VOGONS


First post, by iulianv

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I have an Am486 DX4-100 CPU and a socket that offers no possibility to use clips to attach a heatsink, and I don't like the idea of glueing one to the CPU.

Now, there is a "heatsink and fan required" inscription on the CPU, but I ran it for about half an hour with just a heatsink sitting on it (and some thermal compound) and nothing got even warm around it (neither the heatsink, nor the back of the socket).

Do I risk a lot running that CPU without a HSF, or should I look for a lower-clocked one that hasn't that inscription? How does an Intel 486DX/DX2/DX4 "perform" in this area (running un-cooled)?

Thanks.

Reply 1 of 18, by Tetrium

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There are coolers that attach to the CPU. Only drawback is the little fans can make a lot of noise.
Another option could be to get one of those upgrade chips like the Kingston Turbochip or an Evergreen. Those have fans mounted on the package standard.
I once ran a DX4 (Intel) with a large passive Pentium heatsink without a fan and, when mounted in the case, it would slowly get hotter and hotter. I "think" this is a major cause of why the system got unstable after a while of using it.

If you decide to not use a heatsink, I would however put a (large) case fan blowing over it. I wouldn't recommend using it without any heatsink though, it definitely needs cooling when mounted in a case when used for a prolonged time.

Reply 2 of 18, by Alphakilo470

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If the manufacturer recommends a fan and heatsink, I'd suggest using one. However, I had a system years ago with an AMD 100mhz 486DX4 and while it to had printed on it that a fan and heatsink was needed, I ran it without one. The computer would stay on for hours on end running Windows 95 and I never had any issues with it. Come to think of it, I wonder whatever happened to that motherboard and CPU. I think it accidentally went to the garbage.

I currently have a 100mhz Intel DX4 overdrive chip with a heatsink built on but no fan. I've never used it in a computer for more than an hour at a time but it'd get hotter than I'd feel comfortable with a chip running at.

Reply 3 of 18, by DonutKing

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I currently have a 100mhz Intel DX4 overdrive chip with a heatsink built on but no fan. I've never used it in a computer for more than an hour at a time but it'd get hotter than I'd feel comfortable with a chip running at.

Yes the Intel DX4's definitely need a heatsink/fan. I have one and with a heatsink attached but no fan it only goes for about 15 mins before it locks up.

The Overdrive DX4's had a heatsink built in with no fan, but after a few hours mine started locking up. Placing a small case fan nearby resolved this.
Not sure about the AMD DX4's, I thought they were reverse-engineered from the Intel DX4 and so very similar, but maybe they have some design tweaks that allow it to handle the heat better...

If you are squeamish, don't prod the beach rubble.

Reply 4 of 18, by Tetrium

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Many of the earlier AMD DX4's had only half the cache...not sure if this mattered as much though.

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Reply 5 of 18, by Antinomy

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No, it's the latter "Enhanced" one that had double cache, not the earlier having half 😀

I'd suggest to put a heatsink with thermal grease and then use a heat glue gun to glue at the edge to the CPU. This heat glue is very easy to rip it off.

Reply 6 of 18, by Tetrium

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Antinomy wrote:

I'd suggest to put a heatsink with thermal grease and then use a heat glue gun to glue at the edge to the CPU. This heat glue is very easy to rip it off.

This is good to know!
I never knew any other non-permanent solution except to use thermal tape, which is rather inefficient and relatively expensive compared to using thermal paste.

At any rate, it's not advised to run one without a heatsink. Afaik the last ones to not use a heatsink are the 33Mhz SX chips.

Reply 8 of 18, by Tetrium

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pianoman72 wrote:

Hi, I've been using my 486 66Mhz DX2 chip without a heatsink or fan for years. It's fine and working.

Part number?
I can relate when a DX2-66 3v part running at 40Mhz can run without a hsf just fine, but what is just fine?
I've had soo many people telling me something about their system(s) is a smart solution but in reality, is causing all kinds of problems (a perfect example is if someone's using a CHEAP power supply and say that it's running just fine).

Though usually that's the kind of people who'll tell all about how good with computers they are.
I once worked with an ex-system admin (the one who works with those big servers) and he told me how stupid the ones who worked with him were compared to himself.
And it's the same guy who didn't know the difference between Slot A and Socket A and told me that memory modules are SIMM's and the memory slots on the motherboard are DIMM's, I kid you not!
Thermal paste? Nonsense! Leaking caps? He didn't even see them -_-.
What an ego-maniac...

Another ex-college of mine (it was a voluntary job, building computers for handicapped people) told me he'd overclocked a P2-233 to 600Mhz...yeah right! 😜
Once he was in the middle of setting up XP and noticed the soundcard wasn't inserted properly...........yes I know what you're thinking, and he did exactly that!
*POOF* there went another motherboard!
He used to be a bikes repair man...and it showed.

Anyhow, to end this rant (sorry about that 😜 ), when someone tells me something is working fine which, in my opinion, is asking for trouble, I'll be skeptical and keep doing things my way.

Reply 9 of 18, by Markk

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I didn't have a 486 back then when it was popular. Only for a short while, I was given a board with an AMD 486/40, which didn't use any heatsink/fan at all. One friend of mine had a tatung 486dx2/66. Recently we opened it, and saw that there wasn't a heatsink there either. However there was a small fan mounted on the front side of the case, and it was very close to the CPU. But if I were to use any of the faster 486s that carry the inscription heatsink/fan required, I would install one certainly. I've tried some of them just for testing purposes, for a few minutes without cooling, and they get pretty hot. I've got also a couple of dx2/66s with a factory glued heatsink on them. One with a blue one, which looks very nice as it has the same logo and letters as the actual cpu, and another with a purple one that has just a label that says it's a 486dx2/66.

Reply 10 of 18, by pianoman72

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It is a 5v processor.
All I'm saying is that I have never had any trouble with it as used in my machine, per the above description. I am talking about daily normal use, playing games for hours at a time, and it is always stable, no power fluctuations or resets of any kind.

Now, technically, you could be right, maybe the processor's life could be shortened by this factor, without any heatsink, or maybe there are some other softwares out there that will show the machine not being as stable as I think it is. However, for my purposes, the computer is stable as I have described.

Thanks for reading.

Reply 11 of 18, by Tetrium

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pianoman72 wrote:
It is a 5v processor. All I'm saying is that I have never had any trouble with it as used in my machine, per the above descripti […]
Show full quote

It is a 5v processor.
All I'm saying is that I have never had any trouble with it as used in my machine, per the above description. I am talking about daily normal use, playing games for hours at a time, and it is always stable, no power fluctuations or resets of any kind.

Now, technically, you could be right, maybe the processor's life could be shortened by this factor, without any heatsink, or maybe there are some other softwares out there that will show the machine not being as stable as I think it is. However, for my purposes, the computer is stable as I have described.

Thanks for reading.

Np mate 😉

And btw, I wasn't trying to imply you were one of those types of people I wrote about in my last post, even though it would be an obvious conclusion 😉

Could you please give us full specs of your processor?

Markk wrote:

I've tried some of them just for testing purposes, for a few minutes without cooling, and they get pretty hot.

Yup, I noticed the same thing when running my Intel DX4-100 for a longer while. The Pentium passive heatsink got almost too hot to the touch!

Markk wrote:

I've got also a couple of dx2/66s with a factory glued heatsink on them. One with a blue one, which looks very nice as it has the same logo and letters as the actual cpu, and another with a purple one that has just a label that says it's a 486dx2/66.

Is your blue-heatsinked one the same as the one to the top left in the following pic?
That's a beautiful cpu! 😜

DSC00289.jpg

Reply 13 of 18, by Markk

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Yes! That's it. It is indeed a very good looking cpu. Here is my little collection of dx2/66s 😀 :
343km.th.jpg
I've also noticed, that if you look the 1995 model from down under, it's different from the other ones.
344z.th.jpg
It looks like the pentiums. Is yours like that also?

Reply 15 of 18, by Markk

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I have one. On the board I have ( a soyo VL-BUS 486), it gave me a very good impression when I first tested it. Both cpu and video card performance seemed very good in the Landmark speed test and I thought it would be close to the dx2/66. I run also 3dbench and then I replaced it with one of my 66s, and benchmarked it again. I don't remember the exact numbers, but the 66 was faster by 5 fps in 3dbench.

Reply 16 of 18, by swaaye

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Well a DX50 should have quite the memory bandwidth advantage, and potentially bus too. But in some cases I'm sure it is all about pure CPU performance and a 66 is going to win then.

Also I'm not sure what happens with wait states on a 50 MHz FSB. That could be crippling.

Reply 17 of 18, by Tetrium

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swaaye wrote:

Somebody needs to get a 486DX 50. Those were somewhat special.

Same here, got a single DX-50 made by Intel.

Btw Markk, the top right DX2 looks very odd. It might be a fake, and a bad one at that?

And about the i66 underside, I remember having seen it on Intel DX2's before.

Reply 18 of 18, by Markk

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No, I'm sure it's not fake! And that's because I had two of them. The other one didn't work. It was a little strange, that when I started the system, it would power up the monitor, but then it would show nothing(as opposed to other cases where sth faulty causes the system not to start, and the monitor remains in the power saving mode). So I decided to detach the heatsink, and under that there was an ordinary 486 carrying the same logo and letters as the others in the bottom in my pic. The funny thing though, is that while I had this cpu for dead, when later I acquired another 486 board by asus, it works fine on it...
I also like this one for another reason. That heatsink is very handy to have, as it is ideal to attach a fan on it using some screws. For a short while when I was using it, that's what I had done. That's why it might appear having some marks close to the corners...