I recommend the IDE to SATA converter, which is what I use. Use something with the Marvell chip and don't forget to enable UDMA in Windows 98.

Keep in mind that anything you put in PCI will share 133Mb/s bus with every other card. Integrated PATA, SATA, LAN and USB on P4 motherboards are connected directly to a south bridge proprietary bus with better bandwidth (266Mb/s or higher).

The Serpent Rider wrote on 2024-01-11, 17:36:

Keep in mind that anything you put in PCI will share 133Mb/s bus with every other card. Integrated PATA, SATA, LAN and USB on P4 motherboards are connected directly to a south bridge proprietary bus with better bandwidth (266Mb/s or higher).

yes, but "consecutivde transfer" is not the primary goal, is a huge fast acces, even if i do 50 ms/s on ssd the difference between a regular hard disk is massive. the question is: use a SSD is better via the integrated 133udma ide channel ora using a more modernd SATA chip integrated in some fastrack PCI card?

Here's my PCChips M930, SiS 645, DDR, and a 2.8 533 P4 with an inexpensive SSD using the onboard IDE with an adapter. This is lightning fast with Windows 98.

ok, let's start with the cheap ide to sata, can you post me an example of the models i need to buy? tnks

I use one of these with my M930 (and a couple of other boards). I like them because they plug into the IDE socket for a tidy installation (using a SATA cable to the drive instead of IDE) and they have worked fine for me. Usually sold under the name StarTech.

I have most success with ones that has the jumper that lets you pick between master/slave/CS

Repo Man11 wrote on 2024-01-11, 22:14:

I use one of these with my M930 (and a couple of other boards). I like them because they plug into the IDE socket for a tidy installation (using a SATA cable to the drive instead of IDE) and they have worked fine for me. Usually sold under the name StarTech.

i prefer the one that fit on tge hard disk because 1) seems that one ide channel must be connected to only one sata 2)you need to provide power to the adapter and convert molex to sata on the drive, adding cable and complexity inside the case

yes, but "consecutivde transfer" is not the primary goal, is a huge fast acces

More reason to use native IDE, to improve latency.

the question is: use a SSD is better via the integrated 133udma ide channel ora using a more modernd SATA chip integrated in some fastrack PCI card?

Depends on south bridge PATA performance and how much external SATA can hog PCI bus for itself. On the picture above you can see that SIS south bridge is nowhere near the limit of UDMA133.

Arrived Tday, win98 installed without issue on a Crucial SSD 120GB. My question is: this Pentium4 now think to have some sort of IDE drive but... what about Trim? What about all the management that SSDs need?

Marvell chip

AlessandroB wrote on 2024-01-17, 20:59:

what about Trim? What about all the management that SSDs need?

First, get some relatively modern Linux compatible with that computer - Devuan does have a text-mode "minimal live" that's CD sized but I bet it's not the last one standing;

2: use that to create the partitions (fdisk/cfdisk/etc, then you can even format them with mkfs.vfat), that way they'll be normally rounded to a whole megabyte which more than satisfies 4k alignment;
(this is fundamentally incompatible with DOS style alignment to cylinders, I think it's not a problem with "32 bit disk access" native drivers except possibly for some disk utilities)

1: every now and then, boot it up again, mount the partition (for example: mount /dev/sda1 /mnt) then trim it (fstrim -v /mnt) 😀

AlessandroB wrote on 2024-01-17, 20:59:

Arrived Tday, win98 installed without issue on a Crucial SSD 120GB. My question is: this Pentium4 now think to have some sort of IDE drive but... what about Trim? What about all the management that SSDs need?

Trim is unnecessary for modern Crucial SSDs. See here.

Just leave the computer idling at the BIOS overnight from time to time, and you're good.

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-01-17, 21:16:

AlessandroB wrote on 2024-01-17, 20:59:

Arrived Tday, win98 installed without issue on a Crucial SSD 120GB. My question is: this Pentium4 now think to have some sort of IDE drive but... what about Trim? What about all the management that SSDs need?

Trim is unnecessary for modern Crucial SSDs. See here.

Just leave the computer idling at the BIOS overnight from time to time, and you're good.

you mean "inside the bios"? pressing F1 at start?

AlessandroB wrote on 2024-01-17, 21:36:

you mean "inside the bios"? pressing F1 at start?

Yeah, just enter the BIOS and leave it there.

As long as there is no disk activity, the SSD will take care of itself.

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-01-17, 21:46:

AlessandroB wrote on 2024-01-17, 21:36:

you mean "inside the bios"? pressing F1 at start?

Yeah, just enter the BIOS and leave it there.

As long as there is no disk activity, the SSD will take care of itself.

Its not just Crucial that does this, most decent modern SSDs do this, not sure if the cheap ones using older controllers have this function.

Not sure why people get so worried about Trim support.

IIRC Intel has a DOS/Win utility that you can run to manually start Trim and there are other tools that can also do this such as the one from RLowe.

Repo Man11 wrote on 2024-01-11, 22:14:

I use one of these with my M930 (and a couple of other boards). I like them because they plug into the IDE socket for a tidy installation (using a SATA cable to the drive instead of IDE) and they have worked fine for me. Usually sold under the name StarTech.

If it's a Startech PATA2SATA3, it likely has a Sunplus SPIF223A (or maybe that has changed). My experience with it and a few alternatives is chronicled here

Re: Small capacity SSD PATA/SATA benchmarks

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-01-17, 21:16:

Trim is unnecessary for modern Crucial SSDs. See here.

As I understand it, that's pure marketing!

Yes, automatic garbage collection (low level defrag + [compression if supported]) is usually real, but it doesn't change the fact that the process strongly benefits from knowing which sectors are free, which is only really effectively* done with trim - there's just no substitute unless they made the nand controller aware of the major filesystems and assume everyone will be using them that way# 🙁

* A controller with hardware compression MIGHT "understand" if you set all free space to FF or 00 or whatever, but that's not how FAT normally works 😀

# Not unprecedented, see the SMR scandals of 2020…

With IDE, you wont ever get faster than ATA166 anyway.

I'd just get a DOM, and call it a day.

Maybe not this one, but this is what they look like.

https://www.amazon.com/KingSpec-Vertical-Indu … t/dp/B0BN3V75PJ

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-01-17, 21:16:

AlessandroB wrote on 2024-01-17, 20:59:

Arrived Tday, win98 installed without issue on a Crucial SSD 120GB. My question is: this Pentium4 now think to have some sort of IDE drive but... what about Trim? What about all the management that SSDs need?

Trim is unnecessary for modern Crucial SSDs. See here.

Just leave the computer idling at the BIOS overnight from time to time, and you're good.

Garbage collection != TRIM command