DOS games need an IPX network for multiplayer, unless you are playing them in an emulator. But yeah, native DOS needs IPX. It's not that hard to set up an IPX network between two DOS machines, though.

I do have ipx driver installed and guessing it wont let play with other people all over the world, guessing it will work like lan

Back in the day, you would use software/service called Kali.net which created a IPX VPN over TCP/IP. It's not free, but there used to exist a 15min DOS trial version. I'm at work, Kali.net is blocked so I cant see the current status of the service.

Who remembers Doomserv?

For DOOM engine games - tcpsetup, ifrag to your service. Many other DOS games supported by DOS version of Kali (which can operate in client-client mode without master server).
Also you need packet driver for your NIC/DialUP adaptor, "real" IP address and properly forwarded ports (usually 5029, 666) on your router if you have it. Thats all.

BinaryDemon wrote:

Back in the day, you would use software/service called Kali.net which created a IPX VPN over TCP/IP. It's not free, but there used to exist a 15min DOS trial version. I'm at work, Kali.net is blocked so I cant see the current status of the service.

looked on that website and it is running

aleksej wrote:

For DOOM engine games - tcpsetup, ifrag to your service. Many other DOS games supported by DOS version of Kali (which can operate in client-client mode without master server).
Also you need packet driver for your NIC/DialUP adaptor, "real" IP address and properly forwarded ports (usually 5029, 666) on your router if you have it. Thats all.

ok i have a packet driver installed and it works as i can get on bbs sites over tcp/ip with telnet

i have try ifrag but nothing seems to happens or take a long time maybe i didnt set it up right

if there is a good in-dept guide i could follow or a in-dept setup video

AFAIK there is no any kind of suitable guide for that due to very specific and obscure subject for current times.

Do you have two independent ISPs and each of it provides internet acces for NIC equipped DOS machine, right?
Otherwise how can you test it and set it up step by step? How can you simulate that worldwide connection with another person "in wild"?

Anyway what each person need (for DOOM):
1. Straight connection to yor ISP - it's best.
1a. If you sit behind a router - you must properly forward needed ports - atleast 5029 but better both 5029 and 666 for UDP and TCP ptotocols - to your DOS machine's local IP.
2. "Real" IP, not shared one with another ISP clients is REQUIRED. Without it just forget about that trip at all.
3. Obtain packet driver for your NIC and properly load it usually with software interrupt as only cmdline argument (in example "rtspkt 0x60" - for Realtek 8139 NIC)
4. Download tcpsetup (tcpset95.zip)
https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/utils/network/tcpset95
and unpack it to your DOOM directory
5. Edit wattcp.cfg

1MY_IP=your DOS machine local IP if you sit behind a router, or your real IP provided to you by your ISP if you have straight connection to it.
2NETMASK=   \
3GATEWAY=    you should know what this is
4NAMESERVER=/

6. You should know that external real IP for another person and it should be reached by it in various simple TCP driven protocols and services like FTP, HTTP, etc.
7. Run multiplayer game with cmdline like "tcpsetup -nodes 'another person IP' ". Between tcpsetup and '-nodes' you MUST specify if you run not DOOM I, but DOOM II, Heretic, Hexen (read tcpsetup.doc for details or just add '-doom2' key for DOOM II) and you MAY add game specific cmdline arguments like -file -warp -skill -altdeath or so. Anyway tcpsetup own key '-nodes' must be LAST in that string.

Steps through 1 to 6 (excludes 4) also needed for iFrag and Kali.

If it doesn't work - test, set it, test again and etc, etc. Good test is run ftp server on both DOS machines and trying to log in from another or even from your smartphone, main Windows machine or so. If it allowed that a good sign.

I should just probably add that we've (me and aleksej) played Doom II not 10 hours ago using this very method 😀 Which is a pretty funny coincidence (this thread and all, I mean).

Back in 2009 - when aleksej was still researching this possibility - we've also played over DOS-Kali, and it worked (for instance, Death Rally was a lot of fun).

So I happily confirm that pure DOS PC multiplayer it is quite within the reach of anyone with a proper PC and a static IP address.

You don't even need a static IP address. All you need is a public IPv4 address with the possibility to forward the necessary ports.

That said, even if you are stuck with CGNAT, DS-Lite or other solutions that mean you don't have that, there are options. You can set up a VPN. To get IPX to work it needs to be an L2VPN (because IPX is its own L3 protocol and can't natively run over IP at L3). Doing this properly one of these days is on my to-do list, but unfortunately not something I can spend tim on now.

@dionb, what makes you say so? I've tried fowarding those ports in the router many times back when I had a dynamic/public IP, and it plain didn't work for me (it did for some "modern" games, though). That's why we kinda emphasise the "real/static" part, since in practice this is the caveat that will allow people to successfully connect this way.

Revolter wrote:

@dionb, what makes you say so? I've tried fowarding those ports in the router many times back when I had a dynamic/public IP, and it plain didn't work for me (it did for some "modern" games, though). That's why we kinda emphasise the "real/static" part, since in practice this is the caveat that will allow people to successfully connect this way.

'Real' vs (CG)NATted is a completely different distinction to static/dynamic.

There is no functional difference between a static and a dynamic IP, static vs dynamic purely says something about whether the IP is yours to keep or whether it may change the next time you do a DHCP renew. For as long as you have a public IP, it is globally unique and you can send and receive exactly the same data as any other person with a public IP. That's the very definition of a public IP address.

It is however possible that internet providers differentiate in their products and that there are bigger differences than just static vs dynamic. In that case it's those differences and not the static/dynamic nature of the IP that make it work or not. Moreover the actual modems/routers supplied by providers may also differ between products. Such 'features' necessarily differ between providers and (in cases where the same provider operates in different countries) between countries.

Some form of NAT (be it 'basic' CGNAT or more advanced IPv4 depletion mitigation stuff like DS-Lite) is another story. If you don't have a public IP, you can't accept incoming connections. It's theoretically possible to enable port forwards on a provider's NAT box using PMP or PCP, but then both the NAT box and your own modem/router need to support it and you need to know how to get it working. In practice: forget it.

I have a dynamic IP address that can accept incoming connections, if I configure my router correctly - as do most other ~2 million internet customers of my provider (I can say that confidently as I work in that provider's engineering department). The only ones who can't are the people with DS-Lite (i.e. public IPv6 but private IPv4, tunneled to a NAT box over IPv6). If they want incoming connections they need to do it over IPv6 - or failing that, there's a process in place to upgrade them to public IPv4 if there is no alternative. This is pretty much the norm in Western Europe for fixed line connections, but elsewhere a far higher percentage may be behind some or other form of NAT, and nice friendly processes to get around this may not exist. The same applies to mobile internet almost anywhere: the default is NAT, actual native IPv4 public addresses are very rare.

In the end, the bottom line is simple: can you accept IPv4 incoming connections on most/all ports? If so, this should work if configured correctly. If not, it almost certainly won't. In that case you need to revert to some kind of tunneling or VPN.

@alekse

my dos rig is connected directly to my router and can still access internet in win 3.11 with internet explorer 5 and same for win95 and also have networked to my main win10 rig for backup purposes and had no issues before

only thing that if a bit different is that the router that my dos rig is plugged into is bridged to my main router (for more ethernet ports) and my main router see everything plugged into the "bridged" one like a normal one

would i need to forward those ports on the "bridged" router (where my dos rig is plugged into) or my "main" router (which the "bridged" router is plugged into and my win10 rig is plugged into and where cable from phone line is plugged into)

as i said one previous post that i have a packet driver installed with tcp/ip drivers in dos and can access bbs sites over ethernet with telnet and no issues

where would i find other players for a game if i do get this working

I remember back in the days playing between two computers with a parallel cable. 😁

Vikingo wrote:

I remember back in the days playing between two computers with a parallel cable. 😁

I usually used null modem serial cables for local doom deathmatches.

Robhalfordfan, well in short. I think for such an authentic way to DOS multiplayer with these antique pieces of software like tcpsetup, iFrag, Kali (in standalone client-client mode) just one thing is important. Your DOS machine must be accessible by TCP protocol from worldwide side in various roles - as FTP or Telnet/BBS station in example. Fact that you can access WWW or BBS from this machine as client is not enough. Not only you should receive packets, but another player should receve him from you. In such scheme no one acts like passive client. Each side acts like server for another. Try set FTP server on your DOS machine. You can get one from mTCP package. If another person can receive file from your DOS machine via FTP - you on the right way. If not - no success game yet, sorry. Atleast with these old stuff like tcpsetup and iFrag (and Kalif for DOS too i think). You can make this FTP test by self - with your smartphone/tablet (do you have one?) with WiFi disabled and connected to net by Edge/GPRS/3G/4G. I mean not by your home network.

Try to forward it everywhere. 😀

There is no another players of such kind AFAIK. Only me and Revolter. We playin periodically in DOOM/Heretic in that way (i'm living in Moscow, Revolter in exKönigsberg) for last nine years in such small company of two people. By the way we had play coop on DII map 15 last night 😀 Also we had tryin play through Kali (in standalone mode - main kali.net server was down already for that time). As Revolter mentioned before - with success. I had write about that kind of multiplayer here (and in another places too) many times during many years.
search.php?keywords=tcpsetup
There is no interest for that. Sorry.

IPX can be forwarded over VPN connections and other tunnels.
http://shaddack.brutowave.com/projects/ipx/

aleksej wrote:

Robhalfordfan, well in short. I think for such an authentic way to DOS multiplayer with these antique pieces of software like tc […]
Show full quote

Robhalfordfan, well in short. I think for such an authentic way to DOS multiplayer with these antique pieces of software like tcpsetup, iFrag, Kali (in standalone client-client mode) just one thing is important. Your DOS machine must be accessible by TCP protocol from worldwide side in various roles - as FTP or Telnet/BBS station in example. Fact that you can access WWW or BBS from this machine as client is not enough. Not only you should receive packets, but another player should receve him from you. In such scheme no one acts like passive client. Each side acts like server for another. Try set FTP server on your DOS machine. You can get one from mTCP package. If another person can receive file from your DOS machine via FTP - you on the right way. If not - no success game yet, sorry. Atleast with these old stuff like tcpsetup and iFrag (and Kalif for DOS too i think). You can make this FTP test by self - with your smartphone/tablet (do you have one?) with WiFi disabled and connected to net by Edge/GPRS/3G/4G. I mean not by your home network.

Try to forward it everywhere. 😀

There is no another players of such kind AFAIK. Only me and Revolter. We playin periodically in DOOM/Heretic in that way (i'm living in Moscow, Revolter in exKönigsberg) for last nine years in such small company of two people. By the way we had play coop on DII map 15 last night 😀 Also we had tryin play through Kali (in standalone mode - main kali.net server was down already for that time). As Revolter mentioned before - with success. I had write about that kind of multiplayer here (and in another places too) many times during many years.
search.php?keywords=tcpsetup
There is no interest for that. Sorry.

i set my dos pc up as an ftp server and first try on local network as a test to see if set it up right and that works but when i tired it over 4g on my phone no luck

Robhalfordfan, do you have "real" IP address? I mean your own IP address exclusively provided to you by your ISP and not shared with other ISP clients. It can be static or dynamic (it changes with next session) - makes no difference but all in all it always only yours. Without real IP way to play which i'm describe above just won't work, imho.
If you don't know what IP type you got you may ask your ISP for that and for posibility to make it "real" if him provides to you shared one by default.
I know nothing about another ways and tricks to make it to work and all words about posibility to overcome shared IPs, NAT's and similar evil things remain theoretical chatter, imho, atleast for years i has see no any success story about that antique kind of multiplayer in XXI era. Or maybe task is too much complex that fun just not worth the effort for most of engaged players. Of course we still talking about these early server independent and authentic DOS network tools for these games. Late nineties services like Kali, TEN or Kahn it'a a slightly different story.