PhilsComputerLab wrote:

Do you have more? I can put them in a playlist and record the lot.

See the rar in previous post.. you have to add some reset between the songs. I think the lower volume improves set VST quality, hard to say though. Maybe record one pass with volume 40 vs full volume set after reset.

None of them were recorded from the game though. I recall when doing mt32 recordings, I had to use dosbox to capture the midi as otherwise things didn't sound right. So there maybe few mids in these that don't sound right. I mentioned in previous post the ones I suspect to have issues.

avx wrote:

you have to add some reset between the songs. I think the lower volume improves set VST quality, hard to say though. Maybe record one pass with volume 40 vs full volume set after reset.

None of them were recorded from the game though. I recall when doing mt32 recordings, I had to use dosbox to capture the midi as otherwise things didn't sound right. So there maybe few mids in these that don't sound right. I mentioned in previous post the ones I suspect to have issues.

Oh. Too hard, sorry I'm strapped for time at the moment...

Download this: http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=419 (Clicky!).
Inside there will be MT32EMUL.MID that will switch the SC-VA to CM-64 mode.
Or an exe file that does the same: "scmode exe mt32".
Anything else?

This was also mentioned several posts before.
Please try to read the thread or use the search button.

Sorry, but I do not understand what your problem is. What is 'podgruzku' ? Anyway the midi file cnim-mt32 uses only channels 2-8, 10.
Mp3 files: I cannot reproduce the weird sound of munt-vst.mp3. Are you using a player/host that can send SysEx messages properly? Here is my result:
https://youtu.be/Ds0SCgBdDQs

From what I've read here it seems the SC-55 included in this plugin is just the SC-55 'mode' of the SC-88. Is this identical to a real MKII ? I have a standard GS SC-55 1.2 for the games that require capital tone fallback but am wondering if I should try and get an MKII or 55ST or if this plugin is the same as having one. Is the SC55 mode to an MKII what MUNT is to an MT-32/CM32 or is the SC55 mode like the "mt32 mode" that the SC55 has.

MAN-biker wrote:

infiniteclouds wrote:

From what I've read here it seems the SC-55 included in this plugin is just the SC-55 'mode' of the SC-88.

As I know, it's NOT an "emulator of REAL SC-55", but 100% software reincarnation of hardware SC-88.

So, it can do all things which hardware SC-88 can do.

Ah, so then the SC-55 mode on a real SC-88 is basically like MT32 mode of an SC-55 ..not a true emulation like MUNT.

I've been doing some testing of Midi behavior in games:

Doom 1 & 2 will call for GM1 (Reset to General Midi) using a SysEx (F0 7E 7F 09 01 F7) once when you enter doom and once when you quit.
Good programming, an example for all the rest how it should be done.

Duke Nukem 3D will not use any SysEx, instead it sets each parameter one by one like I did with my Reset.mid.
It will use any mode (GS. GM1, GM2) already set; When you quit it will reset only the volume sliders to 88, leaving everything else untouched.
Bad programming, no reset command so unused parameters will stay as is and may effect the sound of other games.
If you played Doom before, you stuck in GM1/GM2 Mode.

Warcraft 1 & 2 worse than Duke Nukem 3D, it will set each parameter to default one by one without a reset command.
When you quit it will not touch anything and leave the sliders as is.

Simcity 2000: will properly send reset Sysex command (F0 41 10 16 12 7F 00 00 01 00 F7) for old D-110/MT-32 type synths (checked the manuals).
Although newer Sound Canvas (including SC-VA) will not understand them thus do nothing.
Excellent programming for the MT-32 and nothing else.

To test these I actually started recording in my DAW before running a game and stopped after quiting,
afterwards I analyzed the events of the recording to see what midi commands the game calls for.

As you can see, games had no standard as to how to actually program the midi code so each manufacturer did what seemed to him correct or straight forward worked for the particular model he used.
Some use SysEx command to reset and change midi modes, some just manually move all the basic sliders on each channel to default position.
And we have the age factor, so not every old command will work even with the hardware Sound Canvas.

To conclude;
Based on this information that the game developers themselves used whatever they felt like at the time, I will use a better method.... My method. 😊
Just filter out (disable) the Sysex and Controller (0,32) in SAVIHost and use my reset midi for best results and the most expected behavior with every game.
If the SC-VA resembles the behavior of the real hardware, you might want to use this reset.mid with the real sound canvas hardware too.

While the emulation seems decent, it's useful to know that Roland clearly mentions the following on their website:

"The Sound Canvas VA is not designed to play Standard MIDI Files. Depending on the data in your music files and how it’s processed with the host application, the mix balance, tone, and timing may vary slightly from the sound of the original hardware."

James-F wrote:

Midi IS Sound Canvas.

No. General MIDI is Sound Canvas. MIDI as in "pre-1992 MIDI" is MT-32 (as far as home computer music is concerned, obviously).

James-F wrote:

Midi IS Sound Canvas.

No. General MIDI is Sound Canvas. MIDI as in "pre-1992 MIDI" is MT-32 (as far as home computer music is concerned, obviously).

IMHO General MIDI is the standard all of the cheapest and most basic sound cards had to comply, including the horrendous Roland-supplied Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth and Apple's QuickTime. Sound Canvas is actually the Roland GS, in which most MIDI supporting games were composed. And Yamaha had it's competing standard, the Yamaha XG. Remember these modules were not made for gamers. They were made for composers (including game composers) that could afford a 600 dollar peripheral in addition to their 2000 USD MMPC and their 500 USD MIDI controller. Today's Master Race is centered around multiple GPU's. Back in the day what separated the peasants from the elite was the sound card.

And here there is idea. What else combine works ? I mean Roland SoundCanvas VA and MUNT in one big Roland software synthesizer ?
Maybe we get full correct MT-32 emulator and SoundCanvas emulator )

James-F
All the same, bug detected ) yes , only just in GM mode ) error with drum select ) when use GM mode , must have only Standard Drum kit.
https://temp-share.com/f/lcxfrhhpcl/2f3be25c4 … 62e3ed9f8ececa0

Nothing complicated at all.

Watch this "Roland MT-32 CM-32L and General MIDI for $50" video by PhilsComputerLab:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvuncHhza5A

To use with real retro PC and SC-55 hardware:
Instead of Midi-OX use Falcosoft Midi Player and set it's Midi-Input to your USB-MIDI IN and Midi-Output to your USB-MIDI OUT.
It even loads soundfonts using bassmidi so you save yet another software.

Connect the USB-MIDI OUT to your SC-55 or any other midi synth.

To use CTF follow this step by step post (mainly step 3):
Falcosoft Soundfont Midi Player + Munt VSTi + BassMidi VSTi

Feel free to look at my "Super GM" mode from my fork of Munt. It supports a full 16 channel mode, in which the remaining super parts are distributed among the channels not selected by the SysEx message, resulting in full 16 channel support. It also modifies the pitch bend range to work in units of semitones/cents, and defaults to two semitones.

foo_midi uses this mode, plus the GM patch set, when output is configured to Munt and the current file does not contain any MT-32 commands.

It also supports many more MIDI formats, as well as multiple methods of signaling loop start and/or end offsets. The only thing it doesn't do for loops is unroll the post-loop messages onto the loop start. I may work on that some day.

Falcosoft
What prevents the to make copies load two Munt setting up a 1-8 + 10 + 11-16?
What be with SYSex ?
This don't work.

Play with SAVIHost

I offer load two copies MT-32 VSTi
Configure firs copy as Channels 1-8,10
Configure two copyas Channels 9,11-16
And fix bug with no correct work sysex

->Falcosoft
Please add in Your MT-32 VST Synth automaticaly FLAT GM channels in GM mode with one runned copy ) I mean channel structure 1-16 channels by default with all working channels.

I think the SC-88 series outputs at 32 kHz (like the MT-32), but chances are your sound board/chip doesn't support this sample rate.

The buffer determines the threshold between sound quality and sound lag. A small buffer will make your synth play in near real time but with possible audio cracks, a large buffer will ensure a smooth playback but with possible lag between the notes and the sound itself (if you're using a MIDI keyboard for example).

Please refer to this thread by Falco for an indepth explanation. I'm personally using a sample rate of 48 kHz and a buffer of 300 samples (the same values as your screenshot) with good results.

JSO wrote:

The Lost Vikings sounds great, also Doom 2, Day of the Tentacle, Sam & Max and the 7th Guest! Using DOSBox and ScummVM.

The Lost Vikings sounds better with MT-32 in setup and MUNT as synth.

Is this only available as payware or is there a freeware or trialware version?

I lost my midi ports and likely my auxiliary audio inputs several months ago due to a new power supply smoking them along with all five of my hard drives. 😐 And with my wife's ridiculous ongoing medical bills from her chronic illness, I'm broke, but would like to enjoy some SC-55 goodness. I can look at mine, sitting atop my MT-32, but neither can communicate with my PC at the moment.

Mr_Blastman wrote:

Is this only available as payware or is there a freeware or trialware version?

I lost my midi ports and likely my auxiliary audio inputs several months ago due to a new power supply smoking them along with all five of my hard drives. 😐 And with my wife's ridiculous ongoing medical bills from her chronic illness, I'm broke, but would like to enjoy some SC-55 goodness. I can look at mine, sitting atop my MT-32, but neither can communicate with my PC at the moment.

There's a trial version but it only works for 15 minutes at a time. If you want it for longer than that, you gotta pay.

Anyone knows how their D-50 VSTi plugin fares for the MT-32 part?

Trelokk wrote on 2022-02-07, 14:28:

Double post alert, mods beware! :P […]
Show full quote

Double post alert, mods beware! 😜

So now I have downloaded the OFFICIAL version of the plugin through the Roland Cloud. Remaining questions:
1) Roland Cloud will have to remain installed for as long as you want to use the SoundCanvas VA? (If I understand correctly, it's needed for "occasional" authentication checks of the plugin.)
2) After the trial membership of 1 month has expired (which you have to cancel actively, otherwise it continues and will cost), I guess the SCVA will no longer be available for free and a Lifetime Key has to be purchased?

If it's really like that, the S-YXG50 has clear advantages due to its portability (besides the fact it has good sound and is available for free). On the plus side, latest SCVA seems to work with the new VSTDriver without the need of LoopMIDI or anything else (besides the Roland Cloud software, that is).

Side note: The guy from shopvst.com really had the balls to reply to my complaint email, claiming that what he is selling on that website is the "complete version". Complete my a$$. Hoping for Paypal to work their refund magic once again here. And another memo @ self, hopefully it will sink in this time: If it's too cheap, it's not real...

1. Yes, you need to buy it after all. The demo version can be used in "portable mode" for 10 minute periods .Just save the content of "C:\Program Files (x86)\Roland\Sound Canvas VA"folder. Then you should uninstall the demo and remove other Roland related folders. Copy your saved folder anywhere and then you can use SC-VA in infinite trial mode.
2. Yes, S-YXG50 is much simpler to use, and more versatile. It even has TG300B mode (which is a full GS implementation) that has GS variation tones together with MT-32 compatibility bank and drum set. It sounds good but it just simply does not sound as a Roland Sound Canvas. At all 😀