VOGONS


First post, by gladders

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How much hard work is it to run an IBM PS/2? Obviously the Microchannel offers hardware limitations (dunno how severe those are cost-wise), but is there any software that PS/2s refuse to run? Basically, if I got one to be a mid-range 486 PS/2 machine between my 8086 and my W98 machine, am I painting myself into a corner?

Reply 1 of 11, by keropi

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Why torture yourself like that? If you already have at least a MCA soundcard go for it but if not I wouldn't say it worths the trouble to use a PS/2 486 and wait eons to buy something like a soundcard.
Don't get me wrong, I *love* IBM stuff but the MCA is a deal breaker for me...

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Reply 3 of 11, by keropi

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Not only they are hard to find, there aren't many models made as well, wikipedia lists them (all of them?) here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micro_Channel_architecture

IMHO it's one the cases where you first get the expansions and then get the actual machine 🤣 🤣 🤣
Keep in mind that anything vintage IBM is on the expensive side of things - unless you are US based where IBMs are a plenty.

edit:
there is some more info here as well: Questions about installing soundcard on IBM PS/2...

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Reply 4 of 11, by gdjacobs

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I'm conflicted over MCA. On one hand, it did offer some significant advances over ISA. On the other, it was another way IBM attempted to regain their lock-in of the PC universe.

All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder

Reply 5 of 11, by brostenen

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I have mixed feelings too. As I have never had any experience in using MCA, I will stick to ISA.
What I have read about them, they should be rather fun to play with. Quite a challenge.
I somehow feel it is a bit like starting to work on SCSI versus allways used PATA.

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Reply 6 of 11, by ynari

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You're going to struggle to find a decent soundcard or graphics adapter; not to mention software support is limited.

It was neat at the time, but so was token ring, and I wouldn't recommend running that again, either.

Reply 7 of 11, by CelGen

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Well being an IBM system designed to succeed the 5170 they are fully 100% IBM compatible both forwards and backwwards so no, unless you have software that relies on quirks from clone boards (I have never seen anything aside form a demo or two that exploited specific hardware quirks) there's nothing that won't run on the PS/2 machines.

I have no idea why but Vogons seems to hate them because they typically (there ARE models of the PS/2 with ISA) used MCA. It's proprietary, but then I guess so is EISA as well. Most things like serial, parallel, VGA/XGA and the hard disk interface are integrated (and for some reason I'm the only guy on the planet who has yet to have a drive or any of my spares die). It's when you want ethernet, better video or even sound (things that the usual office person doesn't need) things get expensive. The only exception is Token Ring cards. It's like IBM shipped every PS/2 with one.

They're business machines. They are not designed for gaming or the home but they make really neat and tidy machines, so the value of the sought after MCA cards like ethernet, SCSI and sound Blasters are often very high unless you know people or you're like me and you've been hoarding cards for the past decade.
Then again, if you own an amiga and you say Microchannel is expensive, you got no right to complain. 🤣

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Reply 8 of 11, by gdjacobs

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The gang of nine deliberately made EISA more liberally available, so it's not the same thing. IBM designed the licensing and patent structure surrounding MCA with the intention to re-acquire proprietary control of the PC market in the face of the clone vendors.

It's a shame, though. I really appreciate the design and the quality of PS/2 machines and the technology they contain. In many ways, I think they were computers which were ahead of their time.

All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder

Reply 9 of 11, by Errius

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I read somewhere that they were deliberately underpowered so they wouldn't compete with IBM's mainframe range. Most of the initial models used the 80286 or older chips even though the 386 had been out for years by the time the PS/2 debuted. The clone manufacturers were building 386s from the start. IBM was/is run by guys who made their careers building/selling mainframes ("real computers") and who regarded the PC division as either a irrelevance or a threat.

Is this too much voodoo?

Reply 10 of 11, by gdjacobs

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I don't buy that. They had AIX machines introduced in the mid 80s that were much faster than PCs, and moved fast to establish the RS/6000 line in the early 90s. 370/390 machines weren't challenged by these products because they didn't offer compatibility at the metal that mainframe customers demanded and often didn't offer the I/O performance that mainframes could.

All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder

Reply 11 of 11, by ynari

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EISA has the advantage it is backwards compatible with ISA. MCA doesn't. Regardless of whether the machines are being used for games or more business oriented purposes, the availability of cards is limited, and expensive.