VOGONS


First post, by GabrielKnight123

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I have a ZyMos Poach 51 with 512kb vram this card is a high resolution video card but can it use vesa? If it can is there a driver to enable vesa because MSD and hwinfo say it's not installed/not present I've read this card is a clone of a Trident TVGA 8800 but I can't find much info on it. It does run at 720x400 it's just that it doesn't display some high resolution games like Gabriel knight 1 has BIG icons and the start of the game with Gabriel's face is a lower resolution maybe it's the switch block with 5 toggles not set correctly but I can't find a manual for it

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Reply 1 of 11, by Tiido

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That is a plain VGA card with 256KB of VRAM on it (32Kbytes per chip). This is not going to do any high resolution VESA modes.

EDIT: I cannot math today, memory chips do suggest 512KB. Maybe there is support for somethign bigger although if there's anything that can give in VESA support I don't know.
I have been trying to find some info and it seems that the extra memory goes to do only some high resolution 16 color modes for Windows with correct drivers.

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Reply 2 of 11, by Grzyb

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You can try Trident drivers, see eg. - https://www.sac.sk/download/graph/vesadrvs.zip
UniVBE may also work.

But indeed, don't expect too much...
16-color SVGA modes are likely to work: 800 x 600 (non-interlaced), 1024 x 768 (interlaced, pretty much useless)
256-color SVGA modes, however, are unlikely to work with normal VGA/SVGA monitors:

The Trident 8800 chips have a problem with 256 color modes, as they always double
the pixels output in 256 color mode. Thus a 640x400 256 color mode (5Ch) actually
uses a 1280x400 frame, requiring at least a multi sync monitor.
This problem is fixed on the 8900.

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Reply 3 of 11, by clb

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I've got a graphics card with that exact same ZyMOS Poach 51 AA chip:

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Mine came with 256KB of DRAM:

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but I dropped in an extra set of 256KB of RAM chips, and it did automatically detect it and upgrade to 512KB:

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The ZyMOS Poach 51 AA is some kind of a clone of a Trident 8800CS. That is, it identifies as a Trident 8800CS graphics chip and behaves like one. UniVBE does not support this card:

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Video BIOS finds the following strings:

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I'll post more findings in next comment due to forum 5 images limit per post.

Reply 4 of 11, by clb

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Even though there is no VESA support, manually enumerating the SVGA video mode numbers space, there are some remotely interesting video modes that this card does support:

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These include nice SVGA text modes for word processing, up to 132x60 characters:

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132x60 text mode support is a bit rare, I find only Trident, Realtek (Avance Logic) and Matrox Millennium adapters have it.

Nonstandard graphics mode support includes 640x400 70Hz 16 colors:

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640x400 66Hz 256 colors:

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800x600 56Hz 16 colors:

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Reply 5 of 11, by clb

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640x480 55Hz 256 colors:

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800x600 77Hz interlaced 256 colors:

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960x720 89Hz interlaced 16 colors:

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1024x768 85Hz interlaced 16 colors:

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1280x640 85Hz interlaced 16 colors:

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Reply 6 of 11, by clb

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and finally a couple of really quirky video modes:

504x515 pixels 54Hz 256 colors:

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720x540 55Hz 16 colors:

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768x540 91Hz interlaced 256 colors:

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Reply 7 of 11, by clb

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This card has that SVGA scrolling compatibility bug (no memory wraparound in VGA after 256KB mark) , so Commander Keen needs SVGA Compatibility enabled, or half of the screen goes missing:

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Maybe the biggest downside for many old DOS games is that the adapter is quite slow to run many games, e.g. Wiering's Mario and Jazz Jackrabbit are unplayable, and it is too slow for many demo timings, here Kukoo 2 demo glitches pretty badly:

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However, the card does still carry the EGA sized fonts so Sim City works and is playable without a TSR fix:

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In Windows 3.1, the built-in 800x600 SVGA driver should work since SVGA modes 5Bh and 6Ah are 800x600 56Hz 16c. Using Trident 8800CS drivers, I was able to get that 1024x768 86Hz interlaced 16 colors mode to work:

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Overall, a VESA driver might be able to be set up to advertise the video mode initialization some of these custom 640x400, 640x480, 800x600, 1024x768 16 and 256 colors video mode capabilities, but I don't know either if anyone might have developed such a driver. If there is a VESA driver for Trident 8800CS somewhere, that should work.

In the Trident_TVGA_8800_and_8900.rar package (from Vogonsdrivers iirc) I could find only a bunch of manual application-specific drivers, i.e.

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but no VESA driver.

Reply 8 of 11, by clb

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Oh, I see Grzyb's linked zip has Trident VESA drivers.

Gave that a spin with the ZyMOS Poach 51 AA card, but unfortunately it does not like my card at least, and errors out with

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Darn, I wonder if GabrielKnight123's card might have better luck?

Reply 9 of 11, by Grzyb

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clb wrote on 2024-08-24, 11:04:

The ZyMOS Poach 51 AA is some kind of a clone of a Trident 8800CS. That is, it identifies as a Trident 8800CS graphics chip and behaves like one.

According to "Advanced Programmer’s Guide to SuperVGAs", it's second-source of 8800CS.

UniVBE does not support this card

A version from 2002 may be too new for that card.
Try UniVBE 5.x, or even 4.x.

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Reply 10 of 11, by Grzyb

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clb wrote on 2024-08-24, 11:09:

132x60 text mode support is a bit rare, I find only Trident, Realtek (Avance Logic) and Matrox Millennium adapters have it.

OTI067 does support it.
Also OTI037C, but it needs 40 MHz pixel clock - some cards have the appropriate crystal, some don't.

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Reply 11 of 11, by Grzyb

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clb wrote on 2024-08-24, 11:04:

I've got a graphics card with that exact same ZyMOS Poach 51 AA chip:

I've found some "ZyVGA-16" diskettes.
If you still have that ZyMOS card up and ready, please try the SETVID.EXE utility - I'm interested if the CGA and Hercules emulation modes work at normal VGA frequencies.

I tried the utilities with my TVGA 8800CS card, but no luck - they complain about wrong BIOS.

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