Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

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Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-10 @ 02:44

On paper the Jazz16 sounds pretty good to me, with real OPL3, a wavetable header (on some of them), SB Pro / Adlib compatibility. Does anyone have any experience with this card? The '3D Pro' version that came with the Korg daughter board would have been great if it did what it claimed.

There are a few on eBay but none with a wavetable header - I see no reason to buy one without it.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby Logistics » 2013-12-10 @ 04:47

I have one of these somewhere, I'll have to bust it out and give it a looking over, now that you brought it up.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby bristlehog » 2013-12-10 @ 09:20

Cloudschatze once said that Jazz16 chipset has flawed DB header, I don't remember what's the cause, he might clarify this.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-10 @ 11:24

Hmm I think there's a rare-ish version of the PAS16 out there with a flawed DB header, but I don't think the Jazz16 suffers from this. They wouldn't have gone to the trouble of pairing them with a korg DB if that was the case, I don't think?
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby bristlehog » 2013-12-10 @ 11:31

badmojo wrote:There are a few on eBay but none with a wavetable header


Meanwhile in Canada...
Meanwhile in USA...

Prices are ridiculous, however, I think you might be able to haggle down to some $30 or whatnot.

I've also found something about Jazz16 DB flaws.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby orcish75 » 2013-12-10 @ 12:44

Yup, I had the Pro 3D version with the Korg wavetable board way back in 1996-ish in my AMD DX4-133 setup. I remember it was VERY expensive back then and saved up for months before I could buy it. I certainly don't remember any hanging notes on that card and it's SB-PRO compatibility was top notch. It did have one glaring issue that made me return it and get an AWE-64 Gold instead. When playing 16-bit audio, the one channel (can't remember if it was left or right) was quite badly distorted. I remember being bitterly disappointed playing any Direct X games, Diablo, Starcraft, etc and having distorted music coming from the one channel. The same thing happened when playing MP3s. The other channel was crystal clear. It never had this issue when playing 8-bit audio in DOS games, both channels were clear and distortion free.

I did all the usual testing, bypassing the volume control knob and amplifier section, changing drivers, putting it into a different machine etc, but nothing helped. I finally gave up and returned it.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-10 @ 21:47

bristlehog wrote:I've also found something about Jazz16 DB flaws.


Right you are, when will I learn not to argue with the experts?

Thanks for the links, I'll throw in an offer and see what shakes loose. I'm not paying anywhere near 80 bucks though!
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-10 @ 21:49

orcish75 wrote:I remember being bitterly disappointed playing any Direct X games, Diablo, Starcraft, etc and having distorted music coming from the one channel. The same thing happened when playing MP3s. The other channel was crystal clear. It never had this issue when playing 8-bit audio in DOS games, both channels were clear and distortion free.


Yes I vaguely remember someone saying once that Media Vision audio cards didn't play nice with Windows games, and that they should be considered DOS only.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby Logistics » 2013-12-11 @ 00:01

Were the PAS 16's Full-Duplex cards like the AWE32?
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby Cloudschatze » 2013-12-11 @ 00:14

I own two "Pro Audio 3D" boards, which consist of the "Premium 3D" board combined with the Korg, "Pro Wave" DB. It's a pretty decent card, in my opinion, and I know that Trixter has some nostalgia for it as well.

The Premium 3D, with its Jazz16 chipset, builds upon the PAS-16 line by offering SRS sound-enhancement technology, a "supported" WaveBlaster header, Sound Blaster Pro (2) digital/FM support, a faster SCSI chipset (on the SCSI model), and support for VESA's VBE/AI sound standard initiative.

There are a few pretty big caveats to consider though, in my opinion:

- The Pro/Premium are not backwards-compatible with the PAS/PAS16
- The Pro/Premium are not mixer-level compatible with the Sound Blaster Pro
- There's no 16-bit digital playback in DOS outside of the VESA driver interfacing... which almost no software supports. (Way to go, MV!)

Image
Image


With Media Vision's follow-up product, the "Deluxe," the MVA-508B mixer chip is replaced with the MVA-514, which is less feature-rich, but fully SBPro mixer-level-compatible. SRS is dropped, however. I don't own one of these, inexplicably... :(

Image


Logistics wrote:Were the PAS 16's Full-Duplex cards like the AWE32?

Yes
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-11 @ 01:38

Nice one, thanks for the info. Sounds like a fun card, I'll keep an eye out for one.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby bristlehog » 2013-12-11 @ 06:31

One more Jazz16 with DB header (MCD version), from $25, BIN $35, USA.

Also, there's a suspicious PAS16 with two 26-pin connectors, however, without pins soldered. It could be that DB-enabled PAS16 Cloudschatze mentioned.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-11 @ 09:32

bristlehog wrote:One more Jazz16 with DB header (MCD version), from $25, BIN $35, USA.


Thanks mate, shipping was reasonable and it looks to be in good condition, so I bought that one. A little x-mas gift for myself. And yes it looks like the "Deluxe" model mentioned by Cloudshatze - I don't need the SRS stuff anyway, I have an external module for that!

I'll report back once I've given it a try.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby Cloudschatze » 2013-12-11 @ 20:24

bristlehog wrote:Also, there's a suspicious PAS16 with two 26-pin connectors, however, without pins soldered. It could be that DB-enabled PAS16 Cloudschatze mentioned.

Well, so the card that *would* have been the Pro Audio Studio XL, when combined with the Pro Wave DB, is the 650-0097-xxx model, which looks like this:

Image

Image
There are two of these on eBay right now.


badmojo wrote:And yes it looks like the "Deluxe" model mentioned by Cloudshatze

That's not an actual Media Vision card, I'm afraid, but it should be functionally equivalent to the Deluxe. You'll have to let us know how the Sound Blaster Pro support fares.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-11 @ 22:48

Cloudschatze wrote:That's not an actual Media Vision card, I'm afraid, but it should be functionally equivalent to the Deluxe. You'll have to let us know how the Sound Blaster Pro support fares.


Oh crap, so what did I just spend 50 bucks on?! A licensed clone?

How embarrassing.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby bristlehog » 2013-12-12 @ 04:25

Oops, it seems you bought an OEM card by KTL. Sorry for misleading you, I should've checked the FCC ID, for MediaVision it usually starts with IXW, not KRN.

I myself have a KTL OEM card based on Aztech SG NX Pro series: picture. Works like a charm though.
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-12 @ 04:45

bristlehog wrote:Oops, it seems you bought an OEM card by KTL. Sorry for misleading you, I should've checked the FCC ID, for MediaVision it usually starts with IXW, not KRN.

I myself have a KTL OEM card based on Aztech SG NX Pro series: picture. Works like a charm though.


No worries, I should know better by now - it clearly says 'made in China' on it. Never mind, the more sound cards the merrier.

I'll have to buy myself another xmas gift now though :evil:
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby bristlehog » 2013-12-12 @ 05:14

Cloudschatze wrote:There are two of these on eBay right now.


Grabbed one. How does it go against an IXW-PAR? I can see that IXW-PAR has an extra connector, but which one has better signal shielding?
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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby Cloudschatze » 2013-12-15 @ 04:19

bristlehog wrote:
Cloudschatze wrote:There are two of these on eBay right now.


Grabbed one. How does it go against an IXW-PAR? I can see that IXW-PAR has an extra connector, but which one has better signal shielding?


I haven't done any A/B tests between the two, I'm afraid, but the fact that the MVA-508B mixer chip integrates a substantial number of external components that are present on the Pro Audio Studio boards would suggest better output quality. I recall the OPL3 whine being a lot more prominent on the "XL" boards, however...

There are a few things to note about the card you just bought. If you want to use a full-size DB, you'll need to reposition or replace the crystal oscillator for the Thunderboard chip. I suspect Media Vision intentionally used a crystal that obstructs the DBs in order to discourage use of the WaveBlaster header. The software-mixer support for the DB header on this board is also, eh, interesting - you'll need to change its volume through use of the "PC Speaker" slider.

Enjoy. :)

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Re: Media Vision Jazz 16 - anyone use one of these?

Postby badmojo » 2013-12-23 @ 11:08

My fake Jazz16 showed up (bought here: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/221334905130) and a) it's not the one pictured (same card, but not as clean and has some minor dings) and b) one of the little capacitors seems to be corroding. It installed OK (after I worked out that the MPU-401 had been disabled via a jumper), and the SB Pro / FM seems good in the few games I tried, but the wavetable header only worked in DOOM and nothing else I tried (Duke3D, ROTT, Daggerfall). Whether this is because the card is bad, or because it just has crappy MPU-401 functionality in general is anyone's guess.

I don't want to waste any more time on this disappointing piece of shite - I've messaged the seller and asked for a refund. This chipset has potential still I think; perhaps I'll try again one day, but with a real Mediavision card next time.

Sigh.
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