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Sound Blaster issues with DOS

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Reply 20 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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Is mem /c /p fine?

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Reply 21 of 47, by wierd_w

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No. Memtest is a specific program. It is usually a companion on most linux USB live images, so that's a convenient place to get a copy.
In addition to that, you can get it on Ultimate BootCD and some other places.

It is used to very thoroughly test RAM in a system.

Reply 22 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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Nice I'll get it when I have a chance. Maybe later today. I got an update on the dos compat sb16 midi emulation: It works with all dos games when run on Windows but when I tried rebooting into dos mode in the starter pack with the drivers in the autoexec, the "NOT loading" message came up. We're making progress though

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Reply 23 of 47, by Demolition-Man

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Unfortunately, not all DOS games work in Windows 98. But maybe all of yours do. Then why bother with the sound under DOS?

Reply 24 of 47, by wierd_w

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Some games "work" and some games "actually work" under win98.

Wizardry 7, for instance, "Works" under win98, but "Does really odd stuff" if you enable actual soundblaster audio.
It works peachy keen in actual dos. (but needs a slowdown utility to avoid an early crash bug.)

Some others, like Ultima 7, will laugh in your face if you try to run under win98. (unless it's inside dosbox)

I'd say the reason to get a properly working dos-mode audio setup, is to "Not have to worry about which ones do and dont work"

Reply 25 of 47, by Demolition-Man

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I've already written about it in another thread here, but I don't want to hijack this one either.
Most but not everything works for me in the combination of DOS and Win 98SE.

For Theme Park (CD) only the intro. Tyrian (&2000) has no sound effects. DOTT has the known problems. A few games: Duke3D, Descent 1 & 2 and maybe a few more, have problems with the SB16 music. It works but becomes increasingly slower. So far I've been lucky and every game that has problems with this has a General MIDI option. That's enough for me, on a PC that was never intended for DOS games.

Reply 27 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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How much longer will memtest take?

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Reply 28 of 47, by feda

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Memtest can take a very long time to fully finish, but you can stop now. You've definitely got bad RAM.

Reply 29 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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Well shit how do I get new ram is any ram type compatible?

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Reply 30 of 47, by feda

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Find out what mobo you have, find the manual online and look up which RAM is compatible. Or just take out your modules and read the stickers.

Reply 31 of 47, by dionb

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Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-08-03, 21:01:

Alright here's the specs straight from Everest Home Edition. I'm running memtest 86+ from some wayback machine page from 2014:
https://web.archive.org/web/20140625111509/ht … 4.20.floppy.zip

Trouble with specs from a tool like this are that the tool can only tell you what it can detect.

In this case it looks lke you haven an Intel CA810 'Cayman' motherboard. That tells us what RAM it takes: PC100 SDRAM. PC133 will also work. Max 512MB total.

What interests me here is that it says: "Intel Cayman CA810 (4 PCI, 2 DIMM, Audio, Video)". Cayman came in three versions with regards to audio: 1) no audio 2) AC'97 CODEC audio 3) onboard SB PCI audio. Both of the latter would be a better bet for DOS audio than that SBLive. Could you confirm which Cayman this is? Just take a look at the system & board. If there are no audio jack connectors on the ATX backplate that's clear (and Everest is wrong). If there are, look in front of the bottom PCI slot. If there's a Creative chip there, you have the SB PCI version, if there's no creative chip (but a rectangular area on silkscreen where it could have been), you should still see a little SigmaTel chip behind the PCI slot. In that case you have a AC'97 audio and can use that under DOS.

But first things first your RAM looks dead. For what it's worth, MEMTEST never stops, for a full test you should leave it running overnight. But as already stated, as soon as you see errors you can stop. There's a high probability that these errors are due to defective (or out-of-spec) RAM. You seem to have two DIMMs in there. Most likely one is bad and one is good. The system only needs a single DIMM to work, so remove one DIMM, run MEMTEST overnight (or until you see errors), then swap and test the other DIMM only. If one never gives errors even after >8h of testing, that one's good. Throw out the one with errors. If *both* give errors, the problem could be with something else (L2 cache on CPU, memory controller on motherboard), but most likely one will come up clean and the other will be clearly bad.

128MB is more than enough for Win98SE (let alone DOS) on a low-end system like this, so even if you want to have more RAM later, you can continue with getting stuff working with a single DIMM.

Reply 32 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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Nice. The pc came with an SB PCI 128. No audio jacks without a card in. Is pure dos hopeless?

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Reply 33 of 47, by dionb

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Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-08-04, 12:38:

Nice. The pc came with an SB PCI 128. No audio jacks without a card in. Is pure dos hopeless?

Ah, this again illustrates why I prefer human-generated specs to some tool, Everest thought there was audio on there.

Not hopeless, once you fix your memory problems it should be possible to get the SBLive running.

In late DOS games that use extenders and so aren't conventional memory-bound and also don't use AdLib FM synth it should work&sound fine. Earlier games that use FM will sound awful though and things that need max conventional memory or do weird things like unreal mode won't work, but that's just par for the course with PCI cards without real OPL core or good emulation that require TSR drivers.

Reply 34 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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So if I get rid of the bad ram it might work?

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Reply 35 of 47, by Demolition-Man

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So an SB128 PCI onboard but no audio connections? Is there a missing bracket? Or have I misunderstood something?

Reply 36 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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No it was a card that I removed to put in the Live! card

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Reply 37 of 47, by Demolition-Man

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Ok, but is there any onboard audio solution?

Did you deactivate all audio options in the BIOS? Audio in general, game/MIDI and other legacy things? Have you also disabled all ports that you don't need? Serial and parallel? I bet you still have the wrong driver.
But as I said, if everything runs from Windows 98, then stick with it.
There are also other usable PCI sound cards such as the ESS Solo 1.

If an AC97 audio solution is onboard, you can also try to work with SBEMU.

But the fact remains that nothing can replace a not-too-fast PC with an ISA sound card for DOS games.

Reply 38 of 47, by Cursed Derp

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What pc would you recommend for games from the Wing Commander era up to half life?

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Reply 39 of 47, by Demolition-Man

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I'm "only" 40 years old, I started with WIng Commander III. I thought you were younger. 😉 If you mean Wing Commander 1 there is a problem. With a PC up to ~500 MHz, as I said with an ISA slot, the limit for Windows is Half Life or Unreal Tournament (UT99). Almost all DOS games that are not too old work. There are a few speed-sensitive games, which unfortunately include Wing Commander 1 & 2(?), won`t work. I only have DOS/WIN 9X Retro PCs, unfortunately a few compromises are always necessary, or several PCs. You can also use tricks and deactivate the cache. L2 and L1. Some CPUs can be easily downclocked using hardware (jumpers) or even software. Unfortunately, that doesn't always work either.
If something absolutely doesn't want to run, you still have the option of using DOSBox on a faster PC.

And sorry, my translation program feels like it's getting worse by the minute.^^