Kittyboy wrote on 2025-05-25, 16:47:

I am working out a few things, primarily, when I perform a cold power boot with power disconnected overnight, it will boot into the BIOS (see image). This may be because currently I'm running a dual boot setup, MS-DOS 6.22/Win98se?

Did you downgrade the BIOS to the last stable ? Anyway i will test this behaviou aswell, i usually do not turn off the PSU

Standard Def Steve wrote on 2025-05-25, 17:46:

Oh man, I too was thrown off by that 'CPU DRAM back to back transaction' thing when I had my TUV4X.
I could only get that setting to work @ 133MHz FSB with Coppermine CPUs. With Tualatin, it'd only boot at 100MHz.

Based on the brief description of what the setting does, and the fact that Tualatin has a data prefetcher (Coppermine doesn't) I'd wager that Tualatin @ FSB133 is simply too demanding on the memory controller.

Ahahah well..... I used a Coppermine indeed to test the motherboard, and everything went well, then i put the motherboard into a box waiting for other items to complete the build.

One of those was the Tualatin..and i couldn't figure out why the motherboard was behaving weird after the installation, so i was starting to think the CPU Tualatin was the problem, and that was driving me crazy. But 99,9% of the time if a CPU is damaged the PC don't even start...that was driving me crazy

_StIwY_ wrote on 2025-05-25, 18:21:

Did you downgrade the BIOS to the last stable ? Anyway i will test this behaviou aswell, i usually do not turn off the PSU […]
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Kittyboy wrote on 2025-05-25, 16:47:

I am working out a few things, primarily, when I perform a cold power boot with power disconnected overnight, it will boot into the BIOS (see image). This may be because currently I'm running a dual boot setup, MS-DOS 6.22/Win98se?

Did you downgrade the BIOS to the last stable ? Anyway i will test this behaviou aswell, i usually do not turn off the PSU

Standard Def Steve wrote on 2025-05-25, 17:46:

Oh man, I too was thrown off by that 'CPU DRAM back to back transaction' thing when I had my TUV4X.
I could only get that setting to work @ 133MHz FSB with Coppermine CPUs. With Tualatin, it'd only boot at 100MHz.

Based on the brief description of what the setting does, and the fact that Tualatin has a data prefetcher (Coppermine doesn't) I'd wager that Tualatin @ FSB133 is simply too demanding on the memory controller.

Ahahah well..... I used a Coppermine indeed to test the motherboard, and everything went well, then i put the motherboard into a box waiting for other items to complete the build.

One of those was the Tualatin..and i couldn't figure out why the motherboard was behaving weird after the installation, so i was starting to think the CPU Tualatin was the problem, and that was driving me crazy. But 99,9% of the time if a CPU is damaged the PC don't even start...that was driving me crazy

My Pentium Ill-S 1400 is bit taxing I think. I found that clocking down to 1050Hz works better when booting into Win98se. I have not tried a whole lot of gaming yet, I first wanted to get a handle on the new setup first.

I assume you've all run memtest at 133, 100, and tried looser timings, yes?

myne wrote on 2025-05-26, 06:06:

I assume you've all run memtest at 133, 100, and tried looser timings, yes?

I tried some stick of RAM of different brands, like Apacer, Kingston, Siemens......... and tried different timings.....by SPD, manually, CAS 2T, CAS 3T.......etc. Didn't change nothing at 133Mhz bus, impossible even running Win98 setup and most of diagnostic tools

Worth trying memtest.
Try at 100 first.
If that passes, try 133.
If it lasts enough to show a consistent bad byte, there are ways to block it

myne wrote on 2025-05-26, 06:06:

I assume you've all run memtest at 133, 100, and tried looser timings, yes?

No, I have not used any diagnostic tools. I only have The stock 98se currently installed. I have considered downloading some diagnostic software, any suggestions for a layman?

...

Memtest...

Kittyboy wrote on 2025-05-26, 09:50:

myne wrote on 2025-05-26, 06:06:

I assume you've all run memtest at 133, 100, and tried looser timings, yes?

No, I have not used any diagnostic tools. I only have The stock 98se currently installed. I have considered downloading some diagnostic software, any suggestions for a layman?

UBCB 5.3.8 ( latest 5.3.9 don't fit into a CD )

https://www.ultimatebootcd.com/download.html

Or FalconFour CD 4.6.1

https://falconfour.wordpress.com/2013/08/08/f … cd-v4-61-patch/

myne wrote on 2025-05-26, 11:45:

...

Memtest...

Thank you, I'll try it out soon hopefully...

_StIwY_ wrote on 2025-05-27, 08:28:

UBCB 5.3.8 ( latest 5.3.9 doesn't which fit into a CD ) […]
Show full quote

Kittyboy wrote on 2025-05-26, 09:50:

myne wrote on 2025-05-26, 06:06:

I assume you've all run memtest at 133, 100, and tried looser timings, yes?

No, I have not used any diagnostic tools. I only have The stock 98se currently installed. I have considered downloading some diagnostic software, any suggestions for a layman?

UBCB 5.3.8 ( latest 5.3.9 doesn't which fit into a CD )

https://www.ultimatebootcd.com/download.html

Or FalconFour CD 4.6.1

https://falconfour.wordpress.com/2013/08/08/f … cd-v4-61-patch/

Thank you, looks like I have some good options from experienced VOGONS members! 😀

Kittyboy wrote on 2025-05-25, 16:47:

I am working out a few things, primarily, when I perform a cold power boot with power disconnected overnight, it will boot into the BIOS (see image). This may be because currently I'm running a dual boot setup, MS-DOS 6.22/Win98se?

Hello, i confirm that glitch, force booting into the BIOS, so looks like a software glitch. Not really a problem tho, because the settings are kept saved anyway. Did you try the last stable BIOS ?

_StIwY_ wrote on 2025-06-08, 09:44:

Kittyboy wrote on 2025-05-25, 16:47:

I am working out a few things, primarily, when I perform a cold power boot with power disconnected overnight, it will boot into the BIOS (see image). This may be because currently I'm running a dual boot setup, MS-DOS 6.22/Win98se?

Hello, i confirm that glitch, force booting into the BIOS, so looks like a software glitch. Not really a problem tho, because the settings are kept saved anyway. Did you try the last stable BIOS ?

I re-installed a fresh dual boot, it took care of Win98se not recognizing over 64MB of installed memory, I currently run 2x512MB without any issues, but anything over 1Gb memory in Win98 I get funky messages and it does not boot into windows.

Specific to your latest, booting into BIOS when powering on. I do have 6002 BIOS update installed along with a new CMOS battery installed that appears to have fixed the boot problem. I verified 3v with a fresh, new Energizer prior to install. For some reason, the last 'new' same type battery only lasted a week? I was in the practice of powering down, and removing the power source previously, so that may have something to do with the fast drain in battery voltage? However, more likely a short somewhere. I am going to begin testing over time using a new set of batteries recently purchased with current expiration dates, Duracell this time around. The clock should not drain battery power that fast, but I was doing quite a bit of system configurations changes and the standard tinkering around trying to get the system consistent and stable. So far, so good...

I've already gone through two used graphic cards purchased on ebay, DOA. Until I get a good FX-5950 or 9800 card, I will continue using the Matrox G4 32GB. Attached are images of the latest benchmarks low/high resolution 24/32 bit color.

Now that I have my other TR100 with 1GB copper mine almost completed, soon I will be able to start comparing some performance comparisons.

Here is an update:
I've been running my P3-S 1400 on the TUV4X and it seems to be a stable build finally. It is my first system build getting back in the game. I've posted a few images and would like any feedback.

Update: Currently running an FX5500 256, continues to be a pretty good card for the price and availability. I'm waiting for an FX9600 256 to arrive soon and tryout.

One question that still puzzles me, I found that in order for me to successfully run 3DMark 2001se with settings 'game detail high' 32bit color, 1024x768, and antialiasing set to auto, I must also go into the BIOS and limit AGP to 2X and set the aperture to 16? It would seem having such a fast CPU, 1GB 133 memory, I should be able to run 4X running the max 256 setting?

The period games I've tested, such as, 'Max Payne' seem to work very well, but only in 16bit color with low resolution settings. Not that I mind, but I assumed with a ton of memory, good board, and monster CPU, I would overcome some of these limitations? In what ratio are these type games dependent on board memory, CPU, GPU? (See attached)

Anyone care to comment on the 3DMark score, is it good?

Kittyboy wrote on 2025-06-28, 01:29:

max 256 setting?

128Mb
Aperture size recommended around half of videoRAM.

I should be able to run 4X running the

Some glitching.
Are you installed Via 4-in-1 driver?
There are some nuances with VIA AGP drivers for Windows 98.
You need to install a version, not higher than some.
Which one, of course, I don't remember 😀
Or the video card is buggy.

shevalier wrote on 2025-06-28, 04:28:

128Mb Aperture size recommended around half of videoRAM. […]
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Kittyboy wrote on 2025-06-28, 01:29:

max 256 setting?

128Mb
Aperture size recommended around half of videoRAM.

I should be able to run 4X running the

Some glitching.
Are you installed Via 4-in-1 driver?
There are some nuances with VIA AGP drivers for Windows 98.
You need to install a version, not higher than some.
Which one, of course, I don't remember 😀
Or the video card is buggy.

Yes, you are correct, the max aperture setting is 128 NOT 256 in TUV4X BIOS.

The 4-in-1 Via driver installed is OEM disk supplied with board. When installing the driver there is a 'turbo' option that can be selected by the user, I did that. It is my understanding selecting the 'turbo' option enables max 4X capability. This is another area I do not understand? Do all components, GPU, motherboard, CPU need to be 4X capable? Does the 4-in-1 driver enable only the motherboard capability?

If you look at the CPU-Z mainboard page image, note AGP version 3.0. Transfer rate is 2X with a max rate of 4X. While I was experimenting, I discovered if I change the AGP value in BIOS setting on the TUV4X to 4X, then run CPU-Z, it will show 2X transfer rate with a max rate of 2X? weird.... But if I set the mainboard BIOS AGP to 2X CPU-Z shows 2X with 4X max as viewed in the attached image?

If I run higher than 16bit color on the 3DMark test with higher resolutions and performance settings, I can only use a mainboard AGP aperture of 16, otherwise things freeze and get funny. Same goes selecting more or less memory. If I set the main board AGP 32, 64 everything is fine on lower color and resolution. If I am just running plain win98 OS stuff, I can just keep the default 64 without issue. I have 1GB memory, seems I should be able to set the 128 max in BIOS without issue?

I do not claim reference values.

shevalier wrote on 2025-06-28, 12:03:

I do not claim reference values.

Thanks for sharing! Hope to get my Radeon 9600 soon. What was the resolution and bit color settings for the bench marks you posted?

I noticed when I ran benchmarks on my TR100, CPU-Z did not display AGP? I would like to add, I am super impressed with myTR100, the board is one of the best buys I've made so far. The FX-5500 256 is another good buy, trouble free , and well working. I don't know why there is so much hate for the 5500? I think both the TR100 and FX-5500 are underrated or just mis-understood in my short experience.

Kittyboy wrote on 2025-06-28, 14:44:

shevalier wrote on 2025-06-28, 12:03:

I do not claim reference values.

Thanks for sharing! Hope to get my Radeon 9600 soon. What was the resolution and bit color settings for the bench marks you posted?

I noticed when I ran benchmarks on my TR100, CPU-Z did not display AGP? I would like to add, I am super impressed with myTR100, the board is one of the best buys I've made so far. The FX-5500 256 is another good buy, trouble free , and well working. I don't know why there is so much hate for the 5500? I think both the TR100 and FX-5500 are underrated or just mis-understood in my short experience.

1024*768@32bit
As for CPU-Z, I don’t know, I usually look through GPU-Z.

Some time ago there was a topic on the forum "is Radeon 9800 enough for my k6-3"
No, well, if I found K6-3, I would be ecstatic too. 😀
For Windows 98 games, FX 5200/5500 is more than enough. Many even prefer MX440 and don't chase pathos.

Regarding AGP.
With VIA and Windows 98 - it's a complete headache.
The mode is determined
- by the motherboard, VIA694T can do 4X
- by the video card. FX5500 can even do 8X
- by the AGP driver of VIA, for older systems they seem to recommend version 3.12 4.16
Yes, "Turbo" means maximum mode.
- by the video card driver. Some versions of Detonators disabled 4X on all VIA due to problems with some motherboards.
There you also need to select the version.
This also affects AGP texturing, which sometimes does not turn on, sometimes turns on crookedly.
VIA zero bytes AGP memory bug | Navigation thread