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nForce3 woes

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First post, by reukiodo

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I have 2 Shuttle XPCs:

  1. SB75G2 (hwinfo pic attached)
    • PC40N250EV 250W PSU
    • FB75 V1.1 motherboard with FB75S01G BIOS
    • Intel Pentium 4 Extreme Edition 3.4GHz
    • 2x Kingston KHX3700/1G 466MHz DDR
    • HX-218 CF-IDE40 dual CF to IDE adapter
    • 2x CF to dual uSD adapter
    • 2x 128GB Samsung Pro Endurance uSD card
    • Seagate ST2000NE0025 2TB SATA drive with EN02 firmware and SATA1 limit jumper
    • Samsung SH-D162D with Kreon firmware
  2. SN95G5 V3 (if I ever get the system booted again for hwinfo pic...)
    • PC3512402 240W PSU
    • FN95 V3 motherboard with SN95S3XC BIOS
    • Athlon 64 FX-60
    • 2x Kingston KHX3200/1G 400MHz DDR
    • HX-218 CF-IDE40 dual CF to IDE adapter
    • 2x CF to dual uSD adapter
    • 2x 128GB Samsung Pro Endurance uSD card
    • Seagate ST2000NE0025 2TB SATA drive with EN02 firmware and SATA1 limit jumper
    • Plextor PX-708A

And I have a handful of various AGP GPUs:

  • GeForce 6200 512MB DDR2 (PNY VCG62512APB stock firmware)
  • GeForce 6800 128MB DDR (BFGR6800OC recovered from dead and now with unlocked firmware)
  • GeForce 6800 128MB DDR (EVGA 128A8N343DX recovered from dead and now with unlocked firmware)
  • GeForce 6800GT 256MB GDDR3 (BFGR68256GTOC recovered from dead and now with reduced firmware but artifacts)
  • GeForce 7300GT 512MB DDR2 (BFGR73512GT recovered from dead and now with stock BFG firmware)
  • GeForce 7600GT 512MB DDR2 (GF7600GT assumed dead because no boot in either system even with main PCI video)
  • All-in-Wonder X800XT 256MB GDDR3 (stock firmware)

and a helper PCI Radeon 7000 64MB DDR with a generic (Sapphire?) firmware which I used for recovering most of the GeForce GPUs in the SB75G2.

My original goal was to have Win98SE and WinXP dual-booting on the P4 with the X800XT and WinXP and Win7 dual-booting on the Athlon with the 7600GT. After a lot of experimentation I realized that AGP will not work with Win7 on the SN95G5's nForce3 chip. Only the 6200 and X800XT actually booted into Win7 without crashing, though also without any AGP acceleration, so I resigned to only WinXP on the Athlon.

In the process of trying to figure out which GPU (and OS) to place into which system, the nForce3 system (Athlon) now no longer recognizes any IDE devices (even when plugged in only one at a time), and maybe 1 in 20 boots will recognize the 2TB SATA drive. After reading SD to CF not working I assumed that maybe it was because the CF-IDE adapter came with 3.3V and wasn't getting enough power. I tried on 5V and no difference. I took each CF adapter out and also each uSD out and tested them in other computer card readers and verified each one individually still worked correctly. I tried a more powerful (external) PSU and no difference either. I tried other IDE CD, DVD, and hard drives also without any detection. Everything I've read online about IDE drives not detected results in bad hardware and an RMA. Well, this system is way beyond that point.

After eventually resigning my fate to only having SATA storage internally, I barely got WinXP reinstalled on the SATA drive before now the current situation of not recognizing even the 2TB SATA drive. At this point I've tried unplugging and replugging in so many components in so many different combinations that I'm pulling my hair out, so what can I do to get this system working again?

Reply 1 of 10, by momaka

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Should go without saying, but have the motherboards in these systems been recapped before? If not, that may well be the cause, since almost all Shuttle PCs suffered from this problem at one point or another. Pictures of the two system's motherboards would be nice to see, just in case. The Shuttle PSUs were also known for developing bad caps too, but not as often... and you probably ruled that out on both systems if you tested them with a known good brand PSU.

Reply 2 of 10, by reukiodo

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I'm terrible at soldering, and will probably ruin the board worse than it is right now if it turns out to be bad capacitors. I am the original owner of both XPCs, and at least as of right now both PSUs seem to be great. I haven't opened them though, so who knows what they are really like inside. I figured if the PSU was bad I could rule that out with a modern 1000W PSU that should easily handle these old systems.

I'll need to get some more time to inspect the capacitors on the SN95G5 as right now I'm already in bed.

Reply 3 of 10, by momaka

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Well, post some pictures of the motherboards if you like. I've seen quite a few of these. OST was a popular choice of caps on those, and the RLP series failed a lot.

Reply 4 of 10, by reukiodo

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Here are some terrible photos I have while it is re-installing winxp from a usb cd onto the 2TB drive now attached to a PCI Sil3114 card.

Reply 5 of 10, by PD2JK

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The caps next to the inductor look bulgy.

And yes, RoHS compliant boards can be a PITA when one doesn't have enough soldering skills. Applying fresh lead-based solder can help.

i386 16 ⇒ i486 DX4 100 ⇒ Pentium MMX 200 ⇒ Athlon Pluto 700 ⇒ AthlonXP 1700+ ⇒ Opteron 165 ⇒ Dual Opteron 856

Reply 6 of 10, by reukiodo

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Tried to take some more photos with it disconnected.

Reply 7 of 10, by reukiodo

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I think these are the ones you are referring to?

Reply 8 of 10, by PD2JK

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reukiodo wrote on 2025-01-15, 07:52:

I think these are the ones you are referring to?

Yes indeed.

i386 16 ⇒ i486 DX4 100 ⇒ Pentium MMX 200 ⇒ Athlon Pluto 700 ⇒ AthlonXP 1700+ ⇒ Opteron 165 ⇒ Dual Opteron 856

Reply 9 of 10, by PC@LIVE

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reukiodo wrote on 2025-01-15, 07:52:

I think these are the ones you are referring to?

The circled ones should be replaced as soon as possible, but maybe 🤔 even others of the same, although looking good visually, they may not be if verified, clearly you must have an instrument that measures both the capacity and the ESR, the latter in particular could be very high, for removal and replacement, first get quality capacitors, with the same specifications, then if you are not familiar with these jobs, look for someone who does the work for you, and above all has experience with these jobs.

AMD 286-16 287-10 4MB HD 45MB VGA 256KB
AMD 386DX-40 Intel 387 8MB HD 81MB VGA 256KB
Cyrix 486DLC-40 IIT387-40 8MB VGA 512KB
AMD 5X86-133 16MB VGA VLB CL5428 2MB and many others
AMD K62+ 550 SOYO 5EMA+ and many others
AST Pentium Pro 200 MHz L2 256KB

Reply 10 of 10, by momaka

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Oh yeah, confirmed you have the bad caps... and mostly OST's like, like I anticipated.

The circled ones here for sure:
download/file.php?id=209996&mode=view

The two in the lower right side of the screen:
download/file.php?id=209991&mode=view

... and probably more that we can't see.

No point in continuing with the OS install. It's just going to get worse as these caps are used further. Need to recap it at this point. You can start by taking out the motherboard and making a note of all of the capacitors: brand (most will be OST, it seems), series (RLX, RLS, RLP, etc.), capacitance (uF rating), voltage (V), diamter (in mm... i.e. 6.3, 8, 10 mm), and height (optional - only needed where the height of the caps is critical for physical clearance).

Depending on where you are in the world, I could suggest where to find caps. In NA (USA/Canada), Digikey and Mouser would be good reliable sources. For the rest of the world, it varies. Some eBay sellers have good NOS (new old stock) caps that should work too... but be careful with places like eBay, and especially Amazon and AliExpress - those are known places to get bad counterfeit caps.