I've never really had issues with USB cables except USB1 vs USB2. My issues have been shitty bridge chips and shitty enclosures.

From my understanding a USB cable is pretty simple. AFAIK, CAT 5 should work.

Wonder if the USB cable that works is similar to shielded twisted pair. Easiest way to find out would be to cut both open to spot the differences.

Most likely the in spec cables have good enough wiring that works as per the usb spec and no more than that.

Frankly I wouldn't trust important data when going out of spec. All it takes is a couple of bits to get flipped randomly.....

I remember reading somewhere that the USB spec didn't allow for extension cables because 'opening up' the twisted pair compromises signal integrity. I take it as a "if it works, good on you 'cause it's by pure luck, but if it doesn't, don't come complaining - it's out of spec". Of course that doesn't stop anyone from selling all sorts of USB extension cables along with other 'helpful' abominations such as 'passive' HDMI to VGA cables, or USB A♀ to A♀.

In my experience most USB extension cables are garbage and barely work. Also, most USB cables are garbage too. I've seen many cheap ones using plain wire instead of twisted pair, and looks are very deceiving - I've seen premium-looking cables that are unreliable as shit and cheapo-looking cables that work flawlessly. Front facing USB ports on cases are another source of trouble, and as DosFreak mentioned, crappy USB-to-anything bridge chips opens up a whole new can of worms.

In the end, it's a miracle that the damned things happen to work most of the time.

1. Nope. Also, keep in mind that manufacturers and resellers tends to put "premium" labels for no reason at all (except charging you more). So I'd find someone that have a "good" cable and ask him... oh, well, it seems you're doing so...

2. You'd better don't try. I guess that "premium" cables (at least those that are really different) use different shielding or twisting, so introducing those changes would cost you (in terms of time) more than buying those cables.

3. Maybe. USB allows (in an ideal world) up to 5 meter cables. But that means ideal USB port coupled with ideal USB cable and ideal USB device. Back in time, cheap USB cards didn't work well with long (=3 meter) cables.

4. Uh... I don't understand what are you trying there. If you're suggesting using ethernet to connect devices, yes, ethernet support longer distances. If you're asking if a USB to ethernet device would work better with those extensions, the answer is no. If the problem is the extension, most devices will fail (again: better quality devices may work).

About USB extensions: you'd better don't use that. Most extensions are prone to get interferences and fail, and (as you're already been warned) connections are not as shielded as the cable. Also, remember that you may have already one extension installed (that cable that route your front USB ports to the motherboard) and it must be added to the total lenght.

I know (and I've seen a few times) some "powered" USB extension cables. Those USB extension cables draw some power from USB port and have a circuit to regenerate the signal. Doing so, they avoid signal loses and allow going further than 5 meter, but they're not cheap. Maybe you're looking for one of those cables.

Also, you can extend your USBs using one good quality powered USB hub between your USB ports and your device. It will regenerate the signal, but USB won't allow you to use cascaded USB hubs.

External USB-powered HDDs are very picky. Generic brands USB cables tend to be very poorly made and perform erratic under stress/high loads. You may have better luck with "premium" brand cables for those uses.

Zup wrote:

1. Nope. Also, keep in mind that manufacturers and resellers tends to put "premium" labels for no reason at all (except charging you more). So I'd find someone that have a "good" cable and ask him... oh, well, it seems you're doing so...

2. You'd better don't try. I guess that "premium" cables (at least those that are really different) use different shielding or twisting, so introducing those changes would cost you (in terms of time) more than buying those cables.

But based on my experience, "premium" USB cable worked, while generic USB cable didn't.

Zup wrote:

3. Maybe. USB allows (in an ideal world) up to 5 meter cables. But that means ideal USB port coupled with ideal USB cable and id […]
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3. Maybe. USB allows (in an ideal world) up to 5 meter cables. But that means ideal USB port coupled with ideal USB cable and ideal USB device. Back in time, cheap USB cards didn't work well with long (=3 meter) cables.

4. Uh... I don't understand what are you trying there. If you're suggesting using ethernet to connect devices, yes, ethernet support longer distances. If you're asking if a USB to ethernet device would work better with those extensions, the answer is no. If the problem is the extension, most devices will fail (again: better quality devices may work).

About USB extensions: you'd better don't use that. Most extensions are prone to get interferences and fail, and (as you're already been warned) connections are not as shielded as the cable. Also, remember that you may have already one extension installed (that cable that route your front USB ports to the motherboard) and it must be added to the total lenght.

I know (and I've seen a few times) some "powered" USB extension cables. Those USB extension cables draw some power from USB port and have a circuit to regenerate the signal. Doing so, they avoid signal loses and allow going further than 5 meter, but they're not cheap. Maybe you're looking for one of those cables.

Also, you can extend your USBs using one good quality powered USB hub between your USB ports and your device. It will regenerate the signal, but USB won't allow you to use cascaded USB hubs.

Okay, let's assume I have to connect USB devices from quite a distance away (long story), which one would be better?

(1) using USB active repeater like this.

(2) using USB to CAT5 or CAT6 like this.

Generally, which one is better? Which one yields stronger signal? Which one is more compatible, especially for devices like audiophile DAC or HOTAS controller like Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog.

Also, how hard it is to crimp your own USB cable? Most USB active repeater cable has 20 meters or so length, while I just need about 5 meters. How hard is it to cut and re-crimp the repeater cable to the needed length? I mean, yes, there is USB crimp and such, but it seems to me USB cable and connector is a fragile thing.

In my experience, the USB active repeater is more reliable/compatible - not on the basis of using it personally, but on the basis of sales vs. returns. Saw less sales and more returns on USB to CAT5 adapters.

Stiletto wrote:

In my experience, the USB active repeater is more reliable/compatible - not on the basis of using it personally, but on the basis of sales vs. returns. Saw less sales and more returns on USB to CAT5 adapters.

I see. I remember reading some articles that praise CAT5 as 'universal extension of everything'; audio interconnects, PS/2 keyboard and mouse, VGA, and USB I guess in practice it isn't as good as in theory.

You can send any signal over twisted pair (up to the bandwidth limit) as long as you have a balun at each end to convert unbalanced to balanced and vice-versa.

The baluns may contain active electronics to make better use of the available bandwidth (350MHz on Cat5e).

USB extensions are very hit or miss at USB2 - they'll usually get away with USB1 speed.
I've had ones that work, ones that don't - thicker cable is usually a good sign.

The other thing, if the main cable is quite long, then it may help to intersperse a hub (even an unpowered hub will still regenerate the data) - if the cable cannot transmit 5V at up to 500mA without unacceptable voltage drop, then it's pretty rubbish.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:

(1) using USB active repeater like this.

Yup. That was the term I was thinking (I'm not english). Active repeaters should provide you more length without interferences (also some powered hubs may act as active repeaters), but don't chain those devices. Use only a repeater/hub between the computer and the device.

Also, I miss that you want to connect a external HDD. If that HDD has its own power supply (like most 3.5 inch HDDs) it probably will work fine, but if it needs USB power (like most 2.5 inch HDDs) it will fail. Active extensions get powered from the bus, and some HDDs will need almost all the power on the bus.

Also, you should rethink about your backup strategy. There are far better devices (ethernet NAS devices)... I think that USB devices should be used only as an interim/emergency solution (i.e.: to get a copy of data on a non working server, or to fill the gap until that fancy DAS arrives), at least on enterprise environments (but I have to reckon that there are more frequent than they should).

SquallStrife wrote:

You can send any signal over twisted pair (up to the bandwidth limit) as long as you have a balun at each end to convert unbalanced to balanced and vice-versa.

The baluns may contain active electronics to make better use of the available bandwidth (350MHz on Cat5e).

Like this one? But Stiletto said they're unreliable, so how do I find reliable USB balun? Which brand would you suggest?

As Matth79 says, give it more juice. It lacks power (mA). "Premium" cables have less power losses, eve due to their length, because of more qiality material/build.

Stojke wrote:

As Matth79 says, give it more juice. It lacks power (mA). "Premium" cables have less power losses, eve due to their length, because of more qiality material/build.

I think an ideal solution would be either an active USB balun, or an active USB repeater connected to a passive balun. It would require certain amounts of DIY, though, at least to shorten the cable of typical USB repeater on the market to the needed length.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:

SquallStrife wrote:

You can send any signal over twisted pair (up to the bandwidth limit) as long as you have a balun at each end to convert unbalanced to balanced and vice-versa.

The baluns may contain active electronics to make better use of the available bandwidth (350MHz on Cat5e).

Like this one? But Stiletto said they're unreliable, so how do I find reliable USB balun? Which brand would you suggest?

They won't carry power any better than a plain USB extension cable, so they're only useful for devices that are powered from the wall, like printers and such.

Even the "active" USB extension cables will have this problem though. They might be able to repeat the signal, but they can't magically power themselves and the device with all the Vdrop involved.