You'll get as many answers as there are stars in the universe. Pick the first one and run with it.

Or use an internet search engine.

MarkP wrote on 2022-07-16, 07:23:

You'll get as many answers as there are stars in the universe. Pick the first one and run with it.

Or use an internet search engine.

If people like you and me won't give answers, internet search will return nothing. 🙂

My version of the short answer is as follows:

1. If you are a gamer - Install on your present machine an emulator and you'll be able to play any game with zero expenses.

2. If you are into hardware tinkering - forget about one-machine-for-all-retro-games and prepare lots of free space at home and lots of money to be spent.

3. If you are into playing all retro games on old hardware - prepare even more free space and even more money to be spent.

That's how it works in reality.

Harlock wrote on 2022-07-16, 07:11:

I'm not sure if I should get a Pentium MMX 166Mhz or something faster, like a 200Mhz or a Pentium II for such scope.

That Pentium MMX 166 CPU is pretty much perfect for DOS. At full speed, it will run even the later games quite well, unless you play them at 640x480 or higher using software rendering. OTOH, you can use SetMul to slow it down to 386 and 486 levels as needed for any speed sensitive titles. As a bonus, you won't encounter the dreaded "runtime error 200" issue which occurs on Intel chips running at 200 MHz or more.

It can also run early Win9x 3D titles (made in '96 and '97) well enough, especially if you pair it with a Voodoo1 or a Voodoo2. But trying to play games made in 1998 and later on that system likely won't give you a great time.

I'm using a similar rig and you can read some of my experiences in this thread if you're interested.

Thanks for all your replies.
@ThinkpadIL - I guess we are beyond point 2 and 3 😁 I'm well aware of the "issue", and I'm aware that a single machine for all eras does not exist, that's why I'm considering one for early-mid 90s, while I'll keep the PIII for late 90s/early 2000 titles.

@Joseph_Joestar - that is very helpful, on this perspective the MMX 166 looks like a better option, early 90s to roughly '96/'97 is perfect for the scope, I suppose I'll most probably go with that, oh and of course it will have ISA slots for the sound card 😀

A 166MMX may be a sweet spot.
For slowing it down to a speed similar to a 486 you can follow this approach:
https://www.philscomputerlab.com/136-in-1-pentium-mmx.html

As said: Just go with the 166 and you're fine 😀
Some lame, cheap but very compatible S3 trio/virge graphics and 32MB ram and you're all set 😀

Voodoo could be a nice addition, but they're expensive. Not a must have for DOS.

Also, if your w98 game won't run on this system, your p3 will take over from this point, so there's no need for anything faster here.

If you go all the way to 386 games and lower the setmul may help and if they don't do the trick you definitely need to get an XT (or dosbox).

Harlock wrote on 2022-07-16, 08:25:

Thanks for all your replies.
@ThinkpadIL - I guess we are beyond point 2 and 3 😁 I'm well aware of the "issue", and I'm aware that a single machine for all eras does not exist, that's why I'm considering one for early-mid 90s, while I'll keep the PIII for late 90s/early 2000 titles.

@Joseph_Joestar - that is very helpful, on this perspective the MMX 166 looks like a better option, early 90s to roughly '96/'97 is perfect for the scope, I suppose I'll most probably go with that, oh and of course it will have ISA slots for the sound card 😀

The thing is that it is not only about a CPU, it's also about Graphics and Sound Cards. There are lots of different types of them and every early DOS game in order to work perfectly needs different combination of those two. So, in addition to sweet-spot-retro-PC you'll need to have also a bunch of Graphics and Sound Cards.

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-07-16, 08:56:

The thing is that it is not only about a CPU, it's also about Graphics and Sound Cards. There are lots of different types of them and every early DOS game in order to work perfectly needs different combination of those two. So, in addition to sweet-spot-retro-PC you'll need to have also a bunch of Graphics and Sound Cards.

For sound cards, I agree that the situation is complicated and there is no single card which perfectly covers all bases. Though the MK8330 comes very close to that.

For graphics cards, it depends on whether one cares about early 3D acceleration in DOS. If not, an S3 Trio64V+ is excellent in terms of 2D DOS game compatibility. But if 3D titles are of interest, it can be paired with a Voodoo1, which will make 90% of 3D accelerated DOS games playable as well.

You might as well go for a Pentium MMX 233 as you can easily underclock it to 166MHz.

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2022-07-16, 07:51:

But trying to play games made in 1998 and later on that system likely won't give you a great time.

Pentium MMX 166 MHz was only introduced in 1997, and by 1999 it was pretty much obsolete... those were different times indeed.

Tetrium wrote on 2022-07-16, 20:02:

You might as well go for a Pentium MMX 233 as you can easily underclock it to 166MHz.

Jumperless Socket 7 (not super) motherboards which allow changing the multiplier in the BIOS are very rare. And while it's entirely possible to use jumpers to downclock the CPU, that's not exactly convenient. Especially if you need to do it whenever you encounter a speed sensitive game.

Azarien wrote on 2022-07-16, 21:49:

Pentium MMX 166 MHz was only introduced in 1997, and by 1999 it was pretty much obsolete... those were different times indeed.

Yeah, technology was moving at a rapid pace back then. To be fair, you could still play 3D games from '98 on that machine (with a Voodoo1 or a Voodoo2) just not at 60+ FPS which we consider the norm nowadays. But if you're satisfied with 25-30 FPS instead (as most of us were back in the day) that is quite doable.

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2022-07-16, 22:57:

Azarien wrote on 2022-07-16, 21:49:

Pentium MMX 166 MHz was only introduced in 1997, and by 1999 it was pretty much obsolete... those were different times indeed.

Yeah, technology was moving at a rapid pace back then. To be fair, you could still play 3D games from '98 on that machine (with a Voodoo1 or a Voodoo2) just not at 60+ FPS which we consider the norm nowadays. But if you're satisfied with 25-30 FPS instead (as most of us were back in the day) that is quite doable.

It is interesting that some people even after 30-40 years are still looking for the same painful way to play those old games. Now you have the money and old hardware is quite cheap, why not buying the best possible configuration for your childhood game? Why to suffer the same old pain? 🙄

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-07-17, 04:47:

It is interesting that some people even after 30-40 years are still looking for the same painful way to play those old games. Now you have the money and old hardware is quite cheap, why not buying the best possible configuration for your childhood game? Why to suffer the same old pain? 🙄

It sometimes confuses myself.
While personally, I just love to tinker with my childhood tech, I'm not absolutely period-correct.
Things like RAM and disk space are installed by demand, not by period-correctness.

To answer your questions, I have some theories:

a) Nostalgia (light). People want to experience games the way they were meant to be.
Or what they think the developers had in mind. 😉

b) People want to re-live the old days, exactly as they remember.
They want to go back to the more carefree times, when they had the time of their life.
To do so, they need to recreate old setups and surround themselves with things from back then.
Some even create a little man cave (a private room) in the style of that time.
Only then, the illusion of living in the past again is perfect.
Every little false nuance, like a boot-up screen with a high amount of memory or a 2000+ copyright string is ruining it.

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-07-17, 04:47:

It is interesting that some people even after 30-40 years are still looking for the same painful way to play those old games. Now you have the money and old hardware is quite cheap, why not buying the best possible configuration for your childhood game? Why to suffer the same old pain? 🙄

Because, what might seem like ‘pain’ to you, for other people slow framerates are just part of the whole authentic nostalgic experience. 😀

I also tend to run these games at high framerates nowadays, but every now and then I do find myself playing something like Return to Castle Wolfenstein on an AMD K6-2 build and I definitely enjoy it… it takes me right back to 2001 (this was the last game I played and finished on the K6-2 500, right before I upgraded to a 1.33 GHz Thunderbird).
Then there’s also the awesome experience (for me, at least) of switching from a very slow to a much more powerful machine, something that I also enjoy a lot (for some weird reason).

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-07-17, 04:47:

It is interesting that some people even after 30-40 years are still looking for the same painful way to play those old games. Now you have the money and old hardware is quite cheap, why not buying the best possible configuration for your childhood game? Why to suffer the same old pain? 🙄

Personally, I like to (nearly) max out my Win9x games as long as that doesn't lead to speed problems or compatibility issues. So I'll happily play them in 1280x1024 at 60+ FPS with 8xAF and maybe some light AA.

There are a few edge cases where games were actually designed to run at 30 FPS though. This affects some console ports such as Star Wars: Shadows of the Empire. But one can use third-party patches (or emulation) to fix that on modern systems.

Well, don't know ... I am not a gamer and never was and I also have zero nostalgia for good old childhood days, so it's difficult for me to understand all those feelings.

For me it is something between having a small home museum of vintage computing and traveling to distant galaxy of old computer devices which are weird on one hand but on the other are easier to understand.

So, I have a variety of different computers from Epson HX-20 to IBM Thinkpad T42 and I have quite a lot of fun just tinkering with them and trying different things, like forcing Thinkpad T42 to boot into pure DOS from USB Flash Drive and to play Soundblaster sound in Prince of Persia via external PCI Soundcard. 😃

ThinkpadIL wrote on 2022-07-17, 06:13:

For me it is something between having a small home museum of vintage computing and traveling to distant galaxy of old computer devices which are weird on one hand but on the other are easier to understand.

I can relate to that, I think. I sometimes feel like a computer archeologist. Like an Indiana Jones of computing. Haha. 😊
Strangely, I not seldomly feel nostalgic for technology and things that predate me.
Despite being an ex 16-Bit era kid.
Like the Atari 2600 era of games, the Braun SK22 type tube radios, b/w tvs,
70s era CB/HAM radios or record players (78RPM support is a must have, of course)!
It's fun sharing time with that stuff, despite it being so simple.

Jo22 wrote on 2022-07-17, 06:26:

Like the Atari 2600 era of games, the Braun SK22 type tube radios, b/w tvs,
70s era CB/HAM radios or record players (78RPM support is a must have, of course)!
It's fun sharing time with that stuff, despite it being so simple.

Yeah, I like those old tube radios ... With all their orange glare tubes when lights are off from the back they look like small fireplaces. And from the front, those with green light tubes look like magical devices. Needless to say that those green light tubes are my favorite ones. 😁

Ah yes, the magic eye! Wonderful piece of technology. Wished it was still installed in modern day radios! 😍