subhuman@xgtx wrote:

Just gonna say something, enjoy what you got instead of whining about prices. 😀

So true! So zen!

^ so ture.
Ill take a crummy p4 system with an low end 9xxx or gfFX or MX card and be more them happy with it. You dint need everything or uber rare parts to have fun.

Jade Falcon wrote:

^ so ture.
Ill take a crummy p4 system with an low end 9xxx or gfFX or MX card and be more them happy with it. You dint need everything or uber rare parts to have fun.

For some it's a collectors mentality, which I do share a bit. For me though, I don't see much point in wasting my time with inferior components. Although I support you in my feelings that all parts deserve some love and should be kept around, if not simply because they are the product of countless hours of combined human labor and shouldn't be wasted.

badmojo wrote:

subhuman@xgtx wrote:

Just gonna say something, enjoy what you got instead of whining about prices. 😀

So true! So zen!

Don't get me wrong, I certainly enjoy what I have. The problem is that most people wouldn't be able to afford what I have without the few lucky opportunities i've had. I see a lot of people who are IMO more deserving of the rare parts than the people who have them. Simply put, I don't like impassionate "collectors" or speculators and i'd rather see true hobbyists get the stuff. Not to mention the problems with the e-waste industry regard asset protection.

The Serpent Rider wrote:

xplus93 wrote:

be buried with me

Realistically speaking it will be burned with you.

Muahahahahaha. I'll be burned on a pile of fiberglass, plastic and silicon. A true ultracyberkings funeral.

Arctic wrote:

How about the Computer History Museum located in Silicon Valley? You know, the place where they invented the modern computer. […]
Show full quote

dexvx wrote:

Also, I don't think there is a computer museum in US, is there?

How about the Computer History Museum located in Silicon Valley?
You know, the place where they invented the modern computer.

http://www.computerhistory.org/

Seems to be more focused on computer as a unit (and sometimes the CPU), not so much the individual components.

Judging by demand, the components most in demand seem to be motherboards, graphics cards, and sound cards.

I don't understand how some people "deserve" rate items and others don't. Would you call somebody who collected for 20 years got bored and sold all the rarities (which nobody wanted 20 years ago) a speculator and not a collector? Are people who knew some items were rare and hoarded then when others recycled evil for charging some decent money to collectors who want the item now?

It gets a bit annoying how some people want all the rarities "only they deserve to own" for free while looking down at everybody else who saved that stuff when nobody wanted it, paid cold hard cash for it instead of finding it on the side of the road, or decided they wanted to sell some stuff for a decent price after having collected and restored it (get something back on all the money they have sunk into the hobby).

Unknown_K wrote:

I don't understand how some people "deserve" rate items and others don't. Would you call somebody who collected for 20 years got bored and sold all the rarities (which nobody wanted 20 years ago) a speculator and not a collector? Are people who knew some items were rare and hoarded then when others recycled evil for charging some decent money to collectors who want the item now?

It gets a bit annoying how some people want all the rarities "only they deserve to own" for free while looking down at everybody else who saved that stuff when nobody wanted it, paid cold hard cash for it instead of finding it on the side of the road, or decided they wanted to sell some stuff for a decent price after having collected and restored it (get something back on all the money they have sunk into the hobby).

You misunderstand. I see a lot of what you are describing as completely separate from what I describe as "soulless collectors" and speculators. I personally have no qualms with people wanting to get a few bucks for what they have as long as the reasons they acquired it in the first place are more interest related than focusing on profit.

The people hoarding because they knew the rarity of an item is the definition of speculating though.

What I see is the people who make argument like yours usually come from the opposite side of the argument. Where "I really wanted this and i worked my a** off to earn the money to pay for it" is the driving sentiment. To me that's no different than trolling ebay for hours a day. I've been there too, especially since I focus on complete OEM systems which command steep prices on ebay and steep/dangerous shipping to go along with it. I just would like to see the ego collectors and profiteers gone. Nobodies arguing that the guy who saved a rare part from a scrap pile doesn't deserve a bit of beer money. What is being argued is that people shouldn't look at the hobby with dollar signs in their eyes.

Money motivates people to find and sell rare items so they don't get trashed or recycled. I would rather a cool rarity ends up in a collection and preserved instead of trashed and lost forever.

I collect machines I want to mess around with and use, some for gaming and some for other things like old apps that interest me and things like analog video capture and editing. While I do like rare hardware upgrades and have a few myself, most of what I have isn't that rare and stuff like analog video editing nobody cares about. So I don't lust after nor want an Apple I, but can see why others would pay half a million for one.

Quite a bit of what I have was snagged free or cheap with some fixing and tons of cleaning involved when everyone else looked at it as trash. There are always deals to be made for hardware at the bottom of the value curve that is too old to really use and too new to be collectable. That is where the cheap hobby element is. The fact that I have been doing it since 2000ish means some of what I have now has value. If I live another 20+ years maybe what I snagged last week will be valuable as well, or maybe the hobby implodes and I will have to pay to dispose of all this lead containing hazardous waste. There are people who cornered the market on beany babies who ended up with worthless stuffed animals just like people who hoarded gold krugerands during the 1980s and still have not recovered their money even with the last gold boom. While it pains me to hear about people thinking there is tons of gold in a PPro processor driving prices up for chip collectors , it also means people will have a supply of those chips for years to come because of hoarding and speculating.

Unknown_K wrote:

Money motivates people to find and sell rare items so they don't get trashed or recycled. I would rather a cool rarity ends up in a collection and preserved instead of trashed and lost forever.

I collect machines I want to mess around with and use, some for gaming and some for other things like old apps that interest me and things like analog video capture and editing. While I do like rare hardware upgrades and have a few myself, most of what I have isn't that rare and stuff like analog video editing nobody cares about. So I don't lust after nor want an Apple I, but can see why others would pay half a million for one.

Quite a bit of what I have was snagged free or cheap with some fixing and tons of cleaning involved when everyone else looked at it as trash. There are always deals to be made for hardware at the bottom of the value curve that is too old to really use and too new to be collectable. That is where the cheap hobby element is. The fact that I have been doing it since 2000ish means some of what I have now has value. If I live another 20+ years maybe what I snagged last week will be valuable as well, or maybe the hobby implodes and I will have to pay to dispose of all this lead containing hazardous waste. There are people who cornered the market on beany babies who ended up with worthless stuffed animals just like people who hoarded gold krugerands during the 1980s and still have not recovered their money even with the last gold boom. While it pains me to hear about people thinking there is tons of gold in a PPro processor driving prices up for chip collectors , it also means people will have a supply of those chips for years to come because of hoarding and speculating.

If only more people looked at it as rationally. I do agree that some inflation is good to provide motive for the recyclers, but some of them are getting greedy. i.e the namesake of this topic.

CPU A at max load consumes 1000W and has max throughput 1Kbit/s
CPU B at max load consumes 100W and has max throughput 1Mbit/s
CPU C at max load consumes 10W and has max throughput 1GBit/s
CPU D at max load consumes 1W and has max throughput 1TBit/s

Which is more environmentally friendly?
Should we keep combustion engines on the road, because they are old and and its bad for the environment to keep making new things like electric versions, its not like cumbustion can't still be practical?

P.S I would work out how many years it would take A to do what D can do in a minute, but I'll leave that to the reader 😉. I don't think the number fits on 'standard' calculators? Maybe? o.0

xplus93 wrote:

What is being argued is that people shouldn't look at the hobby with dollar signs in their eyes.

Like every other hobby! Some things in life are free, this ain't one. It all depends why you do it, for nostalgia or for curiosity? and how much of your time, effort and money you want to throw at it (which tends to be dictated by your reasons for doing it). I wish all these horrible ferrari collectors would just f*ck off and die, because a mear mortal like me deserves to own a ferrari at some point in my life (and I have never owned one so I deserve more than every current owner to own one). I'll even take one that is 40/50/60 years old, but I ain't paying more than a grand for it...because.

Collect those GTX980's etc now, because they can be had for peanuts if not free from your friends unloading them or whatever. Then in 10 years time kids (who are currently pubescent) can start complaining about not being able to afford any retro cards from 2010-2015 ish and demanding that you hand over your hardware. You should do, because you have had it 10 years now and someone who hasn't had it deserves it more than you at a price they want to pay (or free). Just sayin. It's all relative! how old you were when the voodoo came out has quite a bearing on how much you want one and reasons you want one... 20 years later o.0.

Arctic wrote:

located in Silicon Valley? You know, the place where they invented the modern computer.

Define 'invent modern computer'? o.0

spiroyster wrote:

CPU A at max load consumes 1000W and has max throughput 1Kbit/s CPU B at max load consumes 100W and has max throughput 1Mbit/s C […]
Show full quote

CPU A at max load consumes 1000W and has max throughput 1Kbit/s
CPU B at max load consumes 100W and has max throughput 1Mbit/s
CPU C at max load consumes 10W and has max throughput 1GBit/s
CPU D at max load consumes 1W and has max throughput 1TBit/s

Which is more environmentally friendly?
Should we keep combustion engines on the road, because they are old and and its bad for the environment to keep making new things like electric versions, its not like cumbustion can't still be practical?

P.S I would work out how many years it would take A to do what D can do in a minute, but I'll leave that to the reader 😉. I don't think the number fits on 'standard' calculators? Maybe? o.0

xplus93 wrote:

What is being argued is that people shouldn't look at the hobby with dollar signs in their eyes.

Like every other hobby! Some things in life are free, this ain't one. It all depends why you do it, for nostalgia or for curiosity? and how much of your time, effort and money you want to throw at it (which tends to be dictated by your reasons for doing it). I wish all these horrible ferrari collectors would just f*ck off and die, because a mear mortal like me deserves to own a ferrari at some point in my life (and I have never owned one so I deserve more than every current owner to own one). I'll even take one that is 40/50/60 years old, but I ain't paying more than a grand for it...because.

Collect those GTX980's etc now, because they can be had for peanuts if not free from your friends unloading them or whatever. Then in 10 years time kids (who are currently pubescent) can start complaining about not being able to afford any retro cards from 2010-2015 ish and demanding that you hand over your hardware. You should do, because you have had it 10 years now and someone who hasn't had it deserves it more than you at a price they want to pay (or free). Just sayin. It's all relative! how old you were when the voodoo came out has quite a bearing on how much you want one and reasons you want one... 20 years later o.0.

Arctic wrote:

located in Silicon Valley? You know, the place where they invented the modern computer.

Define 'invent modern computer'? o.0

You're car reference is terrible because making an electric car is often worse than driving current cars until they wear out. Also, computation capability is not what is being measured.

I see your argument about the ferrari, but motorsports has been a rich mans hobby from the beginning, and has enough variation that there are aspects the average man can get into easily. Yes, I know early computing was as expensive as car ownership but it's not the same. Hobbyist computing has always been about trying to being economical, and that's changing. Less so in the gaming/programming category though. You've got things like raspberry pi and decent budget GPUs or using an awful AMD processor because you get a better performance per dollar (even if that chip will never last long) I'm not sitting here whining about not getting the things I want. I know there are some out there like that. But what I don't want is the profit motive to overwhelm the interest/passion.

Also, please point me to these free GTX980s. The best i've got is a 6970M and if there's some spoiled rich kid giving away stuff like that then i'd like to know. Even if that spoiled rich kid is possibly whining that the voodoo card daddy bought them doesn't make them cool on youtube and they're upset they aren't better than some poor/normal person. (not meant towards you, just a jab at the people i see causing issues) And, yeah IBM is not in silicon valley. If you want to say Intel (or even compaq or apple) invented the modern computer then i'll say there's a bit of truth.

Motor sport is not a rich mans game unless your into nascar or Le Mans. And I know that for a fact. Im part of a racers family. Wile money does help, I seen alot crap box cars beat everything from AMGs to Porsche's.

spiroyster wrote:

Collect those GTX980's etc now, because they can be had for peanuts if not free from your friends unloading them or whatever. Then in 10 years time kids (who are currently pubescent) can start complaining about not being able to afford any retro cards from 2010-2015 ish and demanding that you hand over your hardware.

Sign me up for these near free GTX 980's?

FYI, I'm buying boxed older video cards (around 2006-2011 era), but even they go for about $30-50 shipped. The 'rare' ones of that generation still go for $50+.

I would need 20,000 SQFT of warehouse if all my cards were boxed.

Unknown_K wrote:

I would need 20,000 SQFT of warehouse if all my cards were boxed.

Nobody wants to see that many boxed modems 😜

NVM, I would

Boxed modems fort! With obligatory "No girlz allowed" sign.

xplus93 wrote:

You're car reference is terrible because making an electric car is often worse than driving current cars until they wear out. Also, computation capability is not what is being measured.

I see your argument about the ferrari, but motorsports has been a rich mans hobby from the beginning, and has enough variation that there are aspects the average man can get into easily. Yes, I know early computing was as expensive as car ownership but it's not the same. Hobbyist computing has always been about trying to being economical, and that's changing. Less so in the gaming/programming category though. You've got things like raspberry pi and decent budget GPUs or using an awful AMD processor because you get a better performance per dollar (even if that chip will never last long) I'm not sitting here whining about not getting the things I want. I know there are some out there like that. But what I don't want is the profit motive to overwhelm the interest/passion.

My point was about waste. It may seem strange that throwing away a computer setup X years later that cost an arm and a leg at the time and still does what it was intended for, is wasteful. But the advancements in power conservation and reduced power consumption I think easily outweigh the apparent 'wastefulness' of simply recycling these 'working' machines. Recycling old stuff isn't wasteful in this regard because in most cases keeping the old stuff is what is inefficient, power hungry, bad for the environment and serves little to no practical purpose in the office, let alone economical.

Voodoo era stuff (and before), I would have thought (in the west) have mostly gone by now, and the only ones selling this stuff online are either people with similar interests (maybe looking to reap back what they invested, either for something else, or outright profit). Or the occasional one which pops up from a box in the attic etc. There were times when you couldn't even give this stuff away (blasphemous to think all these years later o.0), so most of it was categorised as junk and thrown away years ago which obviously now contributes to some of the prices they fetch. It's difficult to predict what will be worth something in the future (if that’s the reasons for buying it), however stuff which is notoriously crap today, may be some people’s 'diamonds in the rough' of the future. I’ll probably still be using an emulator in the future. o.0

It's annoying when people try to capitalise on your fun, but I think any hobby where there is interest, there is a business opportunity. For some it is someone trying to exploit those 'with genuine interests', hard earned monies. For others it could actually be good that there is someone somewhere who can source and supply this old stuff. It would be nice to know how to get it cheaper, however speaking for myself, if I ever come to buy another retro gfx card or whatever, I would probably be happy to pay up to 50 quid odd, depends on how much time and money I can provide at the time (even if it was 10 quid when it came out). The convenience is something I am happy to pay for since I don't have the time, space or patience to go scavenging around for something that old. No doubt I could have excitement searching through dumpsters/bad ebay listings etc, but it's always going to limited and not tend to be what you are looking for (unless you are lucky and have patience). Jelously is something else, because if that seller does have a genuine interest it the 'hobby', then they have found a great work/life balance earning money to support themselves/family doing something they love 😀. Not me personally, I have other skill sets which give more more consistent income, although seeing what some items go for, I wish I bulk purchased loads of storage a number of years ago and started a recycling company myself back then o.0.

For me, my problem (if I had more time), I would like to learn some old API's and do some old demos with strange gfx cards, but this is getting nigh on impossible since collectors cherry-pick/cease all these strange and obscure things, and the ones left probably require TLC outside of my skill set to get working... all I want to do is code 🙁. I've decided to just keep my eyes open, not expect anything and who knows maybe, just maybe get lucky with something in the future.

xplus93 wrote:

yeah IBM is not in silicon valley. If you want to say Intel (or even compaq or apple) invented the modern computer then i'll say there's a bit of truth.

While no doubt there were/have/will be advancements made in 'silicon valley' which contribute to this contraption (and the way I use it) sat here before me. Without knowing what 'modern day computer' is relating too, its difficult to say if any of it is really that fundamental, or came from silicon valley. Most things that I consider fundamental to my modern day computer, were not invented in silicon valley (or even the US for that matter)…. o.0 Just ignore me, I woz feeling trolly that day.

And...

🤣, I can't point anyone here to free GTX980's I'm afraid 😀. A friend did try to unload one off on me last week, so I thought that’s what all the kids were doing these days (my friend is 38). given your responses, perhaps I should have taken it o.0.

For reference, GTX 980 goes for around $200-250 right now. But unfortunately, I think from a collector's POV, the Titan's as where it's at. Or at least a GTX 980 Ti (based on the Titan die).

The Serpent Rider wrote:

Boxed modems fort! With obligatory "No girlz allowed" sign.

I have a single boxed modem, anyone else wanna pitch in? We can do this.

cj_reha wrote:

The Serpent Rider wrote:

Boxed modems fort! With obligatory "No girlz allowed" sign.

I have a single boxed modem, anyone else wanna pitch in? We can do this.

Getting a couple NICs on friday.

xplus93 wrote:

cj_reha wrote:

The Serpent Rider wrote:

Boxed modems fort! With obligatory "No girlz allowed" sign.

I have a single boxed modem, anyone else wanna pitch in? We can do this.

Getting a couple NICs on friday.

EDIT 8/10:

As far as the topic goes. I think what most of us are trying to say is that we want to cut out the middleman.