VOGONS


Buzzing sounds when moving windows around

Topic actions

First post, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

OK, quick question: is it normal that I hear buzzing in my speakers and headphones whenever I move windows around under Windows 98? Out of curiosity I've used PS2Rate Plus to change the mouse polling rate and indeed, the pitch of the buzzing changes with the polling rate. Is this indicative of some IRQ conflict? Dying caps perhaps? The setup is as follows: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Live!/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB (as in my signature).

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 1 of 28, by dionb

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Most likely some badly shielded analog path in your PC is acting like an antenna, picking up USB or PS/2 signals.

Do you have front panel audio hooked up? Try disconnecting it. Also check that all inputs are muted in the mixer. Are you exclusively using the SBLive or also onboard audio?

Reply 2 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
dionb wrote on 2024-11-08, 10:38:

Most likely some badly shielded analog path in your PC is acting like an antenna, picking up USB or PS/2 signals.

Do you have front panel audio hooked up? Try disconnecting it. Also check that all inputs are muted in the mixer. Are you exclusively using the SBLive or also onboard audio?

No fornt panel, onboard audio disabled in BIOS, DVD ROM audio routed to the analog CD In socket on the SB Live, all inputs otherwise muted in the Windows sound mixer. The mouse is a Cherry optical model running through a USB to PS/2 adapter.

Last edited by revolstar on 2024-11-08, 10:45. Edited 1 time in total.

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 3 of 28, by st31276a

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Does it only happen when you drag windows around and not when you only move the mouse around?

Could be marginal power quality causing modulation, as more power is drawn when moving stuff around on screen. The noise might even come from ground, as higher currents can shift the ground level around too.

Reply 4 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
st31276a wrote on 2024-11-08, 10:44:

Does it only happen when you drag windows around and not when you only move the mouse around?

It's only when I move the windows around, i.e. when I grab the title bar and drag it around, yes.

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 5 of 28, by st31276a

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

My guess is it is the graphics card drawing power in bursts, every time a ps2 packet arrives some on screen work is done rather quickly, hence the changing of the note at changed ps2 rates.

Maybe worth a try to see if the noise is quieter if the sound card is in a farther away slot, also test onboard audio to see if problem is there too.

Might be a filtering issue, caps on power rails on motherboard.

Last edited by st31276a on 2024-11-08, 10:56. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 6 of 28, by DaveDDS

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
st31276a wrote on 2024-11-08, 10:44:

Could be marginal power quality causing modulation, as more power is drawn when moving stuff around on screen. The noise might even come from ground, as higher currents can shift the ground level around too.

It is a "interesting" problem .. a test might to be running something that does serious processing (like a performance test) which
should make the system draw a bit more power - see of the symptoms change with more power draw

Dave ::: https://dunfield.themindfactory.com ::: "Daves Old Computers"->Personal

Dave ::: https://dunfield.themindfactory.com ::: "Daves Old Computers"->Personal

Reply 7 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Oddly enough, I can hear this buzz even if I select "Mute All" in the Windows sound mixer.

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 8 of 28, by Shponglefan

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
revolstar wrote on 2024-11-08, 12:54:

Oddly enough, I can hear this buzz even if I select "Mute All" in the Windows sound mixer.

Its not an audio signal. Its likely being carried by the ground.

Pentium 4 Multi-OS Build
486 DX4-100 with 6 sound cards
486 DX-33 with 5 sound cards

Reply 9 of 28, by BitWrangler

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

CRT? ..... 'coz that's the only time I had something similar, about 1997 in max res on a vlb system with GD-5429, and I'd get a buzz moving windows, dragging icons or scrolling, when the speakers or cord were too near the monitor... keeping everything 8" away it didn't happen.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 10 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
BitWrangler wrote on 2024-11-08, 13:39:

CRT? .....

Indeed! A Flatron 774FT

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 11 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

OK, I've tried the AC97 on-board audio and there's no buzzing.

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 12 of 28, by Oetker

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Maybe it's due to your cd analog audio cable?

Reply 13 of 28, by Tiido

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

That's most probably a ground loop type problem and it can happen due to CD audio cable or PC speaker connection if present. Sometimes the problems leaks in from +12V line and is an indication of bad capacitors on the analog supply rails of the sound card.

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 14 of 28, by leonardo

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
revolstar wrote on 2024-11-08, 13:54:

OK, I've tried the AC97 on-board audio and there's no buzzing.

Ironically it would have usually been the sound card integrated to the motherboard that would suffer things like loud hiss, buzzes, clicks and other interference from the other components inside your box.

Does swapping sound cards (or slots) make a difference? Maybe moving the card to another slot is enough to correct the problem.

[Install Win95 like you were born in 1985!] on systems like this or this.

Reply 15 of 28, by MikeSG

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Try a shielded audio cable

Reply 16 of 28, by wierd_w

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Also, use an outlet tester to make sure the ground on the outlet is actually there.

'Floating' ground is *infamous* for causing this issue.

Reply 17 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Thanks for the suggestions peeps. I've swapped the slots on the MoBo, removed the analog CD audio cable - the buzz is still there. I'm considering getting a different Sound Blaster.

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB

Reply 18 of 28, by dionb

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Have you checked the earthing/grounding? If that's the cause, a different card won't make a difference. Would be a shame to throw money at the problem before being sure.

Reply 19 of 28, by revolstar

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
dionb wrote on 2024-11-09, 10:11:

Have you checked the earthing/grounding? If that's the cause, a different card won't make a difference. Would be a shame to throw money at the problem before being sure.

Aye, I've checked the grounding points on the card, they seem ok.

Win98 rig: Athlon XP 2500+/512MB RAM/Gigabyte GA-7VT600/SB Audigy/GF FX5700/Voodoo2 12MB
WinXP rig: HP RP5800 - Pentium G850/2GB RAM/GF GT530 1GB
Amiga: A600/2MB RAM
PS3: Slim, CFW, mostly for RetroArch & PSX games
PS2: Fat, FMCB