VOGONS


Reply 28680 of 29215, by Cosmic

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I wish I had lots of cool photos or updates to post in this thread. Currently I'm thinking about replacing my PGA168 486 board that died last year (probably just a bad cap that I'll fix) with a Socket 3 board so I can experiment with PODs. New board also has better VLB placement so my caps don't crash into the metal chassis.

UMC UM8498: DX2-66 SX955 WB | 32MB FPM | GD5426 VLB | Win3.1/95
MVP3: 600MHz K6-III+ | 256MB SDRAM | MX440 AGP | 98SE/NT4
440BX: 1300MHz P!!!-S SL5XL | 384MB ECC Reg | Quadro FX500 AGP | XP SP3

Reply 28681 of 29215, by Shponglefan

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Spent some time learning how to better angle my microscope for PCI slot inspection. There was some hidden corrosion that I otherwise would not have found.

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Pentium 4 Multi-OS Build
486 DX4-100 with 6 sound cards
486 DX-33 with 5 sound cards

Reply 28682 of 29215, by momaka

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Today's retro activities:

- Cleaned lots of fans and assembled (back) some heatsinks with said fans.
- Washed an AsRock AM2NF4-SATA2 and MSI H61M-P31 motherboards in the sink... with lots of manual brushing. The AM2NF4-SATA2 is probably a lost case - it has a knocked out PI coil, electrolytic cap, missing top part of CPU socket, and looks like it came out from the bottom of a bird house, judging by all of the bird poo and crap on it. Definitely one of the dirtiest boards I've seen in a while. Probably gonna end up being a dead chipset board, being GeForce 6100-based. But hey, it only cost me slightly more than half a dollar. The Panasonic caps on the CPU VRM on it are easily worth 2x more... and actually, that's the sole reason I got the board. But then I checked online, and apparently there's a modded BIOS that allows Athlon X4 CPUs to run on these boards. So that's pretty cool and the reason why I will attempt to fix it. As for the MSI H61M mobo... that was also pretty dirty, but not nearly as much. Some corrosion near the LPC/SIO and the battery holder... probably because the board got wet when the CR2032 battery was still in it and had a charge. Aside from a physically busted fuse near the VGA port, I don't see anything else wrong. CPU LGA socket pins appear OK. With some luck, this could make a nice Sandy Bridge build. It has a Celeron G530 in it currently... though if it does work, I might put an i5-2400 in it.

And that's about all.

BitWrangler wrote on 2024-11-05, 04:15:

So I took a detour and threw together a speaker enclosure in about 30 mins... I wanted to mount the test speaker somehow so it wasn't just rattling around on the bench. So, this happened.

Haha, hilarious and genius at the same time! 😀

Reminds me of the images I used to collect back in the day from There-I-Fixed-It / Cheezburger network.
I think the first enclosure I saw like that was a pair of coke bottles with their bottoms drilled and speakers installed in there.
While in college, I also ran into a similar ordeal as you - basically had a small speaker that I wanted to test, so I quickly whipped up an "enclosure" just like you. In my case, the enclosure consisted of an empty 1 Gal. milk jug. Held the speaker in place with hot glue.
Sound quality? - Better than just the speaker sitting on my desk and directing the high frequencies towards the ceiling. But that's about all. As for the bass response... what bass??? 🤣 It's a PC speaker.

Then a year or three later, I wanted to a small amp board from a scrapped Sony CRT TV (that I found broken in pieces on the side of the road), along with the 3.5" speakers from it. I didn't have an enclosure and wanted to make something real real fast. As if by total miracle, I had an old ATX PSU opened on my bench (waiting for a recap) with its board out and its case sitting off to the side. It was one of those PSUs with a 92 mm fan on top. I removed the fan and simply dropped-in the speaker. It was almost a perfect fit, too. 🤣 Again, I can't say this "enclosure" did the speaker proper justice... but it was better than just the speaker running open-air. And for the 5 minutes of "work" I had to do, it was wonderful.

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Reply 28683 of 29215, by thp

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Collected some accessories that I had in storage for that ISA SB16 that I'm going to be parting ways with, as the DOS era will be covered via DOSBox-X/86Box for me going forward.

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Reply 28684 of 29215, by gmaverick2k

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thp wrote on 2024-11-07, 06:58:

Collected some accessories that I had in storage for that ISA SB16 that I'm going to be parting ways with, as the DOS era will be covered via DOSBox-X/86Box for me going forward.

interesting, just tried dosbox-x and main>quick launch program tyrian.exe in win10, seems a bit off but loads up

"What's all this racket going on up here, son? You watchin' yer girl cartoons again?"

Reply 28687 of 29215, by PC@LIVE

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momaka wrote on 2024-11-07, 02:49:
Today's retro activities: […]
Show full quote

Today's retro activities:

- Cleaned lots of fans and assembled (back) some heatsinks with said fans.
- Washed an AsRock AM2NF4-SATA2 and MSI H61M-P31 motherboards in the sink... with lots of manual brushing. The AM2NF4-SATA2 is probably a lost case - it has a knocked out PI coil, electrolytic cap, missing top part of CPU socket, and looks like it came out from the bottom of a bird house, judging by all of the bird poo and crap on it. Definitely one of the dirtiest boards I've seen in a while. Probably gonna end up being a dead chipset board, being GeForce 6100-based. But hey, it only cost me slightly more than half a dollar. The Panasonic caps on the CPU VRM on it are easily worth 2x more... and actually, that's the sole reason I got the board. But then I checked online, and apparently there's a modded BIOS that allows Athlon X4 CPUs to run on these boards. So that's pretty cool and the reason why I will attempt to fix it. As for the MSI H61M mobo... that was also pretty dirty, but not nearly as much. Some corrosion near the LPC/SIO and the battery holder... probably because the board got wet when the CR2032 battery was still in it and had a charge. Aside from a physically busted fuse near the VGA port, I don't see anything else wrong. CPU LGA socket pins appear OK. With some luck, this could make a nice Sandy Bridge build. It has a Celeron G530 in it currently... though if it does work, I might put an i5-2400 in it.

And that's about all.

BitWrangler wrote on 2024-11-05, 04:15:

So I took a detour and threw together a speaker enclosure in about 30 mins... I wanted to mount the test speaker somehow so it wasn't just rattling around on the bench. So, this happened.

Haha, hilarious and genius at the same time! 😀

Reminds me of the images I used to collect back in the day from There-I-Fixed-It / Cheezburger network.
I think the first enclosure I saw like that was a pair of coke bottles with their bottoms drilled and speakers installed in there.
While in college, I also ran into a similar ordeal as you - basically had a small speaker that I wanted to test, so I quickly whipped up an "enclosure" just like you. In my case, the enclosure consisted of an empty 1 Gal. milk jug. Held the speaker in place with hot glue.
Sound quality? - Better than just the speaker sitting on my desk and directing the high frequencies towards the ceiling. But that's about all. As for the bass response... what bass??? 🤣 It's a PC speaker.

Then a year or three later, I wanted to a small amp board from a scrapped Sony CRT TV (that I found broken in pieces on the side of the road), along with the 3.5" speakers from it. I didn't have an enclosure and wanted to make something real real fast. As if by total miracle, I had an old ATX PSU opened on my bench (waiting for a recap) with its board out and its case sitting off to the side. It was one of those PSUs with a 92 mm fan on top. I removed the fan and simply dropped-in the speaker. It was almost a perfect fit, too. 🤣 Again, I can't say this "enclosure" did the speaker proper justice... but it was better than just the speaker running open-air. And for the 5 minutes of "work" I had to do, it was wonderful.

Very interesting, forgive me but I also have some motherboards, which I would like to clean, before I thought a little alcohol was enough, but sometimes it doesn't work, and recently I saw on some YouTube videos, which are washed with (hot) water ?), and there are those who use soap or other cleaning products.
I was thinking of using a container, but I think the plastic ones are not good, they could release some electrostatic charge, in short, if you want to share, how to clean and what to use, personally I would appreciate it very much, but once the cleaning is finished, it should be dried in rush.

AMD 286-16 287-10 4MB HD 45MB VGA 256KB
AMD 386DX-40 Intel 387 8MB HD 81MB VGA 256KB
Cyrix 486DLC-40 IIT387-40 8MB VGA 512KB
AMD 5X86-133 16MB VGA VLB CL5428 2MB and many others
AMD K62+ 550 SOYO 5EMA+ and many others
AST Pentium Pro 200 MHz L2 256KB

Reply 28688 of 29215, by Shponglefan

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PC@LIVE wrote on 2024-11-07, 19:53:

Very interesting, forgive me but I also have some motherboards, which I would like to clean, before I thought a little alcohol was enough, but sometimes it doesn't work, and recently I saw on some YouTube videos, which are washed with (hot) water ?), and there are those who use soap or other cleaning products.
I was thinking of using a container, but I think the plastic ones are not good, they could release some electrostatic charge, in short, if you want to share, how to clean and what to use, personally I would appreciate it very much, but once the cleaning is finished, it should be dried in rush.

Hardware is a lot more resistant to this stuff that I think we give it credit for. My experience is hardware is fine to wash with soap and water. As long as its properly prepared (e.g. removing socketed ICs, jumpers, etc.), and then rinsed and dried, it can survive a washing no problem.

If air drying, I would recommend rinsing with distilled water to avoid any potential mineral residue being left behind. Alternatively, you can use an air compressor to blow dry electronics. The latter is my preferred method since it gets all the water out of all the nooks and crannies on typical electronics.

All in all, we shouldn't fear giving our electronics a bath from time to time. 😉

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Last edited by Shponglefan on 2024-11-07, 21:50. Edited 1 time in total.

Pentium 4 Multi-OS Build
486 DX4-100 with 6 sound cards
486 DX-33 with 5 sound cards

Reply 28689 of 29215, by Tiido

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Jaa, soapy water does nothing as long as you dry it out properly. I tend to heatgun stuff dry, since it reduces the time things are wet and it bakes out water from inside connectors etc. I don't let things get hotter than what is comfy to handle with bare hands.

Actual production cleaning methods can involve much harsher stuff than soap+water, primarly depending on what sort of flux was used. Nowdays there's a wide variety of water soluble fluxes available.

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 28690 of 29215, by PC@LIVE

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Shponglefan wrote on 2024-11-07, 21:24:
Hardware is a lot more resistant to this stuff that I think we give it credit for. My experience is hardware is fine to wash wit […]
Show full quote
PC@LIVE wrote on 2024-11-07, 19:53:

Very interesting, forgive me but I also have some motherboards, which I would like to clean, before I thought a little alcohol was enough, but sometimes it doesn't work, and recently I saw on some YouTube videos, which are washed with (hot) water ?), and there are those who use soap or other cleaning products.
I was thinking of using a container, but I think the plastic ones are not good, they could release some electrostatic charge, in short, if you want to share, how to clean and what to use, personally I would appreciate it very much, but once the cleaning is finished, it should be dried in rush.

Hardware is a lot more resistant to this stuff that I think we give it credit for. My experience is hardware is fine to wash with soap and water. As long as its properly prepared (e.g. removing socketed ICs, jumpers, etc.), and then rinsed and dried, it can survive a washing no problem.

If air drying, I would recommend rinsing with distilled water to avoid any potential mineral residue being left behind. Alternatively, you can use an air compressor to blow dry electronics. The latter is my preferred method since it gets all the water out of all the nooks and crannies on typical electronics.

All in all, we shouldn't fear giving our electronics a bath from time to time. 😉

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Tiido wrote on 2024-11-07, 21:37:

Jaa, soapy water does nothing as long as you dry it out properly. I tend to heatgun stuff dry, since it reduces the time things are wet and it bakes out water from inside connectors etc. I don't let things get hotter than what is comfy to handle with bare hands.

Actual production cleaning methods can involve much harsher stuff than soap+water, primarly depending on what sort of flux was used. Nowdays there's a wide variety of water soluble fluxes available.

Thank you both very much, your advice will be very useful to me, I will do a test on a scrap MB, to see whether to limit myself to cleaning a corner, or whether to immerse it completely, looking at the videos and images, I should get a toothbrush, like that one in the photo, perhaps I use brushes that are too soft, I'll try to find one with hard bristles, for drying perhaps a hairdryer could be suitable, some time ago I tried to detach a large SMD from it, it's not good, I guess it doesn't heat up enough.
Although before using the hot air, it is advisable to give it a vigorous downward move, which should release the water remaining in the cracks.

AMD 286-16 287-10 4MB HD 45MB VGA 256KB
AMD 386DX-40 Intel 387 8MB HD 81MB VGA 256KB
Cyrix 486DLC-40 IIT387-40 8MB VGA 512KB
AMD 5X86-133 16MB VGA VLB CL5428 2MB and many others
AMD K62+ 550 SOYO 5EMA+ and many others
AST Pentium Pro 200 MHz L2 256KB

Reply 28691 of 29215, by Tiido

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Oh yeah, I always do the sudden motions to flick off as much water as possible and to push it out of hiding places, so that there's less to evaporate out. Hair dryer will work perfectly for this too, it is able to give good amount of airflow and heat. It is for drying afterall 🤣

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 28692 of 29215, by Major Jackyl

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I did some work to the AMD build I'm putting together. So far...

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POST'd and tested (super iffy test, but confirmed it indeed works) I ran it for an hour, then noticed the already devastated, plague-ridden capacitors started juicing. Ope. I needed to know if it was good before investing more time. Mission accomplished. The board is under-the-iron now and will be ready this weekend (waiting on those 6.3v2200µF caps)

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I got all the parts cleaned and added a few cards (excluded almost everything it came with) Parts so far:
Athlon XP1600+ with 2x256M PC2100DDR (maybe will do 2x512s, but I plan on running mostly W98)
MSI MS-8951 Radeon RX9550 256MB
Adaptec ASH-1233
VIA VT6212L
2xATA-133 Hot-Swap bays - Quantum Fireball LCT 13G(for w98) and (Fireball TM 1.6G for DOS6.22)
Sony CD-RW
Western Digital 60GBx2 (for WinXP)
IOmega ZIP100
Teac-FD-235HF
Also designed a replacement set of drive rails for the 5.25" bay

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Designed a bracket for the Zalman CNPS9xxx series coolers for 462 (CNPS9500 specifically). This is a unique bracket right here. I have never seen anything in those holes before, but assuming they were for some type of cooler? They are now, that's for sure.

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Main Loadout (daily drivers):
Intel TE430VX, Pentium Sy022 (133), Cirrus Logic 5440, SB16 CT1740
ECS K7S5A, A-XP1600+, MSI R9550
ASUS M2N-E, A64X2-4600+, PNY GTX670, SB X-Fi Elite Pro
MSI Z690, Intel 12900K, MSI RTX3090, SB AE-7

Reply 28693 of 29215, by bestemor

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DarthSun wrote on 2024-11-01, 20:54:
PcBytes wrote on 2024-11-01, 19:38:

Tested a Gainward Dragon 3000. There's something funny about running a Voodoo 2 12MB alongside a Geforce 2 Pro, of all the things I could pair it up with, but it was fun nonetheless.

Why? It works even in Ryzen 😀

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Please elaborate ?!
I mean, Windows98 on a Ryzen 3800x ??? 🫣
- HOW ? Parts used ?

Does it work beyond the desktop ? Can you play games on it ?

Reply 28694 of 29215, by zuldan

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Shponglefan wrote on 2024-11-07, 21:24:

All in all, we shouldn't fear giving our electronics a bath from time to time. 😉

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Yep a good ol'wash is good.

I wash mine in distilled water then use the missus hair dryer to dry it. It then sits in front of a fan for 8 hours and she's good to go!

I'm guessing you live in the land where Gravis was born. Do you find them often in your area? or are they still rare as hen teeth?

Reply 28695 of 29215, by BitWrangler

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In my part of Ontario, ATI seems well represented, but other local talent is rare to one off in my finds.. just got one Gravis gamecard and joystick, one Guillemot Banshee, one Patriot computer system, one Seanix system, One made in Canada cyrix. I have not turned up any gravis or guillemot soundcards, or Gainberry upgrades.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 28696 of 29215, by CMB75

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Got myself a lesson in anger management and frustration resilience. While trying to learn a few new tricks for my retro hobby I put together a quick and dirty spray booth and got the new and shiny cheapo air gun out - how hard can it be?

After grinding I started laying down the primer … and I learned my first lessons about spitting color, air pressure, damp patches, clocked nozzles … mistakes were made.

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Back to square one - grinding.

Reply 28697 of 29215, by paradigital

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Major Jackyl wrote on 2024-11-08, 00:23:
I did some work to the AMD build I'm putting together. So far... […]
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I did some work to the AMD build I'm putting together. So far...

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POST'd and tested (super iffy test, but confirmed it indeed works) I ran it for an hour, then noticed the already devastated, plague-ridden capacitors started juicing. Ope. I needed to know if it was good before investing more time. Mission accomplished. The board is under-the-iron now and will be ready this weekend (waiting on those 6.3v2200µF caps)

20241103_210856.jpg
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I got all the parts cleaned and added a few cards (excluded almost everything it came with) Parts so far:
Athlon XP1600+ with 2x256M PC2100DDR (maybe will do 2x512s, but I plan on running mostly W98)
MSI MS-8951 Radeon RX9550 256MB
Adaptec ASH-1233
VIA VT6212L
2xATA-133 Hot-Swap bays - Quantum Fireball LCT 13G(for w98) and (Fireball TM 1.6G for DOS6.22)
Sony CD-RW
Western Digital 60GBx2 (for WinXP)
IOmega ZIP100
Teac-FD-235HF
Also designed a replacement set of drive rails for the 5.25" bay

20241107_173146.jpg
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1.93 MiB
Views
874 views
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Test Fitting
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Designed a bracket for the Zalman CNPS9xxx series coolers for 462 (CNPS9500 specifically). This is a unique bracket right here. I have never seen anything in those holes before, but assuming they were for some type of cooler? They are now, that's for sure.

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Nice solution. With regards to the holes, Alpha PAL 8045 and Swiftech MC462 are two period correct coolers that mounted with those holes. I still have my original 8045.

Reply 28698 of 29215, by thp

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gmaverick2k wrote on 2024-11-07, 07:23:
thp wrote on 2024-11-07, 06:58:

Collected some accessories that I had in storage for that ISA SB16 that I'm going to be parting ways with, as the DOS era will be covered via DOSBox-X/86Box for me going forward.

interesting, just tried dosbox-x and main>quick launch program tyrian.exe in win10, seems a bit off but loads up

Yeah, I don't aim for 100% backwards compatibility, only the small subset of contents I still like to play every now and then, and that seems to work fine. Especially 86Box is getting better and better, and they aim for good accuracy.

CMB75 wrote on 2024-11-07, 07:26:
thp wrote on 2024-11-07, 06:58:

...,as the DOS era will be covered via DOSBox-X/86Box for me going forward.

No regret, no remorse? It sounds kinda sad...

Nah, it's been sitting in a Super Socket 7 build that I didn't touch often the last few years. It has done its job and it's been sitting idle for long enough that going the emulation route makes sense (for me). Between SBEMU, Win9x's SB Pro emulation (I keep a 9x-compatible box around) and DOSBox-X/86Box, a pure DOS box is - in my case - a bit redundant.

Reply 28699 of 29215, by DarthSun

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bestemor wrote on 2024-11-08, 02:09:
Please elaborate ?! I mean, Windows98 on a Ryzen 3800x ??? 🫣 - HOW ? Parts used ? […]
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DarthSun wrote on 2024-11-01, 20:54:
PcBytes wrote on 2024-11-01, 19:38:

Tested a Gainward Dragon 3000. There's something funny about running a Voodoo 2 12MB alongside a Geforce 2 Pro, of all the things I could pair it up with, but it was fun nonetheless.

Why? It works even in Ryzen 😀

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Please elaborate ?!
I mean, Windows98 on a Ryzen 3800x ??? 🫣
- HOW ? Parts used ?

Does it work beyond the desktop ? Can you play games on it ?

RyZen 3800X/Asus B450TUF Gaming Pro/32GB DDR4/GTX1650(Win10-11)/GeF7900GS(DOS-Win98-XP)/Chinese PCIe to PCI converter/Voodoo2SLI/SBLive 0060.
Today, for every given modern machine for Win98, enthusiastic retro-lovers have written mod/drivers, and under DOS.
There is also a good config for tests, programs, games.

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The 3 body problems cannot be solved, neither for future quantum computers, even for the remainder of the universe. The Proton 2D is circling a planet and stepping back to the quantum size in 11 dimensions.