VOGONS


First post, by Nexxen

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Hello!

I got this board for the sole purpose of repairing it or at least try doing so.
Mainly I'm reporting back on my progress, and ask for some feedback when something isn't straightforward (mostly a "how to proceed").

It's going to take some time as it is a slow project.

Edit: repaired and working.
https://youtu.be/G2uS0BaOtpM

A big thank you to The Retro Web, source of a lot of stuff of invaluable help.

So far:

1) removed the battery and neutralized;
2) cleaned the board twice;
3) polished corroded traces and rebuilt;
4) some solder mask applied;
5) chipset desoldered + cleaning and polish

- desolder all that is in the way for trace polishing: caps, keyb connector, jumper pins...
- polish, clean traces
- a ton of continuity tests 😀
- desolder or try to reflow chipset pins: as much as 30 + a few are soldered to pads that have the trace under the chip itself: I fear ripping it as that would be hard to repair.
- polish legs of chipset
- rebuild broken pads + traces

- anchor wires & traces & pads
-resoldered all the components replacements (new)

To do (in progress):

xx

Last edited by Nexxen on 2024-12-15, 11:40. Edited 13 times in total.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 1 of 53, by Nexxen

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After cleaning:

many traces appear gone but it's just the corrosion under the solder mask that "bubbled" up.
I'll have to polish, tin and rebuild a bunch of these.

A few legs of the chipset aren't making contact, I'll probably have to desolder it and repair pads.

In order to have enough room to work on it I can't but remove a lot of components (caps, isa slot) and probably the keyboard chip.

Doubt:

many smd caps and res solder joints are dull, can I just put some fresh solder to make them shiny? Is it necessary? - I don't think so but...

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 2 of 53, by Nexxen

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Ram:

4 chips were present: 41256 in parity sockets. Ram chips aren't, probably they were removed and parity left behind.
4 SIPP ram sticks, 2x 44256 + 1x 41256; I guess 1MB in total.

https://theretroweb.com/motherboard/manual/30068.pdf

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 3 of 53, by Nexxen

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In order to desolder the chipset I thought using some low temp solder (I have 135 and 180 °C).

Why desolder it?
If pads are broken I need to rebuild them, and or polish traces and tin + solder mask them.

After some thinking I'll start repairing the traces on the back as I have all the room possible.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 4 of 53, by Nexxen

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After another round of vinegar and soap,

- the chipset ic needs desoldering and resoldering to clean the legs and restore the pads on the m/b: there is a white patina I can't get rid of in any way, contact cleaner does close to nothing;
- a lot of traces I first thought were busted in fact had the solder mask lifted and thus are still making a connection; only tinning is required;
- solder of the affected area is dull, would it be best to desolder-resolder with fresh solder?

Any comment or opinion is welcome.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 5 of 53, by rasz_pl

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I was expecting U5 legs breaking off after cleaning, so thats good I guess 😉 Vias look really thick and strong. Is the PCB 4 layer?

https://github.com/raszpl/FIC-486-GAC-2-Cache-Module for AT&T Globalyst
https://github.com/raszpl/386RC-16 memory board
https://github.com/raszpl/440BX Reference Design adapted to Kicad
https://github.com/raszpl/Zenith_ZBIOS MFM-300 Monitor

Reply 6 of 53, by Nexxen

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rasz_pl wrote on 2023-09-07, 18:47:

I was expecting U5 legs breaking off after cleaning, so thats good I guess 😉

I was already planning to dremel the chip's broken pins and solder thin wires to pads.
And I was expecting pads to go bye bye to another dimension.
Yes, it looked awful but in the end it was just that. Even if some solder joints are simply dead from corrosion.

U4 wasn't that much better either... Got lucky I guess.

rasz_pl wrote on 2023-09-07, 18:47:

Vias look really thick and strong. Is the PCB 4 layer?

PCB is 2mm thick, counted 8 dotted lines between the surfaces (if you look directly). Probably 4 layers; no, I can't count layers 🙁

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 7 of 53, by Nexxen

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U5 is a LM358

I used a fiber glass pen to remove all the corroded patches and traces.
It took forever.
My dremel is dead, I absolutely need to buy a new one. I now understand why it is a must.

I tinned all the exposed traces and I'll cover them with solder mask.

---

I started to remove some through hole components but corroded solder ain't too easy though.
Plain boring.

After examining the chipset legs I discovered that a few are soldered to a loose pad on the motherboard, this makes it more difficult as I have to avoid ripping the pads .
Anchoring them isn't impossible but time is really flying by doing all this work.

---

All the smds that were affected by the leakage must be desoldered and resoldered as they come off pretty easy.
I don't have spares for all values, thus I'll clean the ones I don't have in stock. Not that I have the stock of a pro shop either 😀

Last edited by Nexxen on 2023-10-17, 02:23. Edited 1 time in total.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 8 of 53, by Nexxen

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more work

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 9 of 53, by Nexxen

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more yet

After all the traces I'll try reflowing all the legs.
If it doesn't work I'll then desolder it and check what's under it.

I scraped the legs and the pads and are now shining.
Hope it just works 😀

Any advice is welcome!!!

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 10 of 53, by Nexxen

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I have to find a way to make the corrosion patina on the legs and pads to be removed.

As a first idea I can only see mechanic action, or some acid. But what?

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 12 of 53, by Nexxen

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rasz_pl wrote on 2023-09-09, 20:39:

in theory flux should help remove oxidation

I tried 3 different brands, nothing.
I used my fiber glass pen and it did somehting but I got a full cm off.
We'll see later.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 13 of 53, by Nexxen

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Nope, it takes forever to just do one leg.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 14 of 53, by Nexxen

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New stuff.

Desoldered the chipset IC.

Pin 105 looks not connected, but datasheet has a function for it:
https://4donline.ihs.com/images/VipMasterIC/I … EF6B88F2AEB20B8

Does anyone know what's it for? Is it correct to be not connected?

Last edited by Nexxen on 2023-09-14, 14:40. Edited 1 time in total.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 15 of 53, by ChrisXF

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I've had luck removing pin oxidization with Silvo (liquid silver polish) and in some odd cases Brasso (same deal but made for brass).

Might be worth a go?

Reply 16 of 53, by Nexxen

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ChrisXF wrote on 2023-09-13, 01:47:

I've had luck removing pin oxidization with Silvo (liquid silver polish) and in some odd cases Brasso (same deal but made for brass).

Might be worth a go?

This is an idea. Ok, pads on m/b was easy, fiberglass pen and it was fast.
The chipset actually has a sh*tload of oxide on the legs, the fiberglass works to an extent.

I'll look for something in that range and update.
Thanks!

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 17 of 53, by rasz_pl

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or for the price of chemicals you could buy brand new [1pcs] VL82C331-FC Bus Controller QFP160 US $8.15 from Poland.

https://github.com/raszpl/FIC-486-GAC-2-Cache-Module for AT&T Globalyst
https://github.com/raszpl/386RC-16 memory board
https://github.com/raszpl/440BX Reference Design adapted to Kicad
https://github.com/raszpl/Zenith_ZBIOS MFM-300 Monitor

Reply 18 of 53, by Nexxen

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rasz_pl wrote on 2023-09-13, 02:15:

or for the price of chemicals you could buy brand new [1pcs] VL82C331-FC Bus Controller QFP160 US $8.15 from Poland.

Too easy. Won't fit. 🤣
My point is to learn from this.

And I already have the stuff, no expenses.

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios

Reply 19 of 53, by Nexxen

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I rebuilt traces/pads.
Now I need to anchor them. Some with solder mask others probably epoxy. IDK

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios