VOGONS


A NOT-SO EPIC Dual Pentium Pro Build

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Reply 120 of 167, by Irinikus

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luckybob wrote on 2024-02-03, 15:45:

nope.

the scsi drives you have are too fast, that cache will never get any use.

its 110% dick waving.

Thanks for the input!

There's no point in spending fruitlessly, so in that case I’ll stay with the FPM that’s fitted.

Last edited by Irinikus on 2024-02-03, 16:18. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 121 of 167, by Sphere478

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Irinikus wrote on 2024-02-03, 10:29:
I'm considering this RAM for this card! (I'll only make the purchase once the machine is fully assembled and running) […]
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I'm considering this RAM for this card! (I'll only make the purchase once the machine is fully assembled and running)

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This is the only 50NS 128MB SIMM I could find and my only question is whether SIMM's for the Amiga Blizzard 1230IV 1230 IV are standard 72-pin memory? (This is obviously not ECC emory)

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My card is currently fitted with a 60ns 128MB ECC FPM SIMM. Would it be worth swapping this out for a 50ns 128MB non-ECC EDO SIMM?

Careful, 50 and 40ns can be 3.3v

luckybob wrote on 2024-02-03, 15:45:

nope.

the scsi drives you have are too fast, that cache will never get any use.

its 110% dick waving.

“Because it is cool” is basically how we sum up our hobby.

Last edited by Sphere478 on 2024-02-03, 16:57. Edited 1 time in total.

Sphere's PCB projects.
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Sphere’s socket 5/7 cpu collection.
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SUCCESSFUL K6-2+ to K6-3+ Full Cache Enable Mod
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Tyan S1564S to S1564D single to dual processor conversion (also s1563 and s1562)

Reply 122 of 167, by PcBytes

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Sphere478 wrote on 2024-02-03, 16:01:

“Because ir is cool” is basically how we sum up our hobby.

Summed up the logic behind me going for 2x 10K RPM drives (WD Raptor 74GB boot drive + Seagate Cheetah 36GB storage) in my dual Coppermine build better than I could 😁

"Enter at your own peril, past the bolted door..."
Main PC: i5 3470, GB B75M-D3H, 16GB RAM, 2x1TB
98SE : P3 650, Soyo SY-6BA+IV, 384MB RAM, 80GB

Reply 123 of 167, by Irinikus

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Sphere478 wrote on 2024-02-03, 16:01:

“Because ir is cool” is basically how we sum up our hobby.

Speccing these things to the max, in a way which matters is my aim here. (I want to experience what these machines were capable of in a meaningful way, and have fun while doing so!)

So, I'm personally aiming for optimisation above all else! (And don't get me wrong, I'm all for generating maximum heat in the process! 😀 )

My Pentium II Overdrive's proof of this, with it's SLI Voodoo2 setup and RAID 0 15K RPM drive setup!

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Reply 124 of 167, by PcBytes

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I did my dual Coppermine-10k build out of curiosity at first.
Then I somehow went deeper with how far can I get it decked out - that's how I ended up with a 74GB Raptor over a SATA2IDE adapter and a 36GB Seagate Ultra 320 10k SCSI68pin storage drive.
If the PSU wasn't my limitation for the time being, I'd be rocking a 9700 or a 9800 at the very least.
I also had HD series AGP cards in mind, but from what I've heard these don't run too well on VIA chipsets. (due to using a bridge chip)

(btw sorry if I somehow derailed the thread too much!)

"Enter at your own peril, past the bolted door..."
Main PC: i5 3470, GB B75M-D3H, 16GB RAM, 2x1TB
98SE : P3 650, Soyo SY-6BA+IV, 384MB RAM, 80GB

Reply 125 of 167, by Irinikus

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PcBytes wrote on 2024-02-03, 17:24:
I did my dual Coppermine-10k build out of curiosity at first. Then I somehow went deeper with how far can I get it decked out - […]
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I did my dual Coppermine-10k build out of curiosity at first.
Then I somehow went deeper with how far can I get it decked out - that's how I ended up with a 74GB Raptor over a SATA2IDE adapter and a 36GB Seagate Ultra 320 10k SCSI68pin storage drive.
If the PSU wasn't my limitation for the time being, I'd be rocking a 9700 or a 9800 at the very least.
I also had HD series AGP cards in mind, but from what I've heard these don't run too well on VIA chipsets. (due to using a bridge chip)

(btw sorry if I somehow derailed the thread too much!)

That's one of the things that makes this hobby so enjoyable, "your plans get bolder as you go! "

And never forget that you can always revisit older builds in the future, when the opportunity to acquire the parts that you couldn't at that time presents itself !

This is all part of the fun! 😀

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Reply 126 of 167, by CoffeeOne

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luckybob wrote on 2024-02-01, 14:49:

if you need more PCI slots, you can always find the big brother to that board...

https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/asus-p-i-p65up8
Bitchin' dual p-pro setup

I am happy that you could beat the OP in the "dick waving contest".
Sorry, could not resist.

Reply 127 of 167, by Irinikus

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CoffeeOne wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:33:
luckybob wrote on 2024-02-01, 14:49:

if you need more PCI slots, you can always find the big brother to that board...

https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/asus-p-i-p65up8
Bitchin' dual p-pro setup

I am happy that you could beat the OP in the "dick waving contest".
Sorry, could not resist.

It's not a dick waving contest!

An unnecessary comment such as that says something about your character more than anything! (You always get that one person who tries his level best to get a conflict started!) I'm not in the mood for a conflict, but I can tell you that this build of mine will be and absolutely beautiful Pentium Pro machine!

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Reply 129 of 167, by luckybob

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There's ALWAYS a bigger fish.

if I roll out my ALR machine, someone will roll up with the full-rack machine with like 30+ ppro chips.

I would LOVE to see someone else find a P/I-p65UP8.

It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes.

Reply 130 of 167, by Irinikus

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luckybob wrote on 2024-02-03, 20:47:

I would LOVE to see someone else find a P/I-p65UP8.

I'm certainly not going argue that point, as that's a pretty darn rare piece of hardware you have over there, and props to you for owning one! (I mean the in the best possible way)

No one can have everything that's possible to be had, so people must learn to be happy with what they've got, and rather than covert what others have, learn to appreciate, and be inspired in that way. (If you hadn't shown me your board, I wouldn't have known that such a thing exists, as most of the pics on the web show your board!)

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Reply 131 of 167, by luckybob

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I was working at a computer recycling center circa 2002 and I found a P65UP5 and I took that system home. Instantly fell in love. It became my first home-made router. There was quite a lot of grandstanding on EOCF and 2CPU forums about that. When I updated the bios, i saw the UP8 on the Asus website and since that time, I've only ever found the one board. I was a bit salty at paying $300 for the UP8. I'm SO VERY happy I did. now.

So the UP5 & UP8 hold a special place in my heart.

It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes.

Reply 132 of 167, by PcBytes

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The moment you find a board and ponder whether you paid too much or not will always hold a place in my memories.

Did I pay too much for a BP6+CPUs+heatsinks in my country's currency? Likely yes.
Do I regret it? Not at all, knowing these get more scarce by each year.

"Enter at your own peril, past the bolted door..."
Main PC: i5 3470, GB B75M-D3H, 16GB RAM, 2x1TB
98SE : P3 650, Soyo SY-6BA+IV, 384MB RAM, 80GB

Reply 133 of 167, by Irinikus

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I believe it's important to have an emotional connection with the things you collect! Everything you collect should have meaning to you!

What people collect and more importantly why they collect them speaks volumes as to who and what they are as beings! (We are defined by the choices we make!)

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Reply 134 of 167, by H3nrik V!

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luckybob wrote on 2024-02-03, 15:45:

nope.

the scsi drives you have are too fast, that cache will never get any use.

its 110% dick waving.

Ain't this hobby too some extent about just that? 😎

Please use the "quote" option if asking questions to what I write - it will really up the chances of me noticing 😀

Reply 135 of 167, by CoffeeOne

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Irinikus wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:43:
CoffeeOne wrote on 2024-02-03, 19:33:
luckybob wrote on 2024-02-01, 14:49:

if you need more PCI slots, you can always find the big brother to that board...

https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/asus-p-i-p65up8
Bitchin' dual p-pro setup

I am happy that you could beat the OP in the "dick waving contest".
Sorry, could not resist.

It's not a dick waving contest!

An unnecessary comment such as that says something about your character more than anything! (You always get that one person who tries his level best to get a conflict started!) I'm not in the mood for a conflict, but I can tell you that this build of mine will be and absolutely beautiful Pentium Pro machine!

That should have been a joke, I personally found it very funny.
More on topic: I really enjoy to read your postings.
I think your approach is to take a high end motherboard and then try to put it in the most high end parts that will work in the system, no matter about period correctness.
So you really contribute something to the internet community, not "just swinging your dick around" (I really like this formulation, sorry): By making good pictures of the system and all of its components. I really appreciate it.
Especially when it is about rare hardware, it is very hard to find useful pictures ....
I hope Vogons keeps hosting them. Nothing is forever unfortunately. When it is about vintage hardware, searching on Vogons gives the best results in the majority of cases IMHO.
Off-topic:
As I am interested in 486 machines mostly, are you also interested in creating a super high end 486 build? That has to be EISA of course. The fastest 486 mainboards most likely came out 1996, so they were super low end.
Of course you have to fool around with floppy disks for the ECU, EISA is weird. There are some EISA Wide SCSI Cache Controllers from DPT, that would fit into such a system. I never have seen such a controller on Ebay. Super rare.

Reply 136 of 167, by Irinikus

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CoffeeOne wrote on 2024-02-03, 22:46:

That should have been a joke, I personally found it very funny.

I understand, I didn't get the humour initially! (For that I do apologise!)

The interesting thing about PC is that period correctness is difficult to define, as many people push their systems for a long time and through many upgrade cycles before retiring them. (In the case of my Dual P4 Xeon build I went absolutely crazy, with the goal of seeing how far I could push it, especially considering the net burst architecture was such a lemon.)

I'd like some of my systems to be completely period specific and others, such as this build to be a mixture of the old and the new. (As older hardware does look nice in a modern chassis, allowing for better cable management, which simply wasn't possible back in the day, as well as a way to better display the hardware itself, as most, if not all beige cases were completely closed.)

In the case of this system, most of the hardware is period specific, excluding the case, power supply and the drives (As they are the later SCSI variety, however the RAID card that I've chosen is period specific and features the same chipset as the controller on @luckybob's P/I-p65UP8.) In the case of the Voodoo5 5500 PCI (If I can get it to run in this system), such a card would only really have made sense in a system such as this one, as who in their right mind would have run a PCI graphics card if they had an AGP slot available? (Such a card was more than likely produced to extend the life of systems such as this one.)

My first PC was a 486 DX4 100 and I still have that very machine! So the 486 also has a very special place in my heart! I’ll never forget the day my family got that machine, it was probably one of the best days of my life! (This was in the 1994.)

The chip sitting on the top left of the system is the Cyrix CPU:

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I haven’t got to playing around with it from a hardware point of view yet. It originally came fitted with a Cyrix 486 DX4 100 CPU which I swapped out for an AMD back in the day, as a friend suggested that the AMD was better. I still have both CPU’s and will at some point benchmark the system to see what the difference between the two chips is, if any!

The system’s also fitted with a Creative SoundBlaster 16-Bit, quad-speed Creative CD-ROM and 32MB of RAM. The system doesn’t have any cache chips fitted, so I’d like to change that!

I also think that it may deserve one of these:

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I will definitely keep this machine period specific.

Seeing that this machine of mine lacks a PCI bus, I’d like to collect another one which does feature one. I’d like to collect a Gateway for this purpose, as I think they looked really cool!

I think that these systems are absolutely gorgeous:

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Reply 137 of 167, by CoffeeOne

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Irinikus wrote on 2024-02-03, 23:17:
I understand, I didn't get the humour initially! (For that I do apologise!) […]
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CoffeeOne wrote on 2024-02-03, 22:46:

That should have been a joke, I personally found it very funny.

I understand, I didn't get the humour initially! (For that I do apologise!)

The interesting thing about PC is that period correctness is difficult to define, as many people push their systems for a long time and through many upgrade cycles before retiring them. (In the case of my Dual P4 Xeon build I went absolutely crazy, with the goal of seeing how far I could push it, especially considering the net burst architecture was such a lemon.)

I'd like some of my systems to be completely period specific and others, such as this build to be a mixture of the old and the new. (As older hardware does look nice in a modern chassis, allowing for better cable management, which simply wasn't possible back in the day, as well as a way to better display the hardware itself, as most, if not all beige cases were completely closed.)

In the case of this system, most of the hardware is period specific, excluding the case, power supply and the drives (As they are the later SCSI variety, however the RAID card that I've chosen is period specific and features the same chipset as the controller on @luckybob's P/I-p65UP8.) In the case of the Voodoo5 5500 PCI (If I can get it to run in this system), such a card would only really have made sense in a system such as this one, as who in their right mind would have run a PCI graphics card if they had an AGP slot available? (Such a card was more than likely produced to extend the life of systems such as this one.)

My first PC was a 486 DX4 100 and I still have that very machine! So the 486 also has a very special place in my heart! I’ll never forget the day my family got that machine, it was probably one of the best days of my life! (This was in the 1994.)

The chip sitting on the top left of the system is the Cyrix CPU:

My IBM 486-3.jpg

My IBM 486 - cover removed left-2.jpg

I haven’t got to playing around with it from a hardware point of view yet. It originally came fitted with a Cyrix 486 DX4 100 CPU which I swapped out for an AMD back in the day, as a friend suggested that the AMD was better. I still have both CPU’s and will at some point benchmark the system to see what the difference between the two chips is, if any!

The system’s also fitted with a Creative SoundBlaster 16-Bit, quad-speed Creative CD-ROM and 32MB of RAM. The system doesn’t have any cache chips fitted, so I’d like to change that!

I also think that it may deserve one of these:

190202153812_Perceptive 1200.jpg

I will definitely keep this machine period specific.

Seeing that this machine of mine lacks a PCI bus, I’d like to collect another one which does feature one. I’d like to collect a Gateway for this purpose, as I think they looked really cool!

I think that these systems are absolutely gorgeous:

1_b3d9ada9351496d44338285cb2fbe358.jpg

Great that you kept your original first 486. I think many Vogoners did give away their first computer long time ago.
My first PC (year 1993) was a quite weird 486DX 33, 4MB RAM, and a 512kB ISA graphics card (cannot remember the brand), 210MB Connor harddisk, 14" CRT. I soon upgraded to a ET4000 with 1MB and added a damned expensive Creative SB Pro. And so on, ....
I kept nothing of it 🙁
The mainboard was interesting:
It was a huge PCChips mainboard ISA only with UMC chipset. It had the amazing amount of 16 30 pin SIMM slots, so 4 banks.
Also the cache configuration was weird: The normal 8 times 28pin sockets for data and 1 time 28 pin socket for the tag ram (so maximum cache = 256kB). Plus additional one 22pin socket for dirty tag ram (for 16kx4 if I remember correctly) AND then another 20pin socket (for a 16kx1) for a cacheable area > 16MB 😁
I never have seen this board again in the wilderness.
But anyway, the board was slow, I would have needed to either modify the Bios or to search for a compatible Bios, the Ami Bios did not allow to set good timing parameters.
EDIT: I now remember the type of graphics chip on the original ISA card: It was a Trident 8900 (or similar) 😁

Reply 138 of 167, by Irinikus

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My RAM, CPU Coolers and 15K RPM SCSI disks arrived today:

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So I pretty much have all I need to build this system, besides the InWin X-Frame 2.0! (However My PowerMac G3's a bit of a diversion!)

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Reply 139 of 167, by liqmat

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Irinikus wrote on 2024-03-08, 13:03:

My RAM, CPU Coolers and 15K RPM SCSI disks arrived today:

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So I pretty much have all I need to build this system, besides the InWin X-Frame 2.0! (However My PowerMac G3's a bit of a diversion!)

ooooh... shiny. Always fun to get new toys in the mail!