VOGONS


First post, by KVM Nerd

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Hi everybody,

now that my retro PC KVM switching project (the "RetroRacks Project") has grown for over 15 years, and because I could not find a comparable project on the net, I thought it is time to show it somewhere.

Maybe it would be worth to do some videos in the future to explain things in detail and show it in action? I am looking forward to your comments and questions!

Idea

The idea of the project is to be able to control one of the up to 15 PCs at a time from either the desk, the TV in the living room or from anywhere via the internet. The switching should include:

  • Keyboard
  • Video
  • Mouse
  • Audio
  • Game Controls (not via internet)

There should be one PC from every important PC generation with reasonable specs.

Features

(*planned)

  • 15 PCs from XT to current generations (+2 Servers)
  • 3 Guest inputs:
    • VGA & PS/2 & 2.0 Analog Audio Guest PC
    • VGA & USB & 2.0 Analog Audio Guest PC
    • DVI/HDMI & USB & 7.1 Analog Audio PC)
  • *1 Universal Guest I/O with
    • HDMI In & HDMI Out
    • Analog 2.0 Out
    • Analog 7.1 In
    • USB 2.0 Device
  • *All PCs put in 19" 4U cases (except the XT, because a special case would be needed)
  • 3 Consoles:
    • Local Console (Desk)
    • Remote Console (Living Room TV)
    • IP console (from everywhere)
  • Supported Signal Formats and Protocols:
    • Video: HGC, MGA, CGA, EGA, VGA, DVI, HDMI
      • Analog input vertical: 15 kHz to 145 kHz, horizontal: 30 Hz to 170 Hz
      • Digital input vertical: 15 kHz to 270 kHz, horizontal: 24 Hz to 240 Hz
    • Audio: *TTL (PC Speaker), Analog 2.0/4.0/5.1/7.1 + Mic + Line In, S/PDIF (Coax), HDMI, Room Microphones
    • Audio Downmixing of (only for machines located in C1):
      • *TTL (PC Speaker)
      • Analog 2.0
      • S/PDIF
      • MIDI Expanders
      • Room Microphones
    • Keyboard: XT, AT & PS/2, USB
    • Mouse: Serial, PS/2, USB
    • Game Controller: *Analog, USB
  • MIDI Expanders
    • Roland MT-32:
      • MT-32 (old)
      • *MT-32 (new)
      • CM-32L
    • Roland Sound Canvas:
      • SC-55
      • SC-55MKII
      • SC-88
    • Yamaha XG:
      • *MU80
  • Out-Of-Band USB peripherals
  • Automation:
    • Power Switching
    • Signal Routing
    • *KVM Switching
    • *Central Control with GUI
  • Complete Audio and Video Capturing
  • Ethernet Connections for all PCs

Possible Future Expansions

  • Floppy Emulation with Image mounting via Network
  • CD-ROM/DVD-ROM Emulation with Image mounting via Network and CD-Audio support
  • HDMI Video Grabbing
  • Game Controls via IP

Installed PCs

(Needs review and suggestions, *planned) within two 36U cabinets:

  • 8086-2 8 MHz + 8087-2 8 MHz FPU, 640 KB RAM, 360 K 5.25" Floppy, 40 MB HDD
  • *80286 class, 640+ K RAM, 1200 KB 5.25" Floppy, 40+ MB HDD
  • *80386 class, 4+ MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 100+ MB HDD, 2x CD-ROM
  • *80486 class, 8+ MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 500+ MB HDD, 4x+ CD-ROM
  • *Pentium class, 16+ MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 1+ GB HDD, 8x+ CD-ROM
  • Pentium MMX 233 MHz, 64 MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 2 GB HDD, 16x+ CD-ROM
  • *Pentium II 400+ MHz, 128+ MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 10+ GB HDD, 32x+ CD-ROM
  • *Pentium III 1000+ MHz, 256+ MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 20+ GB HDD, 2x+ DVD-ROM
  • AMD Athlon XP 1833 MHz, 512 MB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 80 GB HDD, 8x DVD-ROM
  • AMD Athlon64 2400 MHz, 4 GB RAM, 1440 KB 3.5" Floppy, 500 GB HDD, 16x DVD-ROM
  • ...

Schematics

Simplified Signal Flow:
signal_flow_basic.png

Note that not every combination of protocols/signals is possible for every PC. I guess you won't find a PC with XT keyboard and USB mouse...

KVM Switch Basic Infrastructure:
KVM_basic_4.png

Explanation
<Location><Number>-<Device Type><Number>

Locations:

  • C = Cabinet
  • D = Desk

Device Types:

  • CMP = Computer
  • GCP = Guest Computer
  • KVM = KVM Switch

Pics

The two 19" 36U Cabinets:
cabinets_may_2021.jpg

Notes:

  • Cables for guest computers are located in the middle of each rack
  • USB 2.0 Distribution has not been mounted yet in cabinet 1
  • AT PCs need to be put in 19" cases
  • Not all cases are populated
  • Network cables need to be connected
  • U1-4 of each rack are reserved for file servers

Components Mounted in Desk near the Two Cabinets (Cabling not Final):
signal_routing_january_2021.jpg

Components above from Bottom to Top (*planned):

  • U1-2: (Drawer)
  • U3-6: (PC for everyday work)
  • U7: 48 port Gbe Network Switch
  • U8: Cable Management
  • U9: Central KVM Switch
  • U10: USB 2.0 Switch, *Aux I/O Panel, *Raspi to control EDID Emulator and USB 2.0 Switch
  • U11: Blank Panel for Future Expansion
  • U12-13: 4x4 HDMI 2.0 Matrix Switch, HDMI Splitter, HDBaseT 2.0 KVM Extender, IP KVM Extender, Analog 2.0 to S/PDIF ADC, EDID Emulator, USB Extender, USB 2.0 4x Hub, USB 3.0 4x Hub, DVI-D + S/PDIF to HDMI Mux
  • U14-15: Modular Matrix Switch: 4x4 USB 2.0, 8x4 S/PDIF, 16x16 Analog Audio

Website

I am currently building a website to document my project, which will take a long time to finish. Feel free to visit it anyhow: https://www.kvmnerd.com

TL;DR

I built a project which enables me to control one of the up to 15 PCs at a time from either the desk, the TV in the living room or from anywhere via the internet.

EDIT February 28th, 2024:

  • Added signal ranges for video input
  • Added TTL (PC Speaker) Audio, Room Microphones and Audio Downmixing to Audio section
  • Replaced 2.0/4.0/5.1/7.1 Analog Audio Recording with Complete Audio and Video Capturing
  • Added MIDI Expander Section

EDIT June 6th, 2022:

  • Removed planned status from following items in Supported Signal Formats and Protocols:
    • Video: *MGA, *CGA, *EGA
    • Audio: *S/PDIF (Coax)
    • Mouse: *Serial
  • Added HGC to Video in Supported Signal Formats and Protocols
  • Removed planned status from following items in Components above from Bottom to Top:
    • *8x4 S/PDIF
  • Changed Subject that it includes the "RetroRacks Project"
Last edited by KVM Nerd on 2024-02-28, 11:01. Edited 2 times in total.

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 1 of 19, by gn0me

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Wow, how am I the first person to comment on this project?! This is phenomenal and gives me some inspiration to do something similar, although I have a meagre 7 machines ranging from a 486 through to my daily driver dual 10 core 192gb ram workstation.

Great job! Do you have any videos of it in operation?

1990-1997 DOS/W95: micron millennium mme/p200mmx/64mb/matrox millennium II 6mb/orchid righteous 3d 4mb/sb16 & dream blaster s2

Reply 3 of 19, by davidrg

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I'd be quite interested to know what hardware is being used! Especially whats being used to handle signal conversion to DVI-D - I've heard very few off-the-shelf widgets do the job properly often not properly supporting the various weird resolutions older PCs tend to put out.

Reply 4 of 19, by BinaryDemon

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Love the rack setup.

Check out DOSBox Distro:

https://sites.google.com/site/dosboxdistro/ [*]

a lightweight Linux distro (tinycore) which boots off a usb flash drive and goes straight to DOSBox.

Make your dos retrogaming experience portable!

Reply 6 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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Videos are planned for sure! :-) So much to show and explain on this... Will be a whole series I guess.

I'm using two different VGA to DVI-D converters in the signal chain at the moment, the OSSC for the old and weird stuff, and an Extron converter for the newer computers and of course a switch to select one of them depending on the situation. I'm nailed to converters which can be remote controlled for automation purposes.

There will be a list of all hardware I'm using, plans of how it is connected to each other etc. once it is all setup and confirmed working okay.

Looks like my original post needs to be updated! A lot of things have changed since then, so luckily I can remove the planned sign from many points!

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 7 of 19, by Garrett W

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This is insane in the best possible way! I also find it very inspiring, it has been somewhat of a dream of mine to have every system of mine rackmounted and controlled from a single point. If you ever end up making that video, I'd love to see it!

Reply 8 of 19, by mR_Slug

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Very impressive. I once had 8 old PCs connected to a kvm made out of a serial switcher box. Had to wire my own cables. Thought that was nuts. I got 4 16port KVMs cheap a while back so have planned something like this before but not at this level.

The Retro Web | EISA .cfg Archive | Chip set Encyclopedia

Reply 9 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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Since my original post was more than a year old, I did a quick edit update it to the current status. Photos will be updated later.

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 10 of 19, by Xplo

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“Holy moly” being a previous comment I require to ditto!

This is incredible, i love complex projects like this that actually solve a bespoke problem. Kudos to you and I look forward to the updates !

Reply 11 of 19, by SteveC

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Love this! What video cards did you use in each box?

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/StevesTechShed
Twitter: https://twitter.com/SteveTechShed

Reply 12 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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SteveC wrote on 2022-06-06, 22:50:

Love this! What video cards did you use in each box?

The computers are still work in progress. This is what I want to use as video cards in each machine (*planned):

  • 8086-2: Hercules Graphics Card Clone (TTL, came with the machine, I prefer it over MGA anyhow because of the graphics mode)
  • *80286 class: EGA Clone (TTL, maybe outdated for a late 80286, but I want to have TTL color graphics)
  • *80386 class: Tseng Labs ET300o (VGA)
  • *80486 class: Tseng Labs ET4000 (VGA, unfortunately the ATI Mach64 VLB I own seems to be dead)
  • *Pentium class: S3 ViRGE + 3dfx Voodoo (VGA)
  • Pentium MMX 233 MHz: Matrox Mystique + 3dfx Voodoo (VGA)
  • *Pentium II 400+ MHz: nVidia Riva TNT/TNT2 + 2x (SLI) 3dfx Voodoo II (VGA)
  • *Pentium III 1000+ MHz: An early DVI AGP card, no choice yet (DVI)
  • AMD Athlon XP 1833 MHz: ATI Radeon 9800XT (DVI)
  • AMD Athlon64 2400 MHz: ATI Radeon X1950XTX (DVI)
  • AMD Ryzen 7 1800X: nVidia Geforce GTX 1080 (HDMI)

Suggestions welcome! Most choices are not final. I am trying to cover the most important technologies and most widespread video cards of each generation.

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 13 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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I just wanted to note my project is not dead. But since I've become dad, time has become a very rare resource.

The whole signal routing has received a major update allowing me to do some more cool things (IMHO), notably audio mixing from various sources, 2.0/4.0/5.1/7.1 analog HDMI audio embedding up to 1920x1200 @ 60 Hz and full audio and video capturing. The 36 U cabinets will be replaced by 42 U cabinets soon, leaving more space for things like MIDI Expanders (how could I ever forget?!). Once the cabinets are replaced, I'll update the photos too.

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 14 of 19, by chinny22

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Not sure how I missed this for so long, I've a rack mount plan in my head for when I get a long term home.
but this is at another level. I was thinking of just a rack with shelves to put the PC's kind of like my currant setup.

Rack.jpg

My requirements are also not as demanding. Don't need remote access.
I run 3 screens for my main PC and happy to have a KVM per screen. That way I can play network games (mostly against myself) 3 sets of keyboards is annoying though I'll admit.
I'll keep the tower cases but those desktops in the rack do look damn impressive.

Currently I'm using toslink and small switchbox for some of the PC's but EAX only supports surround sound if using analogue cables, haven't given this much thought yet as since having kids I'm mostly using headphones now anyway.

How is your power and network wired up?
For power I currently have a power strip per shelf but that includes a few power strips plugged into another power strips. I'm not worried about overloading. typically, no more than 3 PC's are on at any 1 time but still it's not ideal.
I was thinking of something like a rack mount PDU that runs top to bottom of the rack.

Network I currently have patch leads go direct from the switch to the PC but this gets messy depending how far the switch they are.
I was thinking of a patch panel per shelf, less of a problem for you as only have 1 PC per shelf but you have multiple racks.

and finally, congratulations on becoming a father! This setup will help alot as spare time will disappear so simply been able to turn on a PC at a moments notice is woth the saved time of unplugging, moving, plugging in anther PC depending on your mood.

Reply 16 of 19, by Aui

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Those Highscreen desktops are among the best AT cases ever:
- pleasing beige color - check
- cool badge - check
- no proprietary LPX form - check
- not too bulky - check
- vertical floppy to save space - check
- keylook - check
- turbo and reset button - check
- digital MHz display - check
- exchangable HDD - extra bonus
- awesome minimalistic design - check

very nice project !

Reply 17 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:
Not sure how I missed this for so long, I've a rack mount plan in my head for when I get a long term home. but this is at anothe […]
Show full quote

Not sure how I missed this for so long, I've a rack mount plan in my head for when I get a long term home.
but this is at another level. I was thinking of just a rack with shelves to put the PC's kind of like my currant setup.

Rack.jpg

Nice setup! I don't have enough space for a setup like you and many others are showing, so I chose the KVM switching approach.

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

My requirements are also not as demanding. Don't need remote access.

I don't need it too, but I am enjoying building it!

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

I run 3 screens for my main PC and happy to have a KVM per screen. That way I can play network games (mostly against myself) 3 sets of keyboards is annoying though I'll admit.

Who wins when you play then? 😉

I am completely avoiding additional keyboards and mice. Maybe a mobile set would be helpful when working at the back of the cabinets when diagnosing things.

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

I'll keep the tower cases but those desktops in the rack do look damn impressive.

I'm afraid I have bad news for you: I got rid of all desktop cases except the one of the XT machine, because I cannot transplant the mainboard to a 19" case due to its non-standard form factor.

The reason why I chose 19" cases is simple:

  • I can extend them from the rack like a drawer which makes them much easier to handle
  • They have got much more space for additional hardware and are much better to service (and I personally don't like the riser cards used in small cases)
  • The air flows through filters which avoids dust in the machines
chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

Currently I'm using toslink and small switchbox for some of the PC's but EAX only supports surround sound if using analogue cables, haven't given this much thought yet as since having kids I'm mostly using headphones now anyway.

I am using a solution which enables me to switch all kinds of audio. I was aware of the EAX problem which won't work through S/PDIF, but it is possible to digitize the 5.1/7.1 surround audio and embed it into HDMI which enables me to extend it to the living room. Which lacks a surround receiver, haha. Future extensions...

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

How is your power and network wired up?

I was starting with a central 48 port Gbit switch and wired everything to it, but I gave up this solution because I was running out of ports (yes). The current solution uses three 24 port Gbit switches, a central one and one for each cabinet using a single Gbit uplink each.

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

For power I currently have a power strip per shelf but that includes a few power strips plugged into another power strips. I'm not worried about overloading. typically, no more than 3 PC's are on at any 1 time but still it's not ideal.
I was thinking of something like a rack mount PDU that runs top to bottom of the rack.

I had to cascade PDUs too, but that should be okay because I only want to run maybe a few machines at the same time.

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

Network I currently have patch leads go direct from the switch to the PC but this gets messy depending how far the switch they are.
I was thinking of a patch panel per shelf, less of a problem for you as only have 1 PC per shelf but you have multiple racks.

I got rid of the mess by using a tree topology and mostly only use patch cables within the cabinets and only a few which go outside.

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:09:

and finally, congratulations on becoming a father! This setup will help alot as spare time will disappear so simply been able to turn on a PC at a moments notice is woth the saved time of unplugging, moving, plugging in anther PC depending on your mood.

Thank you!

When I count the hours I put into the project, I could have plugged cables and move machines instead for weeks or months! 😁 But anyhow, once it's fully working, it really should be just like you wrote: Select a machine and run it.

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 18 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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kingcake wrote on 2024-02-29, 01:39:

This is very impressive.

Thank you and all others who wrote comments like this! That really motivates me to keep working on the project.

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?

Reply 19 of 19, by KVM Nerd

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Aui wrote on 2024-02-29, 02:48:
Those Highscreen desktops are among the best AT cases ever: - pleasing beige color - check - cool badge - check - no proprietary […]
Show full quote

Those Highscreen desktops are among the best AT cases ever:
- pleasing beige color - check
- cool badge - check
- no proprietary LPX form - check
- not too bulky - check
- vertical floppy to save space - check
- keylook - check
- turbo and reset button - check
- digital MHz display - check
- exchangable HDD - extra bonus
- awesome minimalistic design - check

I agree to all of the points, but as I wrote in my previous post, I got rid of the cases for various other reasons. I was prioritizing function over appeal. I'm still smiling when I see Highscreen cases! 😉

Aui wrote on 2024-02-29, 02:48:

very nice project !

Thank you in advance!

Why not hook it up to a KVM switch?