VOGONS


First post, by Hamby

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Well, yesterday the HD died on my main Windows 7 machine. I'm still mourning the loss of data. I backed up as much as I could think to onto an external drive, but I know a lot of things were lost, my most recent work, some older software whose media I'll have to dig out of storage, and there were some Unreal Engine projects I *know* UE4 stored in (to me) weird places on my HD that I missed.

Which has me concerned about losing the data on my retro computer collection, which will be growing.
My current thinking is to put them all on their own network, with a gateway to the main network.
But I don't know whether it would be better to give the retro network its own backup system, or to back it up to the main network.
I could share an external drive connected to the main network, for example, and back up to that... at between 10 and 100 mbps, if I'm lucky.

Or I could add some kind of retro backup system to one of the retro computers, and have them all back up to that, which would still be slow, but not tie up resources on the main network. One of the retro machines is going to run Win98SE once get around to installing it; K6-2 300mhz with 256mb of ram... that's probably the one I'll back up to.

If I decide on the latter, which would be the best way for me to go? Get an old tape backup system? A really big secondary CF2IDE? (what's the max drive size on Win98SE?) A Zip drive? A SyQuest drive? A CD burner?
A Zip drive would take about 40 disks per system per backup (not counting the Win98 machine). SyQuest would take 4 disks per system. Both are reusable. A CD Burner would take about 6-7.

So I just looked up the max size of a Win98SE drive and it looks like 127GB. So, if I had them, I could back up 32 of my retro machines (not counting the Win98, of course). The only drawback is that this method is not very retro.

Does anyone have any other ideas? Can you see any drawbacks in either a secondary CF drive or backing up to an external drive on the main network? Of the two, which would be better?

Second question for me is; what is the best software for such backups? Should I just write a batch script for each machine and try to remember to run it once a week or once a day? Or is there some backup software that would work even on a 286 running DOS 6.22 and backup automatically at timed intervals (it'd have to be some kind of TSR... like a screen saver... I once wrote a screen saver...)?

I guess I'll probably have to come up with a mixed solution for all the different machines.

Reply 1 of 6, by torindkflt

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Back in the late 90s, I recall seeing magazine ads for a small NAS called the "Snap" server. If you could find one, I imagine you could connect one of these to the dedicated retro computer network and use that to back them up, and it would still be perfectly at home among your Win98 machines in regards to its own "retroness" since it's from the same time period.

Reply 2 of 6, by Hamby

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torindkflt wrote:

Back in the late 90s, I recall seeing magazine ads for a small NAS called the "Snap" server. If you could find one, I imagine you could connect one of these to the dedicated retro computer network and use that to back them up, and it would still be perfectly at home among your Win98 machines in regards to its own "retroness" since it's from the same time period.

cool I'll look for that...

Reply 3 of 6, by dionb

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Retro backup? Sun 'lunchbox' SPARCstation IPC/IPX/Classic with internal and external SCSI.

Great thing about SCSI is that it's fully backwards compatible both ways so with a suitable adapter you can connect fairly voluminous newer drives to ancient hardware like this.

Reply 4 of 6, by Deksor

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Or you can just build your own "retro Nas" with a raspberry pi. This one has been serving me for year now 😀

Although I don't really use it to backup data (except when I want to backup the original installation of a OEM computer), it serves me well to easily transfer data to anything retro, from pentium 3 to 8088.

It has a usb to sata adapter, a HDD I've gotten from a laptop, 2 network interfaces (ethernet and WiFi), and I've configured it to act as a router to the internet, I install a DHCP server, PXE server (very neat to quickly install windows or run some quick tests without even needing a hard drive), and more importantly an FTP server and a Samba file share that works is from DOS to Windows 10.

But even if I don't do backups, I can clearly see a way for you to do this !.
Or if a pi is too limited due to the "everything is connected to one usb port" you can also replicate this with any old computer from the 2000's basically and setup RAIDs even !

Trying to identify old hardware ? Visit The retro web - Project's thread The Retro Web project - a stason.org/TH99 alternative

Reply 5 of 6, by konc

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I've found that the easiest way to access modern storage from different eras retro machines is FTP.
Setup an FTP on your network (can be a NAS with FTP access or something like a Pi). There are FTP clients for every imaginable platform out there, my way is to have a batch file connect to the FTP and transfer some folders or a whole drive over.

Reply 6 of 6, by wiretap

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I take the sneaker net approach for backups. I usually do two separate backups. One backup is the initial image of the system, and the second is a customized image of the system that can be a "final" version, or something incremental.

Initial image: Base OS install + drivers.
Customized Image: Base OS install + drivers + software + games + tweaks .. etc.

I take the CF card or hard drive out of the system once I have the system in a state I like it, then just image that drive and store it on my modern file server (ESXi, Windows Server 2016, 40TB storage, etc). This is far easier than trying to connect other peripherals such as network cards to retro systems that I may have to jump through hoops to get working, and far quicker than trying to install shoddy software to create a backup and transfer it across the network if that's even possible on the specific system. Also, a lot of original backup software was picky and didn't always work well to capture everything as intended.

Otherwise, for random smaller stuff that needs backed up on retro systems that have network access or an easily removable storage option, I'll transfer it over the network (usually FTP) to the folder I have setup for each retro system, or I'll copy it over floppy/USB and sneaker net it to that folder.

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