VOGONS


Reply 21360 of 22382, by shamino

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A Geforce4 MX420 GPU (NV17?) runs on 1.60V. Let it be known.
I'm about to recap a card, so I was figuring out how each of the caps are connected. 2 of them are on the GPU Vcore output.
I'm tempted to use polys for those caps, but since they come in lower voltage specs I needed to figure out what voltage they'd need to handle. To my surprise, nobody on the internet has ever posted what a normal GPU voltage is for the Geforce4MX or Geforce2 GPUs. At least not that I could find. So I powered it up and put a meter on them - the answer is 1.60V.

PS - techpowerup.com's ideas of GPU successors and predecessors makes my head hurt.

Reply 21361 of 22382, by Shreddoc

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I did the heatsink chopping-up thing, once. Never again.

Far too much metal dust anxiety and cleanup to be worthwhile. Everything within a 5m radius of the workspace (including own skin + clothes + hair) afterwards has some quantity of microscopic metal shards (aka Magic Shorting & Random Fault Dust) randomly all over it. Virtually gotta walk through a decontamination shower before you're safe to go within a metre of anything electronic afterwards!

All over a measly $1 bit of aluminium.

Reply 21362 of 22382, by Shponglefan

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Spent about 3 hours this evening trying to get a Gravis Ultrasound Extreme installed and running.

Ended up going through 2 different machines and multiple ISA slots before it would even get detected by the setup program. A fresh install of DOS 6.22 later, I finally got into the setup program only to be greeted by total failures of the DMA channel testing. After spending forever trying to fix that, discovered that is a bug with the setup program itself. Then after ignoring the errors, got it initialized and it works!

Now I'm afraid to move it. 😳

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My YouTube channel (retro game music)

Reply 21363 of 22382, by GigAHerZ

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Yesterday and today have been working on setting up my "overkill DOS testbench". I want that for mostly testing hardware and at one time i probably use it to start creating soundcard catalogue, that contains recordings of all kinds of soundcards and you can compare them side-by-side.

But for now, i got it set up. What it is then.

  • Chaintech 6AIA2 motherboard. (VIA VT82C693A chipset. Has all kinds of workaround-support for PCI soundcards in DOS, from TDMA and stuff up to SB-Link cable) In addition, it also has built-in ESS SOLO-1 soundcard, which is very good for DOS.
  • Intel Celeron 433MHz ("Overkill enough". Though if i get my hands on some older Pentium 3 that works on this board, i'll upgrade)
  • 256MB PC133 SDRAM (on 66-83MHz bus, works well with CL2)
  • nVidia Vanta 16 (16MB, great DOS compatibility! I tried Radeon 9250 cards, but they are slightly incompatible in high-res dos vesa modes, having artefacts and stuff)
  • 512MB CF card as HDD
  • A great 420W quiet ATX PSU, which also has negative 5V supply. (I also have ATX -> AT adapter)
  • Amazing DELL 2007FPb LCD with 1600x1200 resolution and HUGE amount of video-inputs: DVI/HDMI, VGA, S-Video, Composite. Also has USB hub built in.
IMG_20220402_151927.jpg
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1.12 MiB
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CC-BY-4.0

On this setup, i can test ISA and PCI soundcards of all kinds. I can also test AGP, PCI and ISA videocards. And it's fast so it saves time every time i need to wait for the computer to do something. My interest really ends with Pentium MMX and this setup here works beautifully as an "overkill approach" for up to Pentium MMX era.

And in general, on this table, i have everything i need for any kind of retro-debugging. On the left, there's floppy drive and under it, in white box, i have some "ready-to-go" ISA super-io card, vga, etc. Monitor has plethora of inputs, PS/2 keyboard (and adapters for DIN5 and USB, if i wish), PSU with all voltages i would ever need and network, sound, whatever more right on the table to use.

I love it, where there's an actual place that is prepared to work with retro hardware!

NB! Fun fact: You can see a small network switch on the table as well. It's a 10Mbps hub, with coaxial network port. For my retro-enjoyment machines (386, 486, P-MMX) i connect them to network over coaxial - just like it is appropriate.

"640K ought to be enough for anybody." - And i intend to get every last bit out of it even after loading every damn driver!

Reply 21364 of 22382, by BitWrangler

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Shreddoc wrote on 2022-04-02, 02:33:

I did the heatsink chopping-up thing, once. Never again.

Far too much metal dust anxiety and cleanup to be worthwhile. Everything within a 5m radius of the workspace (including own skin + clothes + hair) afterwards has some quantity of microscopic metal shards (aka Magic Shorting & Random Fault Dust) randomly all over it. Virtually gotta walk through a decontamination shower before you're safe to go within a metre of anything electronic afterwards!

All over a measly $1 bit of aluminium.

It's not that bad with a manual hacksaw, well tensioned sharp blade, fine tooth.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 21365 of 22382, by Tetrium

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Shreddoc wrote on 2022-04-02, 02:33:

I did the heatsink chopping-up thing, once. Never again.

Far too much metal dust anxiety and cleanup to be worthwhile. Everything within a 5m radius of the workspace (including own skin + clothes + hair) afterwards has some quantity of microscopic metal shards (aka Magic Shorting & Random Fault Dust) randomly all over it. Virtually gotta walk through a decontamination shower before you're safe to go within a metre of anything electronic afterwards!

All over a measly $1 bit of aluminium.

That sounds pretty terrible 🤣

Btw, did it at least work? 😋

Whats missing in your collections?
My retro rigs (old topic)
Interesting Vogons threads (links to Vogonswiki)
Report spammers here!

Reply 21366 of 22382, by Shreddoc

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BitWrangler wrote on 2022-04-02, 14:29:
Shreddoc wrote on 2022-04-02, 02:33:

I did the heatsink chopping-up thing, once. Never again.

Far too much metal dust anxiety and cleanup to be worthwhile. Everything within a 5m radius of the workspace (including own skin + clothes + hair) afterwards has some quantity of microscopic metal shards (aka Magic Shorting & Random Fault Dust) randomly all over it. Virtually gotta walk through a decontamination shower before you're safe to go within a metre of anything electronic afterwards!

All over a measly $1 bit of aluminium.

It's not that bad with a manual hacksaw, well tensioned sharp blade, fine tooth.

Probably so. I don't recommend doing it with a dremel or angle grinder. In that context, invisible or barely-visible metallic particles are being flung around in far greater quantities and coverage than many realise. I just don't rate the risk, personally.

Tetrium wrote on 2022-04-02, 15:38:
Shreddoc wrote on 2022-04-02, 02:33:

I did the heatsink chopping-up thing, once. Never again.

Far too much metal dust anxiety and cleanup to be worthwhile. Everything within a 5m radius of the workspace (including own skin + clothes + hair) afterwards has some quantity of microscopic metal shards (aka Magic Shorting & Random Fault Dust) randomly all over it. Virtually gotta walk through a decontamination shower before you're safe to go within a metre of anything electronic afterwards!

All over a measly $1 bit of aluminium.

That sounds pretty terrible 🤣

Btw, did it at least work? 😋

Nope! 😀 It could have worked, but after cutting I had second thoughts, and decided not to put a hard-to-obtain $$$ board at even a tiny risk by following up a metalwork session of invisible flung particles, with a play-with-the-computer-innards session, all over a $2 heatsink that I could pick up in town the next day. Possible? entirely! Economical, or worthwhile? I say hell no.

Reply 21367 of 22382, by Solo761

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Solo761 wrote on 2022-03-31, 22:01:
Welp... I found out why I had issues with VT6421A PCI SATA/PATA controller cards not getting detected on boot on my P233. Story […]
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Welp... I found out why I had issues with VT6421A PCI SATA/PATA controller cards not getting detected on boot on my P233. Story time...

I bought two a long time ago to try and mod XBox360 drive and they laid around since. They worked fine then (about time when Core2Duo were mainstream) but for some reason they don't now. They have ROM chips so it should have it's own BIOS on boot time, and yet nothing shows up beside regular BIOS boot...

I thought maybe it's something to do with too old PCI standard on my QDI Titanium IB+ so I tried them on one Athlon X2 I had nearby. It booted to XP and I got prompted with "found new hardware". OK, so they do work. Great, lets try flashing them with custom (or just updated) firmware I found here http://toastytech.com/files/w95stuff.html.
But flasher tool said "Unknown LPC" and returned strange strings for flash chip ID (FFh/FFh)... Google wasn't that helpfull so I was puzzled a bit and took off sticker that was on ROM chip to see which one is it. It was CAT28F010N. Haven't encountered this one before, but it looked like standard 128kB flash ROM so it should work...

Card.jpg

And then I noticed one small detail that explained all of this... ROM chip isn't soldered!

ROMChip01.jpg ROMChip02.jpg

On each side only two pins are soldered to hold it in place! I tried checking few of these unsoldered pins for continuity and yup, no continuity, they're not even touching the pads below... So although these cards have ROM chips they're not used and they behave the same as variants without firmware. That's why there's no drive check on boot, but it gets "noticed" in windows.

Well... now I have new project. Desolder chip on one and pop it in standalone programmer to see if they're real or just dummy chips. Nothing would surprise me now... If they're real I'll flash firmware into it and solder it back on to see if that does something.

The more you know...

Well, saga continues. If someone's interested in how it went...

Desoldered EEPROMs, tested them on my programmer(s), one works, other is not getting detected... Flashed the firmware into working one, soldered it back onto the board and still nothing. No boot screen during motherboard boot, new hardware detected in windows, same as before. Tried to flash it with VT6421(a) flash tool and again same message, "LPC Flash Not Exist"... this made me a bit curious and it seems I learned something new.
It seems that these chips are wrong type for these cards. Chips are 32 pin, but at most third of them are connected to something, others look like just pads, and no visible vias near them. It seems that these card use so called chips that have so called LPC mode, short for "Low Pin Count" mode. That's why flasher reported "LCD Flash Not Exist". These CAT28F010N are not LPC type...

Now it's a matter of pride (and stubbornness) , time to get some LPC chips and see if that will work 🧐

Reply 21368 of 22382, by creepingnet

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Picked up another laptop - one I'm quite familiar with....as I've had 2 other ones (a color one and a monochrome one.

This was the most anemic one I've had so far: 25MHz 486 SX, 8MB RAM, Casio 10" DTSN Monochrome LCD with a scratch in it, but I got to hand it to them, NanTan could actually make a great machine when they wanted to and this seems to be the ticket. Took it apart to upgrade to a DX2-66 and see what I could do to move from the DTSN screen to a color Active Matrix or something similar. So that upgrade might become a future project - once I'm done getting the M/75's touch panel done, which I'll probably wait until winter to carry out. Right now it's kicking but with the spare DX2 I have laying around in it with full SoundBlaster sound. Actually, the CASIO LCD is kind of surprisingly good for such a cheaply made panel. I also put an 80GB Drive with FreeDOS on it in there.

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~The Creeping Network~
My Youtube Channel - https://www.youtube.com/creepingnet
Creepingnet's World - https://creepingnet.neocities.org/

Reply 21369 of 22382, by RandomStranger

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Windows 3.1's birthday coming up this Wednesday I started messing around with a 386. I'd like to connect it to my network, but the out of the 4 ISA networking cards I have I only have one 3Com which I want to keep for a more premium 486 build I'm planning. All the rest is SMC and I can't find there original driver. Do anyone know where to get it?

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sreq.png retrogamer-s.png

Reply 21370 of 22382, by Merovign

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Continuing The Great Cataloging Of It all, taking approximately 2 forevers. Just did a bunch of laptop power adapters and desktop PSUs, as well as finally breaking out a box from the last Liqmat major haul (that I know of) and getting that stuff photo'd and listed.

I had an XT PSU from Kingspao that someone had tried and failed to disassemble and gave up and threw out. As far as I can tell they just removed the fan screws and let the fan fall down inside. SO I fixed that (the warranty sticker hadn't been breached), and, well, I haven't tested ripple yet but the voltages are correct (enough). I have a few failed AT PSUs I need to break down and check but I need to finish my catalog and get some more stuff out of here. The funny thing is I got rid of a monitor and a couple of computers and somehow it seems *more* crowded!

I mentioned in the bought-it thread I got 5.25" and 3.5" rolodex-style disk boxes, which I've been looking for for a long time but haven't found except for very expensive ebay listings, these were cheap. Goodwill may not have computers anymore, but every so often...

Kadotus reminds me I have a Socket 7 I think needs recapping - I need to test some more CPUs on it, because it could just be that my Celeron 566 and P3 1000 are both dead - not sure if that's worse or better than the mobo being bad.

Last edited by Merovign on 2022-04-03, 08:30. Edited 1 time in total.

*Too* *many* *things*!

Reply 21372 of 22382, by darry

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;

RandomStranger wrote on 2022-04-03, 05:50:

Windows 3.1's birthday coming up this Wednesday I started messing around with a 386. I'd like to connect it to my network, but the out of the 4 ISA networking cards I have I only have one 3Com which I want to keep for a more premium 486 build I'm planning. All the rest is SMC and I can't find there original driver. Do anyone know where to get it?

That looks like an SMC 8416T or a variant thereof .

Try this

Filename
ETHER.zip
File size
706.13 KiB
Downloads
6 downloads
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

EDIT :
This one looks newer .

Filename
ETHER_newer.zip
File size
2.62 MiB
Downloads
10 downloads
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

Source : https://web.archive.org/web/20030423053444/ht … brary/ETHER.EXE

Reply 21373 of 22382, by davidrg

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Yep, thats an SMC EtherEz 8416T. Here is the Data Sheet and Users Guide. There are some more drivers here.

I was using one for my Windows 95 network booting experiments a few weeks back - they seem like nice enough cards.

Reply 21375 of 22382, by NyLan

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worked on my new 386 😀
Re: Bought these (retro) hardware today

The included 60MB hard drive was defect so I had to use a new 40GB drive.
In the bios it was setup like this :

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To be safe I wanted to setup the new 40GB HDD as a 127MB drive :

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So I used Seatool for DOS on another computer to fix the drive capacity to the exact amount ( in LBA ) corresponding to C/H/S 1023/15/17.
Plugged in the laptop, Bios set on Drive type 42 and installed MSDOS 6.22 + Windows 3.1 flawlessly.

It seems that even if the drive is setup with a larger size ( like 520MB) it's working as well, even if the Bios is setup for a smaller drive. I'm not sure why and how it's possible. But I didn't want to face bugs and issues so I preferred to stick with 127MB. For this computer it's good enough 😀

My Intel SE440BX-2 Intel's website Mirror : Modified to include docs, refs and BIOSes.
Proud owner of a TL866 II
Personal GitHub

Reply 21376 of 22382, by javispedro1

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Spent a sunday afternoon writing Yet Another DOS Int33 Mouse Driver.
I wrote it in C because why not and because I guess there's no other open source mouse driver in C.

Being in C it is more suited for a modern/virtualized PC so I added VirtualBox integration to it.
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/123 … eb242551422.mp4

Plus Windows 3.x integration so that it works on DOS windows too.
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/123 … 50e6c0e71dc.mp4

And despite the bloat it's still like 8KB of memory, less than MS Mouse 9 😀

mem.png
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Reply 21378 of 22382, by dormcat

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Tried installing Raspberry Pi Desktop (Debian Buster) on an old Atom laptop, again. Installation went through but then it entered hibernation EVERY 30 SECONDS! The problem seems to be quite common on different Linux builds and there's no easy way to fix. 🙄 Guess I have to stick with Windows XP.

Reply 21379 of 22382, by janskjaer

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Removed, cleaned and lubricated the fans on my Voodoo5.
Tested everything on my ASUS-P3BF sitting on my home-made test bench.

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DELL Dimension XPS M200s
:Intel P1 MMX 200MHz
:64MB RAM
:DOS 6.22/Win95b
:Matrox Millenium II PCI
:Matrox m3D (PowerVR PCX2)
Chaintech 7VJL Apogee
:AMD AthlonXP 2700+
:3GB RAM
:Win98SE/Win2000 SP4
:3dfx Voodoo5 5500 AGP