VOGONS


First post, by Holovox

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I'm working on putting together a PC using parts mainly salvaged from a Packard Bell from around 2000. I bought the motherboard new old stock to replace the one from the Packard Bell as it had bulging/leaking capacitors. I hoped I wouldn't encounter issues with a fresh board, but that doesn't seem to be the case. The board is clean and all capacitors look to be in good shape from visual inspection. I've been having issues getting the PC to boot so have thinned down to the fewest and most basic parts necessary to try to eliminate parts. (I'm planning to upgrade when I can actually boot). Spec is as follows:

MSI MS-6309 Lite
733MHz Pentium III (SL3XY) (Socket 370)
128MB PC133 CL3 SDRAM
nVidia Riva TNT2 Pro 32MB (Leadtek Winfast branded)
Mitsumi 3.5" floppy drive

(All parts (CPU, RAM, AGP, floppy) except for motherboard have been tested in other rigs and have been swapped out multiple times with known working components. All cables to peripherals have been swapped too.)

I have also tried various DVD-ROM and CD-ROM/RW drives in there at times to try booting from any of these as I've run out of things to try. I'm not planning on using an HDD eventually. I've used SD to IDE adapters with success on other projects so will be fitting one, but removed to attempt to solve issues.

The issue seems to lie with the motherboard as I have swapped everything else including the PSU trying higher rated PSUs as well. I've also swapped the CMOS battery for a fresh one. All changes have made very little effect. I've tried OEM boot disks and fresh ones written from allbootdisks.com for Windows 98SE. These disks work fine to boot other PCs and have been used in previous projects.

When I turn on the PC I get the graphics card BIOS and then the CPU detection. AMIBIOS then appears and everything appears fine. I'm able to set everything up correctly. When attempting to boot from floppy I get the message "Searching For Boot Record From Floppy..OK" and the drive spins up for a couple of seconds before stopping and a flashing cursor appearing on screen as if it is about to boot, but it hangs on this screen. Nothing I have tried has changed this. Floppy is first in boot order and drive works properly on other PCs. The drive is able to detect if the disk is just a random disk and is not a boot disk and the board promts for the correct disk. I've reconfigured the BIOS several times after clearing CMOS with no change to the issue. All parts I've swapped out make no diference and booting from CD does not work either. No beep codes and diagnostic LEDs on board all indicate everything is fine and the PC is attempting to boot.

One thing I have noticed is in the hardware monitor section of AMIBIOS the 2.5v sits at 2.6v and 3.3v sits at 3.5v. This is the same no matter what PSU I try. I'm wondering if some capacitors on the board may be on their way out and are causing issues with voltage regulation? If anyone has any ideas what may be wrong please let me know. Also let me know if I should just try to get yet another motherboard and abandon this one. I don't have any others to try and I've poured a lot of time into trying to get this project working so would appreciate any advice.

Reply 1 of 11, by Doornkaat

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Do you have any way of externally flashing the latest official BIOS?
Edit: Also what is your current BIOS string?

Reply 2 of 11, by Holovox

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Doornkaat wrote on 2020-05-17, 13:38:

Do you have any way of externally flashing the latest official BIOS?
Edit: Also what is your current BIOS string?

No way of externally flashing BIOS unfortunately.
BIOS string is: 62-1201-000000-00101111-071595-v694v686-1v133001-f
Version shows as: A6309MS V3.2 12012000
Released: 12/01/00

Reply 3 of 11, by Doornkaat

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At least it seems to be the right BIOS string.
Are you sure your don't have another motherboard with the same IC socket avaliable to hot flash the EEPROM?

Reply 4 of 11, by Holovox

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Doornkaat wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:07:

At least it seems to be the right BIOS string.
Are you sure your don't have another motherboard with the same IC socket avaliable to hot flash the EEPROM?

The only other motherboards I have with the same IC socket are the one I'm replacing and another one with leaking caps which hasn't been powered on in over 10 years so neither are particularly suitable. The reason I went for a new old stock board was partly because I don't have working ATX boards like this.

If the only option is flashing the latest version to the EEPROM I may have to resort to finding another board to use unless there are cheap solutions for flashing? If I do aim to get a new board would it be better to just spend more on something I can guarantee works and give up with the MS-6309 or is it likely that flashing the latest BIOS in a cheap board will solve the issue?

Reply 5 of 11, by dionb

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I'm wondering if some capacitors on the board may be on their way out and are causing issues with voltage regulation?

Yes, these boards were notorious for capacitor problems, even when nearly new. I worked at the Packard Bell helpdesk and witnessed the start of the capacitor plague, with these boards and the related 6199VA (Slot 1 version) at the forefront.

So definitely check the capacitors and assume dead until proven otherwise. If you suspect bad voltage regulation, measure the voltages. Tbh you would bave been better off fixing the known capacitor problems on the original board rather than taking (and losing) the gamble on a 'new' 20-year old one...

Reply 6 of 11, by Holovox

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dionb wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:34:

I'm wondering if some capacitors on the board may be on their way out and are causing issues with voltage regulation?

Yes, these boards were notorious for capacitor problems, even when nearly new. I worked at the Packard Bell helpdesk and witnessed the start of the capacitor plague, with these boards and the related 6199VA (Slot 1 version) at the forefront.

So definitely check the capacitors and assume dead until proven otherwise. If you suspect bad voltage regulation, measure the voltages. Tbh you would bave been better off fixing the known capacitor problems on the original board rather than taking (and losing) the gamble on a 'new' 20-year old one...

The original board looked beyond repair or at least beyond what I'm willing to do in terms of repairs (caps had taken to eating the board). The purchase was a little impulsive, should probably have done some more research. The 'new' one had been tested, but without attempting to boot whoever tested it wouldn't necessarily have noticed anything wrong. Thought I'd see if anyone had any opinions before giving up on this board though.

Reply 7 of 11, by CoffeeOne

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Holovox wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:50:
dionb wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:34:

I'm wondering if some capacitors on the board may be on their way out and are causing issues with voltage regulation?

Yes, these boards were notorious for capacitor problems, even when nearly new. I worked at the Packard Bell helpdesk and witnessed the start of the capacitor plague, with these boards and the related 6199VA (Slot 1 version) at the forefront.

So definitely check the capacitors and assume dead until proven otherwise. If you suspect bad voltage regulation, measure the voltages. Tbh you would bave been better off fixing the known capacitor problems on the original board rather than taking (and losing) the gamble on a 'new' 20-year old one...

The original board looked beyond repair or at least beyond what I'm willing to do in terms of repairs (caps had taken to eating the board). The purchase was a little impulsive, should probably have done some more research. The 'new' one had been tested, but without attempting to boot whoever tested it wouldn't necessarily have noticed anything wrong. Thought I'd see if anyone had any opinions before giving up on this board though.

How can you test a board without booting?

Reply 8 of 11, by Holovox

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CoffeeOne wrote on 2020-05-17, 15:02:
Holovox wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:50:
dionb wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:34:

Yes, these boards were notorious for capacitor problems, even when nearly new. I worked at the Packard Bell helpdesk and witnessed the start of the capacitor plague, with these boards and the related 6199VA (Slot 1 version) at the forefront.

So definitely check the capacitors and assume dead until proven otherwise. If you suspect bad voltage regulation, measure the voltages. Tbh you would bave been better off fixing the known capacitor problems on the original board rather than taking (and losing) the gamble on a 'new' 20-year old one...

The original board looked beyond repair or at least beyond what I'm willing to do in terms of repairs (caps had taken to eating the board). The purchase was a little impulsive, should probably have done some more research. The 'new' one had been tested, but without attempting to boot whoever tested it wouldn't necessarily have noticed anything wrong. Thought I'd see if anyone had any opinions before giving up on this board though.

How can you test a board without booting?

What I mean is that the board was listed as tested. Whoever 'tested' the board may have just seen it was able to get to the BIOS screen and assumed that meant the board was working fine so didn't actually attempt to hook up a drive and boot from that drive.

Reply 9 of 11, by CoffeeOne

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Holovox wrote on 2020-05-17, 15:08:
CoffeeOne wrote on 2020-05-17, 15:02:
Holovox wrote on 2020-05-17, 14:50:

The original board looked beyond repair or at least beyond what I'm willing to do in terms of repairs (caps had taken to eating the board). The purchase was a little impulsive, should probably have done some more research. The 'new' one had been tested, but without attempting to boot whoever tested it wouldn't necessarily have noticed anything wrong. Thought I'd see if anyone had any opinions before giving up on this board though.

How can you test a board without booting?

What I mean is that the board was listed as tested. Whoever 'tested' the board may have just seen it was able to get to the BIOS screen and assumed that meant the board was working fine so didn't actually attempt to hook up a drive and boot from that drive.

So you tried only to boot from floppy disk?
Maybe the onboard floppy controller is broken.
Ok, you wrote you tried to boot from CD-drive, too. What happened when you tried that?

This sounds silly, but can you boot from hard disk, maybe you have a small bootable ide disk with MS DOS5.0 (or whatever) around?
Creating a bootable harddisk on another PC should not be a big effort (if not yet available), I would definitely try out.

Reply 10 of 11, by Wolfgang K.

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I know it is some time since this thread has opened but same problem here with a ms-6368. Has anyone a suggestions how to fix this problem?

Reply 11 of 11, by Warlord

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we don't know if OP ever solved the issue, we don't know if he was able to boot from a CD. He just siad he swapped out drives and the computer wont boot, but he didn't emphasize that meant from all types of media.

All he said was he couldn't boot from a floppy and was mainly focused on that. So can you see if you can boot from a CD? If you can boot from a CD than that really narrows the possible issue down.

Op also claimed to have swapped different floppy cables, and different floppy drives. Unless you have tried other floppy cables and drives, and made sure they were plugged in the right way, you may not have the same issue as OP described.

He claimed that he swapped out the Ram as well with known good ram. The only thing he never said he swapped out was the CPU. In my days I have only seen 2-3 CPUs ever bad. But yeah Linus dropped his CPU and broke it and I've recieved a P4 from the factory when it was new not work. Have had CPUs not work right anymore from overclocking too much its very rare.