VOGONS


Reply 20 of 36, by H3nrik V!

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IIRC Coppermines in the 600-866 was pretty common here in Denmark .. As far as Tualatin goes, it's just a matter of pronouncing the name as "too late in" - it just showed up too late .. Especially 512k versions were never common ..

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Reply 21 of 36, by Tetrium

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H3nrik V! wrote on 2020-10-04, 20:23:

IIRC Coppermines in the 600-866 was pretty common here in Denmark .. As far as Tualatin goes, it's just a matter of pronouncing the name as "too late in" - it just showed up too late .. Especially 512k versions were never common ..

I've had roughly similar experiences here in The Netherlands with 600MHz to 866MHz being pretty much common. The 1GHz CPUs and Tualatins with 256KB were rather more uncommon (with a 1.2GHz Tualatin 256KB being the highest clocked one I ever found here in the wild (in a used PC)), but even the 1GHz Coppermine was not rare over here, just much less common.
Celerons were all over the place here btw (the Coppermine ones that is).

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Reply 22 of 36, by W.x.

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I would like to ask, if Celeron Tualatin 900A overclocked to 1.2 Ghz is same fast, as Pentium III Tualatin 1.2 Ghz with 256kb cache.
So in other words, are the chips and their cache exactly same, and only difference is FSB? So, by overclocking 900A to 1.2Ghz, will I get exactly same speed as Pentium III 1.2 Ghz, Tualatin, 256kb cache?

Reply 23 of 36, by The Serpent Rider

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No, Pentium III also some cache optimizations which Celeron don't have.

Last edited by Stiletto on 2021-01-18, 00:15. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 24 of 36, by W.x.

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The Serpent Rider wrote on 2021-01-17, 09:30:

No, Pentium III also some cache optimizations which Celeron don't have.

Do you know about any benchmark, where it is tested, and can be seen, how much slower it is on same frequency?

Last edited by Stiletto on 2021-01-18, 00:15. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 25 of 36, by The Serpent Rider

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You can search "Tualatin Data prefetch logic". Apparently Celeron Tualatin don't have it (datasheet info). Although the difference is in range of 2-5% and PIII Coppermine also don't have it.

One russian site claims that DPL is active even on Tualerons, but it was tested on engineering sample with unlocked multiplier - https://fcenter.ru/online/hardarticles/processors/1326

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Reply 29 of 36, by Warlord

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brassicGamer wrote on 2020-10-02, 20:38:

[*]Intel won the GHz war, by releasing their 1GHz Pentium III a month before AMD's Athlon.

This is historically false. It was more like AMD shipped a 1ghz CPU 2-3 days before Intel did.

Reply 30 of 36, by W.x.

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PARKE wrote on 2021-01-17, 15:10:

There is an interesting thread wich includes a comment by an Intel spokesperson here:
https://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthrea … ion-Accelerator

Ok, according this, it seems, both Celeron Tualatin and Pentium III Tualatin have same core, so same data prefetch. The reason, why Celeron is few % behind same clocked Pentium III, is, according that discussion, that Pentium III has better timing on L2 cache. PIII has 0, while Celeron has 1 . (more is worse as on any memory)

Reply 31 of 36, by PARKE

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But in that thread there is also this comment:
[Flu!d said: 02-05-02 02:21 AM // The Tualatin Celeron (P3) has data prefetch enabled, and the cache latency of 1 in no way seems to hinder peformance as far as I can tell through excessive benchmarking and use of this processor - In fact it only seems to help with the overclockability of the chip. ]]

So.....

Reply 32 of 36, by The Serpent Rider

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So if fcenter article is also correct, then Tualerons are at least faster than any PIII Coppermine, which probably also have better L2 cache latency. But there's no direct proof that they are equal to PIII Tualatin.

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Reply 33 of 36, by W.x.

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It can be benchmarked, on same board, using Pentium III Tualatin 1.2 Ghz 256kb cache, and Overclocked 900A Celeron. Then test it with 9x100 Coppermine Pentium III, and 900A stock Celeron Tualatin. I have only Tualatin 1.3 and 1.4 Ghz Celerons, so I can't. I have only 933 Mhz Pentium III Coppermine, but it's 133 Mhz FSB obviously, so can only downclock it to 700 Mhz, on 100 Fsb.

Reply 34 of 36, by brassicGamer

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Warlord wrote on 2021-01-17, 15:14:
brassicGamer wrote on 2020-10-02, 20:38:

[*]Intel won the GHz war, by releasing their 1GHz Pentium III a month before AMD's Athlon.

This is historically false. It was more like AMD shipped a 1ghz CPU 2-3 days before Intel did.

Correct!

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Reply 35 of 36, by brassicGamer

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PARKE wrote on 2021-01-17, 16:25:

But in that thread there is also this comment:
[Flu!d said: 02-05-02 02:21 AM // The Tualatin Celeron (P3) has data prefetch enabled, and the cache latency of 1 in no way seems to hinder peformance as far as I can tell through excessive benchmarking and use of this processor - In fact it only seems to help with the overclockability of the chip. ]]

So.....

There is some merit in this, as the highest recorded overclock result was achieved using a 1.4GHz Tualeron. Relative performance could be something to add to the article as it's something people often ask about. It really was the last good Celeron.

It does also state in the article that Data Prefetch is included in all Tualeron core models. It was an integral part of the die layout.

Last edited by brassicGamer on 2021-01-27, 12:15. Edited 1 time in total.

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