VOGONS


Legacy PCI graphics card with DVI

Topic actions

First post, by kataniel

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Hi folks,

I'm currently trying to connect my old Pentium 100 machine to my Flat TV via HDMI.
I already tried an analogue/digital converter that works, but unfortunately only in resolutions of 640x480 and beyond.
I want to play games in 320x200 on the TV, so I wanted to use a graphics card with a "native" digital output.

I bought a TNT2 Pro PCI with DVI at ebay.us, but the seller was not able to find the card and cancelled the transaction.
So, does anyone have such a card (or a similar one), and additionally, is willing to sell it?

Ebay is full of Radeon 7000/9200, Geforce FX5200 and Matrox cards but I'm looking for a real legacy card with 8/16MB memory and a
relatively "weak" GPU because I wanted to keep the legacy feeling of that machine. Currently, a Mystique 220 is installed.
Yes, I know there are not many of such cards available.. 😀

A card with driver support for Win 3.11 would be great. As far as I know, for nVidia, the TNT2 is the last one with drivers available for 3.x.

Thanks in advance

kataniel

Dell Optiplex GL5100 | 64MB EDO | WDAC2850 | S3 VirgeGX 2MB PCI | HOT-235 (Opti 82C930) + DB50XG
Dell Optiplex 4100LE | 32MB FPM | WDAC2540 | Orchid Kelvin 64 2MB VLB | HOT-235 + DB50XG

Reply 1 of 29, by PhilsComputerLab

User metadata
Rank Hardware Mod
Rank
Hardware Mod

Hi kataniel!

I've tried lots and lots of cards with DVI for video capture and I can recommend you the FX5200. It will work at all resolutions with your TV.

I wouldn't worry about having a "legacy card". It's not an issue.

My main DOS gaming machine is also running a Pentium 100 (it's a P200 clocked down) with a FX5200 and it's great 😀

YouTube, Facebook, Website

Reply 2 of 29, by elianda

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

I have a Zotac FX5200 PCI that does not work on older systems such as Pentium Boards. However on P2 it worked. My guess is that there is a problem with the graphics cards BIOS not supporting old CPUs.
Photo: http://mail.lipsia.de/~enigma/neu/pics/graphi … 0_pci_front.jpg

Retronn.de - Vintage Hardware Gallery, Drivers, Guides, Videos. Now with file search
Youtube Channel
FTP Server - Driver Archive and more
DVI2PCIe alignment and 2D image quality measurement tool

Reply 5 of 29, by kataniel

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Ati _Radeon_ 9250. Quite some time ago..

Dell Optiplex GL5100 | 64MB EDO | WDAC2850 | S3 VirgeGX 2MB PCI | HOT-235 (Opti 82C930) + DB50XG
Dell Optiplex 4100LE | 32MB FPM | WDAC2540 | Orchid Kelvin 64 2MB VLB | HOT-235 + DB50XG

Reply 6 of 29, by alexanrs

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Do Matrox cards with DVI output show lower resolutions? I have a G550 but I can't test it right now (the system I inted to use it with isn't ready yet). A G200 would not be more out-of-place on a Pentium than a TNT - and a G4x0 isn't much newer than a RIVA TNT2.
Something like this might be perfect for you.

Reply 7 of 29, by kataniel

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Ok, I think I'll give the G4x0 a try.. It is vintage enough and is easily available on ebay.
Thank you @ all.

kataniel

Dell Optiplex GL5100 | 64MB EDO | WDAC2850 | S3 VirgeGX 2MB PCI | HOT-235 (Opti 82C930) + DB50XG
Dell Optiplex 4100LE | 32MB FPM | WDAC2540 | Orchid Kelvin 64 2MB VLB | HOT-235 + DB50XG

Reply 8 of 29, by idspispopd

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Only G450 started to have DVI, G400 not yet. Matrox Win3x drivers only support up to G400. So that probably won't work.
But maybe G200 is an option. The G200 MMS (Quad Display) does have DVI, see http://www.ebay.de/itm/Matrox-G200-MMS-Quad-D … p-/260747082667
I don't know if the Win3x driver will work with that card, though.
There is also a Matrox G200 Flat Panel Add-On, see
http://www.matrox.com/graphics/media/pdf/supp … nuals/en_fp.pdf
Also called Matrox Millennium G200 DVI/DFP Daughter Card:
http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs … 1/10509_ca.HTML
So you'd have to see if you can get this plus a PCI G200. (not sure if it has to be a Millennium or if a Mystique is OK)

Another potential option: There are ATI Rage based cards with a DFP connector (these are AGP, though - maybe PCI ones exist):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1998-ATI-TECHNOLOGIES … oUAAOSwo6lWHD-p
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ATI-Rage-LT-Pro-2mb-A … =item235d31eabc

From what I understand this is electrically similar if not identical to DVI, only the specs are lower. Adapters for DFP/DVI definitely exist.

Also, be careful with newer chips as a PCI variant on an old board, like elianda wrote. I have previously mentioned an example where that didn't work (Radeon 7500 PCI didn't work in Asus P55T2P4, worked fine in SS7 board. The CPU was probably not the issue.)

Reply 9 of 29, by feipoa

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

For the Matrox G200 MMS card, how would you connect a DVI cable to it? That connector doesn't look standard. Perhaps you would also have to use this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Matrox-G450-G200-MMS- … lQAAOSwyQtV1Zai

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 10 of 29, by idspispopd

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
feipoa wrote:

For the Matrox G200 MMS card, how would you connect a DVI cable to it? That connector doesn't look standard. Perhaps you would also have to use this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Matrox-G450-G200-MMS- … lQAAOSwyQtV1Zai

Exactly. If you look at the ebay link I posted the description says Matrox G2+/QUADP-PL Millenium G200 Quad 32MB PCI DVI Video Graphics Card + 4 DVI video output (2 x Dual DVI Y-Splitters) Cables, the photo also shows the cables.

Reply 11 of 29, by feipoa

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

I saw that, however the connector pins aren't shown. I did read about the dual DVI Y-splitter in the desc, however I find a lot of eBay listings contain misinformation. I'd feel better if that seller showed the end connectors.

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 12 of 29, by matze79

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Radeon PCI 32Mb 7000 Mac Edition is a Good Card with DVI, just flash Radeon BIOS for x86.

Also some ELSA Cards feature TNT2 and DVI.

https://dosreloaded.de - The German Retro DOS PC Community
https://www.retroianer.de - under constructing since ever

Co2 - for a endless Summer

Reply 13 of 29, by feipoa

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Does the Radeon 7000 have Win 3.1 drivers?

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 14 of 29, by Malvineous

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
feipoa wrote:

For the Matrox G200 MMS card, how would you connect a DVI cable to it? That connector doesn't look standard. Perhaps you would also have to use this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Matrox-G450-G200-MMS- … lQAAOSwyQtV1Zai

Those cables are pretty standard, they were used a lot in Dell PCs in the late 2000s. It's a DMS-59 connector. You can get breakout cables that go to 2x DVI or 2x VGA. I've got a box of the 2x VGA ones at work because Dell supplied both and we never used the VGA ones.

I'm curious why the OP's HDMI converter doesn't work though. 320x200 graphics is double-scan so being output at 640x400@70Hz, or even 720x400@70Hz, so you'd think this would be close enough for a 640x480 converter to handle. It's the same video signal as DOS/BIOS text mode, so if the converter didn't handle it, you wouldn't be able to see the PC boot up, so surely they'd have made allowances for that.

@kataniel: What happens when you use the converter when the PC is in DOS text mode? Does the picture drop out?

Reply 15 of 29, by kithylin

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Adding a comment here.

I don't know how old of a machine it would work in, I haven't tested that. BUT! I did today test putting an ATI 7000 32MB PCI card in my newer Intel P67 system with the i7-3770K, as the only video card, and connected a DVI-to-HDMI adapter, connected it to my 46" 1080p LCD HDTV and it comes on and sitting here in BIOS on the other screen as I type this.

I may later try it in like a Pentium class motherboard to see what it can do (I'm curious) but for now, it seems to work fine at least this part of it. So this may be an option for you.

Reply 16 of 29, by matze79

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Radeon 7000 works with SVGA Driver (256 Colors)

Get a NVIDIA TNT/TNT2 with DVI if you want Win 3.1 drivers.

http://www.gaby.de/ftp/pub/win3x/drivers/tnt5w311.zip

Better, a Matrox PCI Card, 3.1 Drivers and DVI.
Is easier to find.

https://dosreloaded.de - The German Retro DOS PC Community
https://www.retroianer.de - under constructing since ever

Co2 - for a endless Summer

Reply 17 of 29, by kataniel

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Today, I bought a Matrox G200 Dual Head with this proprietary Matrox output connector. It's not the 'famous' DMS-59, it's a connector called LHF-60. The corresponding cable is also available and gives dual DVI output. I'm curious, if this works.

@Malvineous:
I only see a picture in Windows 3.11. Under DOS, there is no picture at all. Neither in text mode, nor in low res games.
I also wonder why this is the case. When connecting the machine to an EIZO 17" TFT, the onscreen display reports that it shows 640x400 in DOS text mode.
But it seems that this was not enough for the A/D connector.

Dell Optiplex GL5100 | 64MB EDO | WDAC2850 | S3 VirgeGX 2MB PCI | HOT-235 (Opti 82C930) + DB50XG
Dell Optiplex 4100LE | 32MB FPM | WDAC2540 | Orchid Kelvin 64 2MB VLB | HOT-235 + DB50XG

Reply 18 of 29, by kataniel

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
matze79 wrote:

Get a NVIDIA TNT/TNT2 with DVI if you want Win 3.1 drivers.

The TNT2 was my first choice, but after the seller cancelled the transaction, I was not able to find another one on ebay worldwide.

Dell Optiplex GL5100 | 64MB EDO | WDAC2850 | S3 VirgeGX 2MB PCI | HOT-235 (Opti 82C930) + DB50XG
Dell Optiplex 4100LE | 32MB FPM | WDAC2540 | Orchid Kelvin 64 2MB VLB | HOT-235 + DB50XG

Reply 19 of 29, by elianda

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

It would be nice to have a list to which mode the default text mode for various cards is converted when using DVI.
Like
Card1: 720x400@70 Hz to 720x400@60 Hz
Card2: 720x400@70 Hz to 640x480@60 Hz
a.s.o.

Retronn.de - Vintage Hardware Gallery, Drivers, Guides, Videos. Now with file search
Youtube Channel
FTP Server - Driver Archive and more
DVI2PCIe alignment and 2D image quality measurement tool