VOGONS


First post, by lukewt1017

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The laptop I'm trying to install Windows 98 on is a Panasonic ToughBook CF-35. It does not have much documentation.
It came with Windows 95 when I first got it. Then, a few months later, I wanted to install Windows 98 on it (which I still want to do). I used an Upgrade ISO, but it got stuck on the same thing for hours and I had to choice but to mess up the Windows 95 install and abort the upgrade.
Obviously, this messed up the Windows install. Me and a friend were confused for weeks on how we could resolve the issue. The night before it was fixed, he offered to keep it over the night and just work on it and try to see if he could fix it. He ended up finding his Windows 2000 CD and installed Windows 2000 on the laptop. However, the next day, he looked in the same CD case and about right after that Win2K CD, there was a Windows 98 one. I tried to downgrade and boot from it, but Windows 2000 doesn't want you to downgrade, I guess. Unfortunately, I don't have a hard drive reader to copy files from a Windows 98 VM's hard disk or wipe the hard drive and try installing. I tried booting from a custom MS-DOS 6.22 Boot CD I found online, but it just said "Non-system Disk or disk error - Replace and press any key when ready". So I tried putting in a FreeDOS CD and pressing a key, but it would not do anything. It stayed on the same screen forever. Then, I tried rebooting with the FreeDOS CD in there. Windows 2000 began loading from the hard drive. Then, I tried to do the same thing with a PC DOS 2000 CD, which has a Bootable CD version. I would've ran Windows 98 Setup from these CDs, but they never worked. I do not have anything important on this computer, and I don't use it for business, I would prefer using it for gaming, but NTVDM sucks, DOSBox-X will run, but extremely slow because this is a 1997 laptop and is probably using it at max RAM (we upgraded it from 256 MB to 512 MB RAM). So two operating systems running at once (Win2K and DOS within DOSBox-X) is very slow, and not ideal for video games. The source ports made for Windows 2000 for the games I want to play run at about 15 FPS, and since Windows 2000 uses NTVDM (NT Virtual DOS Machine) for DOS programs, sound in games does not work right. I believe this laptop came with both an FDD and a CD-ROM drive, but somehow the previous owner got rid of the FDD. However, USB drivers don't work, and I don't have a USB 2.0 PCMCIA card, so I can't use an external FDD for booting from a Windows 98 boot disk. Should I just get a hard drive reader, or what?

Reply 1 of 29, by jakethompson1

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With the Windows 98 CD-ROM, you can at least boot to that menu with the three choices (setup, DOS with CDROM, DOS without CDROM), or no?

Reply 2 of 29, by lukewt1017

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I cannot.

Reply 3 of 29, by jakethompson1

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I usually use the OEM+Full Win98SE CD-ROM. I am not sure if there are others out there that aren't bootable. You could try booting the .ISO in a VM on your modern machine and make sure you indeed get that menu. If so, it's either an issue with the boot order assignment on the vintage machine, or a hardware problem with the CD-ROM drive having trouble reading discs.

Reply 4 of 29, by lukewt1017

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The CD-ROM drive seems to be read-only. I do not know if this is a Windows 2000 issue or if there is a problem with the hardware. However, I should try this.

Reply 5 of 29, by lukewt1017

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It seems that it is indeed an issue with the ISO. The VM displays the error that the MS-DOS 6.22 boot CD does. I will try using the ISO you mentioned.

Reply 6 of 29, by AlaricD

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lukewt1017 wrote on 2025-07-07, 21:48:

The CD-ROM drive seems to be read-only.

A CD-ROM drive is, by definition, read-only. That's what the RO in ROM stands for.

Reply 7 of 29, by Ryccardo

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lukewt1017 wrote on 2025-07-07, 21:48:

The CD-ROM drive seems to be read-only. I do not know if this is a Windows 2000 issue

What AlaricD said... PLUS the fact there's no integrated CD burning code until XP so there was no reason to call CD-compatible optical drives anything other than "CD-ROM" (the lowest common denominator commands wise)

In general it would be good advice to install DOS (format /s) on the HDD, then copy the Win98 folder from the CD to the HDD and run the installer from there - faster and more convenient (no more digging out the disc for driver/accessories installation), and in your case also eliminates the need for a bootable CD (which yes, at the time was not a given, both in system/firmware support and in assorted Microsoft releases being El Torito bootable)!

Reply 8 of 29, by jakethompson1

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Ryccardo wrote on 2025-07-07, 22:25:

In general it would be good advice to install DOS (format /s) on the HDD, then copy the Win98 folder from the CD to the HDD and run the installer from there - faster and more convenient (no more digging out the disc for driver/accessories installation), and in your case also eliminates the need for a bootable CD (which yes, at the time was not a given, both in system/firmware support and in assorted Microsoft releases being El Torito bootable)!

I'm assuming the C: partition is probably NTFS, and the OP is going to have to use fdisk to delete it first (or possibly wipe the MBR entirely if fdisk refuses for some reason)

Reply 9 of 29, by lukewt1017

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No, it is using FAT32.

Reply 10 of 29, by lukewt1017

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I know it originally had a FDD because when I first got it, I opened Paint, and there was a recent file in the A: drive. Of course, I couldn't access it because I don't have that floppy disk (obviously) and it doesn't even have an FDD.

Reply 11 of 29, by lukewt1017

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After burning the Windows 98 OEM ISO to a CD-R and inserting it into the computer, I get a startup menu (expected). I choose to boot from CD, but it just has a blinking cursor. What should I do?

Reply 12 of 29, by jakethompson1

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lukewt1017 wrote on 2025-07-08, 02:21:

After burning the Windows 98 OEM ISO to a CD-R and inserting it into the computer, I get a startup menu (expected). I choose to boot from CD, but it just has a blinking cursor. What should I do?

You might choose "boot with CD-ROM support" with "step-by-step confirmation", and confirm each step with Y by hand, so that you can see at what point it locks up.

Reply 13 of 29, by lukewt1017

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I do not see that as an option in the Startup Menu.

Reply 14 of 29, by jakethompson1

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Oh, it's #2 from the first menu, then you should get a second menu with three choices.
If choosing #2 brings up the second menu in your VM, but not on real hardware, that points to a problem with the CD-ROM drive.

Reply 15 of 29, by lukewt1017

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What do I do? You are right, it does bring it up in the VM but not on the laptop!

Reply 16 of 29, by lukewt1017

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Well, I just tried to erase Windows 2000's files, and now it won't boot because a single DLL file is missing. I do not have a hard drive reader, so I don't know what I can do!

Reply 17 of 29, by jakethompson1

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Normally I would suggest it's some software quirk or BIOS El Torito boot incompatibility but not here--if you can't boot the Windows 98 CD, you're not going to boot anything reliably.
As others suggested, as old CD-ROM drives age, they get picky about reading CD-R (and more so CD-RW) first, before they start rejecting pressed CDs. Do you happen to know if the Windows 2000 CD was a genuine (pressed) one or a CD-R copy?

Reply 18 of 29, by jakethompson1

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lukewt1017 wrote on 2025-07-08, 03:24:

Well, I just tried to erase Windows 2000's files, and now it won't boot because a single DLL file is missing. I do not have a hard drive reader, so I don't know what I can do!

My ThinkPad of that era can boot from PCMCIA disks, and therefore, PCMCIA-to-CompactFlash adapters which are still common (and can be written to using CompactFlash-to-USB). I don't know if this Toughbook can do that, though, but it would be the easiest solution. Unless your friend can retrieve that Windows 2000 CD.

Reply 19 of 29, by lukewt1017

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jakethompson1 wrote on 2025-07-08, 03:24:

Normally I would suggest it's some software quirk or BIOS El Torito boot incompatibility but not here--if you can't boot the Windows 98 CD, you're not going to boot anything reliably.
As others suggested, as old CD-ROM drives age, they get picky about reading CD-R (and more so CD-RW) first, before they start rejecting pressed CDs. Do you happen to know if the Windows 2000 CD was a genuine (pressed) one or a CD-R copy?

Both CDs were genuine. (Win98 and 2k)