf fossil who would never notice, shitty onboard sound seemed beneath us...)

Well, back then, I also fell for its "huge list of features".
Yes, it will somehow reproduce both A3D and EAX which was great back then.
But, at least for EAX, don't expect it to be too much of "hardware accelerated 3D audio".
Maybe I was just young and stupid back then. But IIRC, on a 900 (or later 1400?) MHz Athlon TB, there was a noticeable performance gap with the 2003 game Vietcong between the Terratec and an later acquired SB Live when using EAX.
Guess with EAX, the retail SB Live for its time was hard to beat.

So, the Xfire 1024 is great in many respects, but maybe do the EAX comparison with an SB Live some time - did not buy one of those for quite some time, but as numerous as those are, can't be too rare as well.

Thanks for sharing your experiences! At some point I will test out Half Life and Thief with this card, let's see... In the meantime it served me well for the rather undemanding Windows 95 games I played.

H3nrik V! wrote on 2022-04-07, 05:05:

Is that an M2 SSD in a 2.5" interposer in a 3.5" adapter, mounted in a 5.25" bay? Wow, starting to see that you mean business about loving adapters! 🤣

Not quite correct. It's a mini-PCI SSD and there's also a 40 pin to 44 pin IDE adapter attached! 😜

chinny22 wrote on 2022-04-07, 08:40:

Man I hate adapters and try to keep things as native as possible, maybe we should meet up and I'll take say any DVI to DP cables you have and I'll give you the plastic adapters instead 😉

This is of cause not possible because I do not own any such cables! I simply have no need for them because I own every possible video adapter and converter..

chinny22 wrote on 2022-04-07, 08:40:

Looking at the spec sheet the Xfire does A3D .10 and EAX 2 which makes scene as that's where the open standard ends. Basically f […]
Show full quote

Looking at the spec sheet the Xfire does A3D .10 and EAX 2 which makes scene as that's where the open standard ends.
Basically for A3D 2.0 you need a Aureal card and EAX 3 or greater a Creative card (a few exceptions do exist)

You can go with a SBLive and have EAX3 and A3D 1.0 but people say the A3D side of things is no where as good as anything from Aureal
or go the other was and get a Vortex 2 for A3D 2,0 and EAX 1 and suspect it's the same story, great A3D average EAX

Thanks for this concise summary!