VOGONS


First post, by ElementalChaos

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I recently got a Sound Blaster Pro CT1600 for cheap and I've been playing several games with it, one being Tyrian, one of my favorite shmups of all time. I played through this whole game on DOSBox before and I wanna do it again on real hardware. But, because apparently I can't have anything good for once, I'm running into more inexplicable technical problems.

OPL music works and sounds great, but sound effects? Nope, zip, zero, nada. In-game, at least. But on the SETUP program, I can get them working for just a few seconds before they cut out. (you can hear the menu selection beeping)

This is on both Tyrian and Tyrian 2000. Every other game I've played up to now has given me no issues. (Duke Nukem 2, Jazz Jackrabbit, Jill of the Jungle, Wolfenstein 3D, and Doom, from what I recall.)

I've tried every combination of DMA and IRQ I can think of, and unloaded all of my drivers. Worst case, this is some obscure hardware failure which just hasn't manifested until now, and with my luck that's precisely it. It's a real shame, the torture this card had to go though, all because of a clueless scrap seller. 😢

Anyone here with a CT1600 (which is a good number of you) willing to test out Tyrian on their machine or, by some miracle, has run into this issue before and solved it? Does anyone know what type of sound samples/rate Tyrian uses? I know there are multiple types the Sound Blasters were compatible with but I can't find a full list.

Last edited by ElementalChaos on 2016-12-04, 04:00. Edited 1 time in total.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 1 of 18, by PhilsComputerLab

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What machine is this on?

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Reply 2 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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PhilsComputerLab wrote:

What machine is this on?

"Project 486" in my signature. I can only assume CPU speed is not the issue here.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 3 of 18, by PhilsComputerLab

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Yea that should be fine. Do try the turbo button though, just to be sure.

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Reply 4 of 18, by clueless1

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Have you tried the CT1600 in a different machine to see if the problem follows it?

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Reply 5 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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clueless1 wrote:

Have you tried the CT1600 in a different machine to see if the problem follows it?

No, but it's a good idea; I'll try tomorrow on the Pentium rig.

One thing to note, the problem disappears when I use an SB16 CT2800. All signs still pointing to obscure defect/ESD damage. 😢

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 6 of 18, by James-F

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CT1600 is fine on a Pentium233MMX, all the sounds are there in Tyrian2000.
As suggested by others, try your 'project pentium'.


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Reply 7 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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Ugh.

Just checked the back of the card, there are several scratches along some of the traces. Almost certainly from getting knocked around with other cards during shipping.

I think we may have found the cause. Lesson learned:
DON'T. BUY. ANYTHING. FROM. SCRAPPERS.

^^^^^intense overreaction above, pls disregard^^^^^

Last edited by ElementalChaos on 2016-12-04, 21:08. Edited 3 times in total.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 8 of 18, by James-F

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Scratches doesn't mean the trace has discontinuity.
Practically all old cards you'll buy have been held in a big dusty box in the garage with other cards so scratches, bruises and a thick layer of dust, are inevitable.
Also, if the card works and reaches steady state without fluctuating audible abnormalities, it's probably is NOT a Capacitor or ESD damage.


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Reply 9 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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New discovery: if I turn off the music in the setup program, I can get the menu SFX for much longer. Still no sound in-game, even at the title screen. If I hold down an arrow key to cycle through the options in setup and play the beeping sound continuously, I hear some crackles and pops in between. Not a good sign. I did not notice this on the SB16.

EDIT: The crackles and pops occur even without a single sound playing. Only here, too. They seem to occur in pairs, one second in between each pop.

Last edited by ElementalChaos on 2016-12-04, 05:43. Edited 1 time in total.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 10 of 18, by PhilsComputerLab

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What resources have you got your card configured to?

Try IRQ 5 instead of 7 and / or disable the printer port on your PC.

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Reply 11 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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Right now at the default settings: A220, I5, D1, T4. I tried every DMA as well as IRQ 5 and 7, but I didn't think of disabling the parallel port. I'll try that.

There is one trace on the board with a scratch deep enough where you can see copper; it leads from pin 20 (5V) on a Motorola LS244 chip, to the left-most pin on the bottom of the Creative CT1336 chip.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 12 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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I've now tried every combination of IRQ (2, 5, 7, 10) and DMA (0, 1, 3), via setting jumpers and adjusting the SET BLASTER command in autoexec.bat to match, and also totally disabled both parallel and serial ports. Still no luck.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 14 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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James-F wrote:

Did you try in another system yet?

I plan to tomorrow morning. Will get back to you then. It's 12:25 AM where i am now, I'm not a late-nighter and I'm exhausted.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 15 of 18, by mr_bigmouth_502

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This seems like a really basic thing, but have you tried booting clean? What do your AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS files look like?

'

Reply 16 of 18, by ElementalChaos

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Alright.

Good news: all sound effects work with the SBPro plugged into the Pentium rig, using the same exact drivers and configuration (I literally copied them off the 486's hard drive). I played for two hours straight so I know there's gotta be nothing wrong with the card anymore.

Bad news: still no idea why it won't cooperate with the 486.

So this may end up being a problem with the motherboard. It is a DFI G486VPC with one PCI slot and a VIA 496G chipset. VIA made some infamously bad chipsets but I don't believe this is one of them?
I will try taking out my Ethernet card, which is the only other ISA card in the machine. There is an S3 Vision968 in the PCI slot.

Pluto, the maxed out Dell Dimension 4100: Pentium III 1400S | 256MB | GeForce4 Ti4200 + Voodoo4 4500 | SB Live! 5.1
Charon, the DOS and early Windows time machine: K6-III+ 600 | 256MB | TNT2 Ultra + Voodoo3 2000 | Audician 32 Plus

Reply 17 of 18, by James-F

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It might be a DMA "clog", some games send too much data and overflow the DMA buffers on the motherboard.
Try Alien Carnage (freeware) http://www.dosgamesarchive.com/download/alien-carnage/ it send tons of interrupt calls, it uses MOD samples for music.
Maybe even try a standalone MOD player like Open Cubic Player for DOS.


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Reply 18 of 18, by keenmaster486

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Yeah but Jazz Jackrabbit? Have you tried it on maximum quality just to see what happens?

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