VOGONS


First post, by AlucarD86

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Hello everyone,

I bumped into a nasty problem that drives me crazy :[ and I hope there are some people out there who have experience with either slipstreaming drivers into WindowsXP or know the dreadful SiS 741 Chipset...

My main problem is, I just can't start the installation of Windows XP for the AsRock K7S41 miniATX mobo and it starts to annoy me xD I tested EVERYTHING and came to the conclusion that it must be that Windows XP just doesnt have the startup drivers to boot into the installation Menue.
And it says that this mainboard is XP compatible.

http://www.asrock.com/mb/SiS/K7S41/?cat=Download&os=XP

Here is what happens, I can access the BIOS with no problems I boot from the CDRom drive, WindowsXP loads up all its files and drivers and at the very last moment when it says "Setup is starting Windows" it either just hangs there or it restarts my PC or I get a blue screen with a weird error code. In short I cant even enter the installation to partition the HDD and such. Firstly I thought its faulty hardware or Win XPSP1 just doesnt like the chipset of the mobo but then to my big surprise I can install Windows98 on it 😳 what the hell, no blue screen no nothing just the usual Win98 setup. How comes this motherboard recognizes the Win98 installation process but wont let me install WinXP no matter what, is it maybe lacking vga chipset drivers ? I bet !

So I read on the internet there is a very powerful software called nLite which helps you to integrate neccessary drivers into WinXP by slipstreaming them into the installation disc. Now I am no noob and stuff but I think this must be the only last solution out there before I throw that mobo out of the window, seriously xD I mean I could even install WinXp from my disc with ease on my older Vintage PC.

Has anyone else encountered such weird problem or blue screen while attempting to install WinXP on maybe the same or a different mobo with SiS chipset ?

note: I noticed on the mobo 1-2 bulged caps, could that be the problem 😒 but then why would Win98 install :\ and what effects have bulged caps on the system anyway ?! Also the mobo seems to work fine past the "Setup is starting WIndows" blue screen or restart. I never had such a hard time installing WinXp thats why it drives me so nuts xD

let me know, cheers

Last edited by AlucarD86 on 2014-09-17, 21:09. Edited 1 time in total.

PC Setup: Mainboard ASUS CUBX | CPU Intel Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4 GHz | Memory 780 MB SDRam | Soundcard Creative SB Audigy SB0160 | GPUs Nvidia FX5900 Ulta Matrox M3D PCI | HDD 2x40 GB WD/Seagate | OS Win98SE and WinXPSP1 in dual boot

Reply 2 of 12, by shamino

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My first suspect for a problem like this would be unstable hardware, and the bulged caps just adds to that suspicion.

I'm not sure of exactly why, but it seems to me that Windows 9x is more willing to try to run on flaky hardware. That's an impression I've had from long ago, and maybe it's just my imagination, but anyway these operating systems are very different. If Windows 98 completes the install, I wouldn't assume that this means XP should.

Memtest86 or mprime or Prime95 might be a good next step, to see if it's stable. You could also try underclocking the system, but that's not going to stabilize it for very long. If the caps are degrading it will just get worse.
Don't go nuts trying to figure out anything else if the system isn't passing stability tests. If it does though, then it could be some other obscure problem. The XP install procedure has it's faults, definitely.

I don't think that a lack of VGA or chipset related drivers will cause any problem with installing XP. The only way that should be a roadblock is if it can't access the disk drive. VGA will work by falling back to a legacy VESA mode that has industry standard support. I've installed systems without AGP chipset drivers before, and that just means you don't get AGP features - the slot still works, it just performs like a PCI slot.

Reply 3 of 12, by Nahkri

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I had a similar problem of not beeing able to install windows xp on a socket A board,mine had via kt133 chipset,in my case upgrading bios to the latest version solved the problem.

Reply 4 of 12, by AlucarD86

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thanks for all the replies :] well I have flashed the BIOS to the latest version 2.60 but nothing 😒 still blue screens after the install, I even put out another HDD which has WinXP SP3 and Win98SE in a dual boot on the HDD and weirdly enough I can boot into the Win98SE installation of that HDD but once I try to boot into WinXP I get another bluescreen xD Its like this mainboard just doesnt get along with WinXP 😒 I will just try to lower the FSB, my hardware that I use is solid and works on other systems. Its not a big deal since I could discard the mainboard and move on but I am the kind of guy who tries every possibility before I sign off a task 😖 And honestly never before did I encounter such a persistant problem where I simply couldnt install WInXP, its almost agonizing from what I was used of WinXP installs 😀)

PC Setup: Mainboard ASUS CUBX | CPU Intel Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4 GHz | Memory 780 MB SDRam | Soundcard Creative SB Audigy SB0160 | GPUs Nvidia FX5900 Ulta Matrox M3D PCI | HDD 2x40 GB WD/Seagate | OS Win98SE and WinXPSP1 in dual boot

Reply 5 of 12, by Sammy

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i had a similar Problem that WinXP Setup hang with a Black Screen after loading all the Drivers from CD. (Normaly at that point XP Setup should Start)

The Problem was that the BIOS of the Mainboard had Problems with GeForce Graphicscard under XP Setup...

can you try to pull Out or deaktivate all unneccary cards/peripherals in BIOS.
like Network, serial, LPT..... and try again?

If still not working try with another GFX Card.

Reply 6 of 12, by AlucarD86

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Allright bros, I solved that damn problem with the mainboard and not sure if it was the CPU or the FSB bus but basically this is what I did ! Previously there was a Athlon XP 2000+ in that board which ran at 2,4 GHz with the default BIOS settings, now what I did was just replace it with a Sempron 2000+ and to my surprise it went down to 1,5 GHz with the default BIOS settings, I tried overclocking a bit and it would boot fine into WinXP till the 2,2 GHz mark, from there on in it went unstable. So my best guess is that you really need to lower either the FSB or memory timings before you want to boot into WinXP and get a similar issue like mine, mind you that I first tried the Athlon XP 2000+ and it did boot into Win98 😒 its strange that WinXP is so picky about it but oh well, I have learned my lessons 😀 and everything works fine now. I wonder... how far can I push my Pentium 3-S tualatin on a Asus CUB-X board, that will be my next project 😁

so what was the problem ? Not sure but I believe the default bios settings drove the Athlon XP 2000+ up to 2,4 GHz and the board (and especially the WinXP installation setup) didnt like that at all.

how did I fix it ? Well I put in a Sempron 2000+ and that one was clocked down at 1,5 GHz, after that WinXP booted like a dream.

so there you have it ! Always make sure to check your bios and FSB settings !

PC Setup: Mainboard ASUS CUBX | CPU Intel Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4 GHz | Memory 780 MB SDRam | Soundcard Creative SB Audigy SB0160 | GPUs Nvidia FX5900 Ulta Matrox M3D PCI | HDD 2x40 GB WD/Seagate | OS Win98SE and WinXPSP1 in dual boot

Reply 7 of 12, by idspispopd

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shamino wrote:

My first suspect for a problem like this would be unstable hardware, and the bulged caps just adds to that suspicion.

I'm not sure of exactly why, but it seems to me that Windows 9x is more willing to try to run on flaky hardware. That's an impression I've had from long ago, and maybe it's just my imagination, but anyway these operating systems are very different. If Windows 98 completes the install, I wouldn't assume that this means XP should.

A possible explanation might be that XP uses HLT instructions when the CPU is idle while Win9x does not, which leads to higher power/current fluctuations. And capacitors are often needed for balancing those fluctuations.
You could try to verify this by using a CPU cooling utility in Win9x which also uses HLT instructions and see if the system gets less stable.

Reply 8 of 12, by AlucarD86

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This was one of the strangest problems I had with WinXP and a mainboard in a very long time. And I was just so confused that I could boot fine into Win98 but every time I attempted to install WinXP I got BSoD'ed after WinXP was loading its files from the disk. When I have more time I will just replace the two bulged caps with new ones and maybe put on a AMD barton on theat mobo just to see how it behaves, I will even lower the clockspeed, I dont know if it was due to the bad caps, because it didnt look that bad, I mean they werent leaking or anything, there are just two of them slightly bulged at the top, could that be it ? I was so certain that my rest of the hardware like the memory, CPU and HDD werent faulty that I kinda lost patience with the process but it seems that for people who get a blue screen after trying to install or boot into WinXP, they should check the BIOS settings and voltages, and it still remains strange because the Athlon 2000+ is well supported by that board and booting into Win98 was no problem. Well SIS chipsets.... what can you do ?

PC Setup: Mainboard ASUS CUBX | CPU Intel Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4 GHz | Memory 780 MB SDRam | Soundcard Creative SB Audigy SB0160 | GPUs Nvidia FX5900 Ulta Matrox M3D PCI | HDD 2x40 GB WD/Seagate | OS Win98SE and WinXPSP1 in dual boot

Reply 9 of 12, by brostenen

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Back in 2004/2006, I was building computers for a living. And roughly 50% of all machines (12 to 15 a day were build by me) using that mobo.
They were all custom build, using retail boxed stuff, such as gfx cards. Etc. etc. (what a load of trash that resulted in)
And I still have one K7S41 for old times sake.

When each computers were build, we tested them using MemTest86 (can be found on disc's such as ultimate boot disc), and finally we tested
the board, using an unattended xp installer (if the computer was sold without os). And yes. A lot of problems.... A lot of them....
And it did not help, that my boss ordered low grade and cheap ram. Ohhh.... Sigh!

What I learned from this was, that the K7S41 (and GX), had to have the mem set to compatibility mode in the BIOS.
Second, if the board did not boot, we had to take out the cpu and install it again. (we called it the "amd-trick").
Use good grade memmory (Kingston), re-cap the board and set the mem-compatibility option in the BIOS.
Then you will have a decent and good mobo for Linux or Os/2.

Anyway... The board is supposed to run Win98, XP and 2000. And it can even run Linux and Os/2 (Another reason for me to keep it).
It runs Os/2 really great, using Matrox G400 DualHead by the way.....

Don't eat stuff off a 15 year old never cleaned cpu cooler.
Those cakes make you sick....

My blog: http://to9xct.blogspot.dk
My YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/brostenen

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Reply 10 of 12, by AlucarD86

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Thanks man, that was a very interesting read 😀 I noticed there must be something weird with this board since I swapped so much hardware around it except of course the CPU xD I hate it always to take out the heatsink and replace it, apply thermal paste again and and and, you know the Athlons XP are those who have the exposed silicone chip, similar to the pentium 2-3 (except tualatin). Its very strange, its almost like this board finally seemed to boot up after I switched from the Athlon 2000+ XP to the Sempron 2000+ I never encountered something like this before and if you dealt with this kind of trouble I feel your pain 🙁 Yes I am using the dual sided Kingston memory and I also set it to compatibility and honestly no more hangups after that. I was thinking about maxing this board out by using the strongest AMD athlon barton there is and slapping 2 GB memory and WinXP on it but after my long trouble I kinda lost heart and maybe I will move on to a Pentium 4 board to work on. Still this was an interesting yet kinda frustrating experience.

PC Setup: Mainboard ASUS CUBX | CPU Intel Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4 GHz | Memory 780 MB SDRam | Soundcard Creative SB Audigy SB0160 | GPUs Nvidia FX5900 Ulta Matrox M3D PCI | HDD 2x40 GB WD/Seagate | OS Win98SE and WinXPSP1 in dual boot

Reply 11 of 12, by shamino

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AlucarD86 wrote:

I dont know if it was due to the bad caps, because it didnt look that bad, I mean they werent leaking or anything, there are just two of them slightly bulged at the top, could that be it ?

They don't bulge until after they fail, and sometimes they don't bulge at all. By the time you see a bulge, it was already bad a long time ago. If you were to hook an ESR meter up to a bulged cap, you'd likely see a reading 50-100x higher than a good cap.
If you want to keep the board long term, it's better to replace all similar caps on the board, not just the ones that have already bulged. You can generally assume that if a few of a particular type of cap have gone bad, all it's twins will do the same.

I was so certain that my rest of the hardware like the memory, CPU and HDD werent faulty that I kinda lost patience with the process but it seems that for people who get a blue screen after trying to install or boot into WinXP, they should check the BIOS settings and voltages, and it still remains strange because the Athlon 2000+ is well supported by that board and booting into Win98 was no problem. Well SIS chipsets.... what can you do ?

Checking the BIOS and voltages was a good idea. But also, I think you should always test stability when you run into a problem like this. I like Prime95, but memtest86 is also useful and easier to get into, and I'm sure there's other similar utilities. Booting an OS isn't enough to prove much.
Don't make the mistake I've made before, of thinking that instability would mean randomness. Instability isn't really random at all. Unstable machines can be surprisingly consistent in the way that they fail. I've had issues like that were every time I tried to install XP, I got a particular error at a particular time. It wasn't just random errors, it was totally deterministic. Yet it turned out to be caused by unstable hardware. Because the error was consistent, I was trying to make it more complicated than it was.