-Figuring out what is compatible with the motherboard. (just because it fits doesn't mean it will work.
-Finding out what an obscure part is called.
-Locating Drivers and BIOS updates

*Setting everything up and putting everything back and setting everything up and putting everything back (I have only one table for my computers)

Errius wrote:

Old systems are flaky and fragile and once they work "well enough" you should leave them alone. The urge to constantly change things is more trouble than it's worth.

...until you move, things loosen and you must go through a troubleshooting cycle once again on why old rig X doesn't work as it should until you realize things are loosen

My biggest problem is space. I have a wife and two toddlers, and my computer desk is in the space where all the kids toys are, which has turned into a heap so my desk is also over-run with odds and ends. I really need some shelving above my desk for all the miscellaneous junk.

But as far as usage of the systems I want to build, I'm really only interested in a handful of games: Chaos Overlords, Tie Fighter, Missionforce: Cyberstorm, and some other typical games which all easily find themselves at home on Windows 95, IIRC. So it shouldn't be much of a task to build an appropriate system, but I also can't neglect family (much) in favor of system building.

I'm trying to liquidate my stuff, for the most part, right now as all my stash of parts and systems are at my parents' house, and the owner just sold the house so they gotta move, soon. Ah! So much stuff. At least making the decision to get rid of all the P4's is easy. I'm only keeping ones which are heavily loaded with features for use as Linux machines, but even those I'm doing my best to let go of.

Matthew

1. getting oneself to start even
2. deciding on what's it gonna be

Well since I'm currently having trouble with one of my systems, I figured I'd post my 2 cents here.

In my opinion there are a lot of hard or annoying parts of building a retro rig.

Getting the parts you want can be challenging but most stuff is relatively easy to get. With the right cashflow that is.

Finding the drivers is one of the most frustrating parts of getting a system together. One day a PC of mine decided it didn't like the sound driver anymore. It took me three days to find one that works and several new installs of Windows.

The absolutely worst part in my opinion is getting the system to work. I try to have my machines functional in all situations, be it DOS, Windows 98SE or Win2k.
Sometimes you will get some unexplainable error or failure and you will have to scour the earth to try and find a fix. Be it Software, Drivers, Hardware anything can go wrong. Surprisingly most hardware seems to hold up but the software problems still exist.

This is not to say it's not rewarding, but damn is it frustrating sometimes

Honestly, my biggest problem is actually deciding what to build, and finding the time to do it.

I can very easily scan ebay for deals and my local craigslist and I buy whatever I think is a good deal and I end up with a bunch of stuff some of which I might not ever use. It's a lot cheaper then trying to source specific components which you may or may not ever find a good deal on.

There are so many options. I've probably got enough parts to build any 486 or newer that you could possibly want with the exceptions of Roland Midi hardware. The question is what to I want and how do I balance it with my other hobbies such as actually playing the retro games, and modding consoles, and other gadgets such as different Android devices.

leileilol wrote:

Errius wrote:

Old systems are flaky and fragile and once they work "well enough" you should leave them alone. The urge to constantly change things is more trouble than it's worth.

...until you move, things loosen and you must go through a troubleshooting cycle once again on why old rig X doesn't work as it should until you realize things are loosen

Yes I was just thinking about this in the other thread remembering my LAN party days. Even new systems don't like being bounced around in the back of a car for hours. You'd often have to spend the first few hours of the 'party' figuring out why your rig wasn't working properly.

What's always been hard for me is figuring out how to connect the motherboard to the buttons and lights on the front of the case.
The motherboard is NEVER labelled the same way as the little cables that attach to the front of the case and it's always trial and error getting them sorted out.

KT7AGuy wrote:

Thank the computer gods for disk imaging software!

Amen to that! Save a few fresh install images of different motherboard/chipset/OS setups, a few incremental images as you go and all of a sudden a stripdown and rebuild project is so much simpler - even pleasant to contemplate...

To contribute to the thread: seting up USB on W9x systems. Even though I think I have USB2 + W98 down pat it still feels like a crap shoot, and forget about USB2 + W95... There must be *some* combination of USB2 card/drivers/motherboard/chipset and sequence of driver installation that can beath life into USB2 on a W95 rig, but I have yet to find it...

skitters wrote:

What's always been hard for me is figuring out how to connect the motherboard to the buttons and lights on the front of the case.
The motherboard is NEVER labelled the same way as the little cables that attach to the front of the case and it's always trial and error getting them sorted out.

I fully agree with that, one would think that after more than 35 years of personal computers manufacturers would have settled on a standard for such a trivial thing. It's just 2 or 3 leds and a couple of buttons! 😒

I don't have a dedicated DOS gaming machine and I've been thinking that I really want one. It seems the biggest problem I have is what some people mentioned up above - deciding what to build. I have ideas for 4 different machines but I don't need 4 DOS machines, that would be ridiculous.
The games I most want to get into, and era that I most want to recreate is ~1996-97, but that also happens to be the era of system that is most easily dropped and replaced with a more flexible super socket 7 instead. Despite how well it would work, my super-7 board is the same one I upgraded to *after* the 96-97 era when I wasn't even living in the same state, so it doesn't feel right.

Assuming I do build a ~1996 machine, I'm going to want Windows 95, and based on a previous aborted effort, I know that will be a headache as well. I had forgotten how brain dead that OS is. But getting my 4 machines down to 1 or 2 seems to be the hardest part.

clueless1 wrote:

Yeah, for me it's sourcing components. I can't bring myself to buy retro motherboards and cases online because it's hard to know about damage until you actually test, and cases are just so expensive to ship. So I rely on finding parts, which is a very slow process. I will buy video and sound cards because they are relatively cheap with low shipping so not as big a deal if it ends up not working.

The contrary. Repairing this stuff makes me happy, like "what i touch turns to gold"
Check it out...I managed to resurrect this wonderful:

Thats more like it... 😀

Didn't even come well protected from mail (not working status). There was something smelling like smoke inside two memory slots. I cleaned everything, checked the capacitors and now it is solid rock !
No retro feeling on this one, indeed, but my current main rig (Asrock Z77 Extreme 4) and a 386SX came in the same terms. You can save 90% ! Holy shit !
I must say people never go deep, deep in their tests or i'm getting rather good. 😊
But i understand what you mean. Maybe i was luck. For instance, i got two Video cards (Cirrus Logic PCI) presenting shadows in some objects. Can't do anything about it. Sounds like a memory issue and they are soldered.

tincup wrote:

KT7AGuy wrote:

To contribute to the thread: seting up USB on W9x systems. Even though I think I have USB2 + W98 down pat it still feels like a crap shoot, and forget about USB2 + W95... There must be *some* combination of USB2 card/drivers/motherboard/chipset and sequence of driver installation that can beath life into USB2 on a W95 rig, but I have yet to find it...

Here are my notes for a M571 motherboard and Windows 95 OSR 2:
Fdisk and active larger bla bla bla - > Format - > Install Win95 OSR 2 - > Directx 7 -> Run USBSUPP.exe (USB supplement) - > Reboot - > Run USBUPD2.exe -> Reboot

C'mon, even the wise ones should show more respect for Windows 95. Have a nice life. 😠

Frasco wrote:

..C'mon, even the wise ones should show more respect for Windows 95. Have a nice life. 😠

Yes, to get USB1.1 working on W95 follow the steps you outline (disable USB support in BIOS sometimes necessary, and installing IE6 core components is almost always required too with W98 and USB2). But getting a USB2 card to run on W95 is another issue - no luck here with that one yet - even with NEC based cards. W98 is not a problem. If you have a proven method please share the wealth! 😀

The biggest pain is undoubtedly configuration management in DOS. Not that it's horrendous, but creating about three separate configurations (minimum : lots of memory/EMS/all devices, devices and no EMM386, max memory and no EMM386), then sourcing the correct combination of CD driver, cd redirector, memory manager, mouse driver that all work together stably and provide the maximum base memory can be tricky.

Multiboot can be interesting too. Going to write up a DOS/Windows 9x/OS2/Linux/OpenBSD/Windows XP (or 2000) multiboot guide at some point.

Also finding old drivers. For my low end retro box (486, for Ultima and some old graphical adventures) I also want to get OS/2 1.x up and running with a high colour display driver. This may need a specific graphics adapter and drivers. Will probably be running DOS/Windows 3.1, OS/2 1.3, OS/2 2.1. Possibly others if I think it's worth it.

Taking a pee 🤣 seriously that's legit most of the time I just want to get it done and I can't seem to pull my self away from the project.

Oldskoolmaniac wrote:

Taking a pee 🤣 seriously that's legit most of the time I just want to get it done and I can't seem to pull my self away from the project.

catheterize yourself? :>

^^^ that's painful ill just wear a man diaper

For me, the hardest part is finding the parts I want. This is difficult because, with most of my retro builds, I'm not just wanting to build any old vintage computer...rather, I'm attempting to recreate a computer from my childhood. My nostalgia suffers from severe OCD, which demands that the recreation be as close as I can humanly get to the original system. This fuels a seemingly endless quest to find specific brands, models and even revisions of certain parts, specific styles of cases, and so forth. Right now, I'm fighting tooth and nail to find a Reveal SC500 ISA sound card for my current 486 rebuild, plus a specific style of ATX case for my next planned rebuild, neither of which I have had any success in finding over the course of two years of searching now. So, yeah, finding the specific parts I want is the most difficult aspect of a retro build for me.

Oldskoolmaniac wrote:

^^^ that's painful ill just wear a man diaper

Just don't use a Foley catheter! You want a Stadium Buddy!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadium_buddy

gdjacobs wrote:

Oldskoolmaniac wrote:

^^^ that's painful ill just wear a man diaper

Just don't use a Foley catheter! You want a Stadium Buddy!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadium_buddy

Or like we do when camping in the winter: Keep an empty Gatorade bottle close by.