Hi Philippe,
On your spreadsheet in the list of 'DOS sound compatible PC soundcards' you could perhaps add the PCI ForteMedia FM801. This card has been mentioned on Vogons as working in DOS though I don't know what level of SB emulation it has. Also on that sheet, line 17, the ES1938S I believe is known as the ESS Solo-1 rather than the Apollo.

Action Replay wrote on 2020-06-10, 17:37:

Hi Philippe,
On your spreadsheet in the list of 'DOS sound compatible PC soundcards' you could perhaps add the PCI ForteMedia FM801. This card has been mentioned on Vogons as working in DOS though I don't know what level of SB emulation it has. Also on that sheet, line 17, the ES1938S I believe is known as the ESS Solo-1 rather than the Apollo.

hi !
Thanks for your feedback.
I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon.
Will check for the ESS Solo-1, you should be right about it.

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

Prez wrote on 2020-06-12, 12:19:

hi ! Thanks for your feedback. I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon. Will check for the ESS Solo- […]
Show full quote

Action Replay wrote on 2020-06-10, 17:37:

Hi Philippe,
On your spreadsheet in the list of 'DOS sound compatible PC soundcards' you could perhaps add the PCI ForteMedia FM801. This card has been mentioned on Vogons as working in DOS though I don't know what level of SB emulation it has. Also on that sheet, line 17, the ES1938S I believe is known as the ESS Solo-1 rather than the Apollo.

hi !
Thanks for your feedback.
I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon.
Will check for the ESS Solo-1, you should be right about it.

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

If you want the ESS Solo-1 in a thin client, that's the Igel Etherminal J+ -> Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?
Super Socket 7, passively cooled with a K6-2E, riser with both PCI and ISA, Solo-1 and SiS graphics. Was eventually able to figure out the DDMA issue.

ragefury32 wrote on 2020-07-02, 17:24:

Prez wrote on 2020-06-12, 12:19:

hi ! Thanks for your feedback. I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon. Will check for the ESS Solo- […]
Show full quote

Action Replay wrote on 2020-06-10, 17:37:

Hi Philippe,
On your spreadsheet in the list of 'DOS sound compatible PC soundcards' you could perhaps add the PCI ForteMedia FM801. This card has been mentioned on Vogons as working in DOS though I don't know what level of SB emulation it has. Also on that sheet, line 17, the ES1938S I believe is known as the ESS Solo-1 rather than the Apollo.

hi !
Thanks for your feedback.
I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon.
Will check for the ESS Solo-1, you should be right about it.

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

If you want the ESS Solo-1 in a thin client, that's the Igel Winterminal J -> Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?
Super Socket 7, passively cooled with a K6-2E, riser with both PCI and ISA, Solo-1 and SiS graphics. Was eventually able to figure out the DDMA issue.

Hi !
I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exactly) and it looks great, and works both very well with ISA or PCI cards !
I think its pretty near the same machine ?

Its this one :
https://www.cbo-do.de/Computer/Thin-Clients/I … NEW::32543.html

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

Prez wrote on 2020-07-02, 18:25:

Hi ! I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exa […]
Show full quote

ragefury32 wrote on 2020-07-02, 17:24:

Prez wrote on 2020-06-12, 12:19:

hi ! Thanks for your feedback. I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon. Will check for the ESS Solo- […]
Show full quote

hi !
Thanks for your feedback.
I have one or two of these soundcards, will do some tests very soon.
Will check for the ESS Solo-1, you should be right about it.

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

If you want the ESS Solo-1 in a thin client, that's the Igel Winterminal J -> Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?
Super Socket 7, passively cooled with a K6-2E, riser with both PCI and ISA, Solo-1 and SiS graphics. Was eventually able to figure out the DDMA issue.

Hi !
I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exactly) and it looks great, and works both very well with ISA or PCI cards !
I think its pretty near the same machine ?

Its this one :
https://www.cbo-do.de/Computer/Thin-Clients/I … NEW::32543.html

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

Not really.
The Igel 5-2 is based on the Via C3 with a PM133 chipset (S3 ProSavage integrated GPU). The Igel-J is an older machine but it's AMD K6-2E based (but can accept a K6-3+ up to 570MHz), have 2 full sized PC100/133 SDRAM slots, a built-in power supply, a dual PCI/ISA riser, and have an embedded ESS Solo-1. It's very different from the Via Epia based thin clients out there.

ragefury32 wrote on 2020-07-03, 19:07:

Prez wrote on 2020-07-02, 18:25:

Hi ! I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exa […]
Show full quote

ragefury32 wrote on 2020-07-02, 17:24:

If you want the ESS Solo-1 in a thin client, that's the Igel Winterminal J -> Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?
Super Socket 7, passively cooled with a K6-2E, riser with both PCI and ISA, Solo-1 and SiS graphics. Was eventually able to figure out the DDMA issue.

Hi !
I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exactly) and it looks great, and works both very well with ISA or PCI cards !
I think its pretty near the same machine ?

Its this one :
https://www.cbo-do.de/Computer/Thin-Clients/I … NEW::32543.html

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

Not really.
The Igel 5-2 is based on the Via C3 with a PM133 chipset (S3 ProSavage integrated GPU). The Igel-J is an older machine but it's AMD K6-2E based (but can accept a K6-3+ up to 570MHz), have 2 full sized PC100/133 SDRAM slots, a built-in power supply, a dual PCI/ISA riser, and have an embedded ESS Solo-1. It's very different from the Via Epia based thin clients out there.

Interesting. Why they did have the same name ? 😁
Very strange.

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

Prez wrote on 2020-07-03, 20:17:

Interesting. Why they did have the same name ? :D Very strange. […]
Show full quote

ragefury32 wrote on 2020-07-03, 19:07:

Prez wrote on 2020-07-02, 18:25:

Hi ! I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exa […]
Show full quote

Hi !
I have an Igel 5/2 with an ISA and PCI port, VIA 82T686 southbridge for sound, and a S3 video card (don't remember what exactly) and it looks great, and works both very well with ISA or PCI cards !
I think its pretty near the same machine ?

Its this one :
https://www.cbo-do.de/Computer/Thin-Clients/I … NEW::32543.html

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

Not really.
The Igel 5-2 is based on the Via C3 with a PM133 chipset (S3 ProSavage integrated GPU). The Igel-J is an older machine but it's AMD K6-2E based (but can accept a K6-3+ up to 570MHz), have 2 full sized PC100/133 SDRAM slots, a built-in power supply, a dual PCI/ISA riser, and have an embedded ESS Solo-1. It's very different from the Via Epia based thin clients out there.

Interesting. Why they did have the same name ? 😁
Very strange.

Best regards
Philippe Dubois

It doesn't have the same name. In fact, it was never called the 5/2 during its lifetime - it's sold either as the 532 Premium/X-Term or the 596 Enteprise/Premium Plus models.
Igel have this annoying tendency to decouple the model name from the actual model which persists to this day ->

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search … n&ct=clnk&gl=us
(Why yes, thank you misconfigured crawler settings. Using google caches to bypass access restrictions to a silly Gartner research report yields useful results)

It's referred to on the hardware labelling as the 5/2 as the only significant difference between the 4 models seem to be software loadouts and differing DIMM/DOM loadouts, and that’s their internal inventory keeping code.

The Igel-J is listd here on evilbay -> https://www.ebay.com/itm/123974369343
It was known by Igel marketing as the Etherminal-J (it’s more like a J+ as the original Etherminal-J is based on the Cyrix/NatSemi MediaGX) but on the label it's the Winnet IV -> https://www.ebay.com/itm/382980919331

Of course, that's not the first time thin clients have other names. That’s mostly due to the lineage of thin client companies changing owners after the 2000s dotcom crash.

For example, the Wyse 8440XL thin client is on offer @ eBay US for $135 -> https://www.ebay.com/itm/253259600768

However, you might be able to buy a Netier NetXpress 2000XL at a less expensive price - its the same machine (Wyse bought out Netier to get into the thin client business) -> https://usermanual.wiki/Wyse-Technology/WT844 … nual-165067.pdf

It's K6-2 based, but uses the same PLE133 chipset as the later Via Epia based thin clients out there. The big plus here is using a K6-2+ or K6-2+ embedded model to get access to Powernow clocking and lower heat generation (K6s tends to perform better than the earlier Via C3s). And yes, it has an old Via southbridge so DOS sound support works natively on the machine, but given how the VIA FM synthesis requires a large chunk of conventional memory and sounds less-than-stellar (I have a Wyse Winterm 9450XE here so I speak from experience), I prefer sticking with the Igel-J...much easier to make DOS behave with the hardware (once you unravel it), and it's easier to add hardware hacks like a Voodoo 2, a slimline laptop optical drive, and a 26 pin FFC Gotek to it - all of which I am doing now.

Of course, it's slightly more hilarious later on when Neoware (now part of HP), Wyse (now part of Dell) and Igel went to the same Chinese ODM to build their thin clients.

I just spotted (and bought) an HP Compaq T5525 Thin Client from German eBay. Specs seems to be almost same as T5515: 800MHz CPU, 128Mb RAM, 256Mb Flash storage. No idea yet about specific video or audio chip. I'll test it out once it arrives.

https://www.cnet.com/products/hp-compaq-thin- … or-none-series/

Ariakos wrote on 2021-03-12, 21:50:

I just spotted (and bought) an HP Compaq T5525 Thin Client from German eBay. Specs seems to be almost same as T5515: 800MHz CPU, 128Mb RAM, 256Mb Flash storage. No idea yet about specific video or audio chip. I'll test it out once it arrives.

https://www.cnet.com/products/hp-compaq-thin- … or-none-series/

Eeeh, the t5525 is a very different animal than the t5515, and they are not remotely similar.

You are dealing with -
A) Via Eden 800Mhz
B) Via Apollo CLE266 (UniChrome, aka S3 ProSavage IGP graphics)
C) Via VT8235 (AC97 only with no DOS compatibility)
D) 128MB soldered RAM (some t5515s have RAM slots).
Very much not a DOS compatible thin client.

ragefury32 wrote on 2021-03-13, 03:48:

Eeeh, the t5525 is a very different animal than the t5515, and they are not remotely similar. […]
Show full quote

Ariakos wrote on 2021-03-12, 21:50:

I just spotted (and bought) an HP Compaq T5525 Thin Client from German eBay. Specs seems to be almost same as T5515: 800MHz CPU, 128Mb RAM, 256Mb Flash storage. No idea yet about specific video or audio chip. I'll test it out once it arrives.

https://www.cnet.com/products/hp-compaq-thin- … or-none-series/

Eeeh, the t5525 is a very different animal than the t5515, and they are not remotely similar.

You are dealing with -
A) Via Eden 800Mhz
B) Via Apollo CLE266 (UniChrome, aka S3 ProSavage IGP graphics)
C) Via VT8235 (AC97 only with no DOS compatibility)
D) 128MB soldered RAM (some t5515s have RAM slots).
Very much not a DOS compatible thin client.

Well... crap. At least it was cheap. I guess I'll tinker with it as a Win98 platform for awhile. Next time I better stick to tried & tested models like T5710 or T5720.

hey guys. I got a compaq evo t20 here ... any chance to run DOS on it? i guess the evo 20 is very different from the evo t20

Comatron wrote on 2021-03-26, 20:15:

hey guys. I got a compaq evo t20 here ... any chance to run DOS on it? i guess the evo 20 is very different from the evo t20

What's an Evo 20? 2 Mitsu Evo 10s stacked on top of one another?

The T20 is a Geode GX1 device, so yeah, it can do DOS and has SB emulation built-in. The GX1 isn't exactly known for performance, and the SB emulation is basically some NatSemi binary blob in the BIOS that allows the onboard AC97 to function as a Soundblaster-like audio device in DOS - it’s supposedly not bad, but your compatibility mileage may vary here.

The other issue you might have is that the T20 does not have a realtime clock chip and use SmartMedia as a flash storage medium (which is as dead as Sony MemorySticks or xD cards).

Here’s what the teardown looks like ->
https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/EvoT20/

Thanx for the extensive Infos. So yeah, i have no usecase for it. I got look out for some small form factor dos box with good soundblaster capabilities as i want to run fasttracker II and some dos-games with perfect sound. Ill stumble around here a bit more in the forums.

Comatron wrote on 2021-03-28, 10:29:

Thanx for the extensive Infos. So yeah, i have no usecase for it. I got look out for some small form factor dos box with good soundblaster capabilities as i want to run fasttracker II and some dos-games with perfect sound. Ill stumble around here a bit more in the forums.

Look for a Wyse Winterm 8440XL (also listed as WT8440XL) - it crops up on evilbay best offers for about 120. They are K6-2 based thin clients with a Via chipset that has a Cyberblade GPU (slow but workable) and the VT8231 southbridge (DOS compatible). It should also have a riser board that can do both PCI or ISA (not at the same time). Slap a TNT2 or 3dfx/PCI card in there if you want 3D perf, or an ISA soundblaster in there if you want true SB support.

The other option is the Igel Winnet III (Igel J) or Winnet IV (Igel J+). The Winnet3 has a Geode GX1 and a PCI/ISA breakout board. The Winnet 4 is K6-2 based with a SiS chipset, an ESS Solo-1 integrated and a PCI/ISA breakout board. The 3s are much more common than the 4s and they are known to pop up on evilbay for around 100 including taxes.

Now thats some neat advide. I gonna keep an eye on those systems on ebay germany overe here. Thank you a lot.

No chance for this models here in Germany. Maybe there is something in this search here that is cheap and works? Maybe you can take a look. It´s our Craigslist and yeah, best chances on that site in Germany.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-thin-client/k0r30

Comatron wrote on 2021-03-28, 17:53:

No chance for this models here in Germany. Maybe there is something in this search here that is cheap and works? Maybe you can take a look. It´s our Craigslist and yeah, best chances on that site in Germany.

https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-thin-client/k0r30

There’s a t5710 there for about 40 Euros - it’s not awful, look for an ESS solo-1 or a vortex2 PCI card if you want good audio. Either that or look for a Diebold/Nixdorf Beetle-M or S, which is a small POS PC that has PCI and ISA slots within.

Is it this one: https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/t … ent=app_android ? if so, do that ess and vortex cards run nice under dos? i am pumped ro buy that thing :0

Comatron wrote on 2021-03-29, 07:12:

Is it this one: https://www.ebay-kleinanzeigen.de/s-anzeige/t … ent=app_android ? if so, do that ess and vortex cards run nice under dos? i am pumped ro buy that thing :0

Yep. It’s the 800MHz model, which Phil did a video on. It doesn’t come with the optional PCI expansion bay (HP part number DE961A), which is desirable if you choose to head in that direction.

https://www.philscomputerlab.com/hp-t5710.html

The Dell CP series are great dos laptops. Also the Libretto's are great for dos as well.

T.