ElectroSoldier wrote on 2024-10-05, 10:12:

512k sectors
16k clusters

Allocation unit size should be set to 512

unfortunately setting the Allocation myself to 512 made it so XP wasn't even able to OPEN the file in 7zip. Got the popup to run Chkdsk >_>

Oh wow!

Maybe thats the reason why Im having the problems Im having with my own Windows 98 project at the minute.

Its an interesting problem Ive never actually come across it myself...
I always go the other way, from XP to 98, not from 98 to XP.

I don't think this is a problem with for formatting, it's a problem with the partition table. Probably it is using a different number of cylinders/heads/sectors than what the OS thinks the drive has.
Also looking at this picture shows the entire drive is covered by an extended partition - that's unnecessary for a drive that only has one partition.

If you still have the partition formatted with allocation (cluster) size 512,
could you copy a large text file onto the drive in win98, and then copy it back from within XP to a second file, so we can compare the two.

meh

with mention of the extended partition present, while "unnecessary" it can resolve some issues using microsoft OSs, and at the same time cause others 😀
When I asked to "Clear the 120GB drive of all partitions" (and then reboot) etc...
Did you do this ?

use fdisk from the Windows ME start up floppy disk, it has the updated version of fdisk.

I was thinking of a format command something along the lines of this
format C: /fs:fat32 /a:4096

That would give a FAT32 format with a cluster size you need.

I could be wrong on this, this might not work at all, but I think your doing the right things in the wrong way.
You want to partition the entire 120Gb disk with a single partition and make it active, then format the disk "C" with the command above if using the boot floppy, if using guiformat then use that instead. but I would use an ME start up disk.

jmarsh wrote on 2024-10-05, 19:43:

I don't think this is a problem with for formatting, it's a problem with the partition table. Probably it is using a different number of cylinders/heads/sectors than what the OS thinks the drive has.
Also looking at this picture shows the entire drive is covered by an extended partition - that's unnecessary for a drive that only has one partition.

Yes I chose to use an Extended Partition for the drive because it's not my primary or boot drive, and I wanted to make that blantently clear to the computer and BIOS to not attempt to boot from it. I made the Extended Partition in Win98 FDISK. But I've been doing all the format testing we've been talking about in WinXP. Maybe I should delete it all and have XP make the partition AND format it.

This is the setup of my Win98SE/WinXP machine. I'm trying to understand why this seems to be an issue as I have no problems with WinXP utilizing any of my FAT32 drives. Here is what my storage setup looks like:

This machine started out as Win98SE then I added XP to it. This was planned, and I set all the FAT32 partitions up with 98SE, then when installing XP I let XP handle the NTFS partitions. Still don't know what this problem is about. The only rule I have is dont go over 120GB for FAT32 partitions.

Shagittarius wrote on 2024-10-06, 17:10:

This is the setup of my Win98SE/WinXP machine. I'm trying to understand why this seems to be an issue as I have no problems with WinXP utilizing any of my FAT32 drives. Here is what my storage setup looks like:

The attachment Drive_Setup.JPG is no longer available

This machine started out as Win98SE then I added XP to it. This was planned, and I set all the FAT32 partitions up with 98SE, then when installing XP I let XP handle the NTFS partitions. Still don't know what this problem is about. The only rule I have is dont go over 120GB for FAT32 partitions.

I completely agree. I have zero idea what the HELL is going on with my system. And on a motherboard with Intel 815 Chipset too!
What is your hardware specs?

ThruMy4Eyes wrote on 2024-10-06, 17:25:

I completely agree. I have zero idea what the HELL is going on with my system. And on a motherboard with Intel 815 Chipset too!
What is your hardware specs?

I'm running on that machine:

AsRock 775Dual-VSTA
Xeon 3230
2GB Memory (Limited to 512MB in 98SE)
Radeon 9800PRo
Voodoo2 12MB
SB AudioPCI

So quick update: I just tried what I thought would be fool-proof way for it to work:
Wiped everything out of the 120GB using Disk Management in WinXP. Then rebooted and I used Win98 FDISK, made an Extended Partition covering just 30GB of the 120GB drive. Then made a 30GB Logical Drive inside that partition. Booted into Win98 GUI and formatted it (just because DOS format is so slow). Copied over the Descent folder and file to the 30GB partition. Verified it copied over fine with 7zip, tested OK. Rebooted into WinXP and it still reports as not being a valid file.

Here is an alternate question!
What is the chance my BIOS is not fully compatible with this PARTICULAR 120GB drive? -- I know that ~120GB ceiling was a common BIOS limit back then. I confirmed this idea by trying to use a 200GB IDE drive with this computer. The 200GB showed the typical signs: being picked up by the BIOS, but total size being detected incorrectly. And naturally the data corruption that comes with trying to use it as such. -- Meanwhile this current 120GB drive is detected correctly in the BIOS, so I just assumed it should all be fine.

I do have a spare 80GB drive - I might just throw it in quickly as a last resort to see if it will work.

Shagittarius wrote on 2024-10-06, 17:40:

I'm running on that machine: […]
Show full quote

I'm running on that machine:

AsRock 775Dual-VSTA
Xeon 3230
2GB Memory (Limited to 512MB in 98SE)
Radeon 9800PRo
Voodoo2 12MB
SB AudioPCI

DUDEEE i used to have the DUAL-VSTA board back in the day too! Definitely one board i should've never (as a whole machine) gotten rid of in donation. Solid as heck, let me overclock my E4300, and keep using my AGP card and IDE drives 😀

ThruMy4Eyes wrote on 2024-10-06, 19:17:

What is the chance my BIOS is not fully compatible with this PARTICULAR 120GB drive?

Irrelevant because windows XP doesn't access the drive via the BIOS.

ElectroSoldier wrote on 2024-10-05, 01:39:

No Soggi.
WinXP can only natively create a 32Gb FAT32 partition.

weedeewee didn't say something different from "natively" - so I had to guess exactly that.

--------------------

@ThruMy4Eyes:
I was really, really convinced that you've got the same issue I've got back then... But I have to accept yours is different in some way. Sorry for that!

Some points I have in mind:
- the board has the latest BIOS (P21)
- 7Zip versions on Win98/XP are identical (9.20 f.e.)
- latest drivers for every part is installed
- install Win98/XP on different drives on the primary partition (like I did back then, and don't go above 32 GiB per FAT32 partition)

ThruMy4Eyes wrote on 2024-10-06, 19:17:

I do have a spare 80GB drive - I might just throw it in quickly as a last resort to see if it will work.

Why not? Just try it!

Hopefully I didn't forget or overread something!?

kind regards
soggi

ThruMy4Eyes wrote on 2024-10-06, 19:17:

So quick update: I just tried what I thought would be fool-proof way for it to work:
Wiped everything out of the 120GB using Disk Management in WinXP. Then rebooted and I used Win98 FDISK, made an Extended Partition covering just 30GB of the 120GB drive. Then made a 30GB Logical Drive inside that partition. Booted into Win98 GUI and formatted it (just because DOS format is so slow).

I agree with Soggi and Shagittarius, never had an issue adding HD's with 98SE and XP - maybe part of the problem is you using a XP VLK version not retail XP Sp3 ???
Under XP make a Primary less than 32GB FAT32 partition on the 120GB, then make the rest an Extended and leave it alone for now. Format the Primary and test it.
I saw you said you didn't want the computer to try and boot from the 120Gb but it will not unless you change the BIOS boot order and force it to try...specially since the C drive is already set as boot by BIOS, Win98 and XP....
the Partition table on the 120Gb will not have it's primary as C, as it's designator even if you move it to a diff computer (been thru that so many times when moving drives to diff computers already with an OS on boot HD)...

Is xp updated?
Windowsupdaterestored.com
Bios version?

Some points I have in mind:
- the board has the latest BIOS (P21)
- 7Zip versions on Win98/XP are identical (9.20 f.e.)
- latest drivers for every part is installed
- install Win98/XP on different drives on the primary partition (like I did back then, and don't go above 32 GiB per FAT32 partition)
soggi
[/quote]

--yes the board has the latest BIOS, I did that back when I bought the system (motherboard / CPU / RAM for$4 off Craigslist in 2019, 🤣!)
--7zip is the last version 98 supports, and 7zip is the current version because it still supports XP. I thought that might have something to do with it - but the fact other files aren't readable as well points to not a 7zip problem. Also tried using WinZip with the same results JUST to try it.
--Yes I made sure to install the Intel Chipset drivers in both 98 and XP.
--I'm going to skip trying to OS install on separate drives. I'd really prefer to just keep all my OSes on one drive, games on another.

BUT WAIT, there's more! Look at my next updates...

Horun wrote on 2024-10-07, 02:57:

I agree with Soggi and Shagittarius, never had an issue adding HD's with 98SE and XP - maybe part of the problem is you using a […]
Show full quote

I agree with Soggi and Shagittarius, never had an issue adding HD's with 98SE and XP - maybe part of the problem is you using a XP VLK version not retail XP Sp3 ???
Under XP make a Primary less than 32GB FAT32 partition on the 120GB, then make the rest an Extended and leave it alone for now. Format the Primary and test it.
I saw you said you didn't want the computer to try and boot from the 120Gb but it will not unless you change the BIOS boot order and force it to try...specially since the C drive is already set as boot by BIOS, Win98 and XP....
the Partition table on the 120Gb will not have it's primary as C, as it's designator even if you move it to a diff computer (been thru that so many times when moving drives to diff computers already with an OS on boot HD)...

--I have done many different methods of partition and formatting a small 30GB partition on this 120GB drive ; be it Primary, Extended, all done in 98 or XP, and it gives the same result unfortunately.
--As for XP being VLK, that just has to do with how this particular flavor of XP is activated - which the VLK versions dont need activation at all; they just use a normal product key and nothing else ; no online or phone activation ever. I've been using this exact same ISO for XP since,,, gosh i dont know, somewhere in the mid 2000's. I can asure you it has been installed on countless computers and is 100% functional and legit working.

swapped out the 120GB Samsung for an 80GB Seagate. Went through the same steps - cleared all partitions. In WinXP, i made an Extended Partition taking up the whole drive, and then a Logical Drive taking up the whole drive. Rebooted in Win98 and formatted the drive. Copied Descent and other files over to it. Rebooted in WinXP and

IT READ ALL THE DAMN FILES JUST FINE!!
I think all my pictures uploaded will be in backwards order. Next post is the crazy double-check of myself.

So to make sure I wasn't bat-shit crazy, I put the 120GB back in the system.
Went through the same steps of partitioning in WinXP, rebooting Win98 and formatting, copying files over in Win98, rebooting in WinXP, and files weren't readable again.

What I dont understand:
I was previously using this 120GB drive as the primary drive in this computer.
The BIOS detects it with no size problems.
I've installed Win98 to it all alone with no reading issues.
I've installed WinXP to it all alone with no reading issues.

Is this some sort of 1-in-a-million setup voodoo where these two components in this particular software setup just wont play friendly? Lord it makes no sense.
I wish I had another 120GB drive to put a nail in the coffin to determine if it is size that was the issue for my setup (120GB), or just particular branding (Samsung)...?
I'd like to thank everyone for all their suggestions! The 32GB limit on FAT32 seems like it would've been completely valid and a fail-safe solution. So that was all the more frustrating when that wouldn't even get the 120GB to play nicely...

Pictures again uploaded in backwards order. Man this is such a weird glitch in this setup!!
And let's not even talk about how my plans for two video cards in a Dell Dimension (again 98 and XP dual boot) also didn't work out at all. I guess this just aint my week...

Again.
Is xp updated?
If you're using an ISO from 20 years ago, it suggests no.