MS-DOS 6.22 most likely predates LBA. In that case it's advised you put MS-DOS 6.22 first and avoid running any LBA-unaware disk utilities there.

On the other hand, I never tried Image for Windows. Does that software back up disk images like dd on Linux? It's possible that you need to inject your Win9x's boot sector to the partition to make it bootable. When installing WinXP with an existing Win9x install (assuming Win9x is C:), setup would automatically do that for you, storing it as C:\BOOTSECT.DOS so you can boot your Win9x instance.

I didn't really try multibooting systems like you with Plop. I don't know if Plop offers options that could swap active partitions for you on-the-fly. There used to be a principle with drive letters, that the partition marked as active automatically becomes C:.

Partition the disk to install DOS, leave the rest of the disk without a partition. (win98 boot disk for fdisk)
Install DOS.
Then add another partition to install WIn98 onto and leave the rest of the disk without a partition.
Install Windows 98
Install XP by booting Win98 and perform an upgrade. That will fail but it will allow you to restart and then install XP into a new partition created with the XP CD.
When it asks you where to install to you chose the disk that doesnt have a partition and it will format and install there.

Use EasyBCD to setup DOS and Windows 98 boot flags to allow their selection in the boot loader.

You can set the disk up at the very start with the required partitions with fdisk, but I did it like that and it worked for me...
I used Win2k not XP but it should be the same.

LSS10999 wrote on 2023-12-29, 06:08:

MS-DOS 6.22 most likely predates LBA. In that case it's advised you put MS-DOS 6.22 first and avoid running any LBA-unaware disk utilities there.

Got it, sounds like it would be better to try to install DOS first. However, if the first partition is for DOS, will 98 automatically install into the next partition? Last time I tried to install DOS then 98, 98 installed into the same 2 GB maximum partition. I don't know of an option to force 98 to install a separate partition. Off the top of my head I believe XP allows me to choose the partition I want so it makes sense for me to install it after 98 to leave 98's BOOTSECT.DOS untouched.

Yes, Image for Windows backs up disk images.

LSS10999 wrote on 2023-12-29, 06:08:

On the other hand, I never tried Image for Windows. Does that software back up disk images like dd on Linux? It's possible that you need to inject your Win9x's boot sector to the partition to make it bootable. When installing WinXP with an existing Win9x install (assuming Win9x is C:), setup would automatically do that for you, storing it as C:\BOOTSECT.DOS so you can boot your Win9x instance.

I didn't really try multibooting systems like you with Plop. I don't know if Plop offers options that could swap active partitions for you on-the-fly. There used to be a principle with drive letters, that the partition marked as active automatically becomes C:.

Yes, Plop allows me to choose partitions on startup, although I don't know off the top of my head if it actually makes the partition active. One cool thing it can do is make USB sticks bootable even though my computer's BIOS does not have that as an option. After a good night's sleep, I am now tempted to simply get 2 GB and 32 GB RAM sticks and install DOS and 98 in them, respectively, and not worry about partitions.

ElectroSoldier wrote on 2023-12-29, 06:15:

Then add another partition to install WIn98 onto and leave the rest of the disk without a partition.
Install Windows 98

So I would use the same FDisk in the 98 floppy (fortunately I made one) to partition the computer before DOS, and then partition it again for the 98 install? Do I need to make each new partition Active as well?

ElectroSoldier wrote on 2023-12-29, 06:15:

Install XP by booting Win98 and perform an upgrade. That will fail but it will allow you to restart and then install XP into a new partition created with the XP CD.

So I should boot 98, insert the CD, attempt to run it, allow it to fail, and it will then boot from CD? Making sure I understand.

ElectroSoldier wrote on 2023-12-29, 06:15:

Use EasyBCD to setup DOS and Windows 98 boot flags to allow their selection in the boot loader.

I wish, but EasyBCD doesn't seem to work in XP and I didn't want to deal with .Net framework installation. I have used it before maybe a decade ago for a different setup.

ElectroSoldier wrote on 2023-12-29, 06:15:

You can set the disk up at the very start with the required partitions with fdisk, but I did it like that and it worked for me...
I used Win2k not XP but it should be the same.

Thank you for your suggestion! Today I have a new motherboard coming for my Windows 11 computer, so I will shift focus. At the same time I need to run MemTest86+ to make sure my RAM sticks and slots are OK in the GX150 anyway. One update I must share is that the partition with 98 apparently deleted itself and is now unallocated. An hour or two before I went to bed last night, the partition showed up fine in XP's Disk Management and now it's not there anymore. Bad disk??? I have never seen that happen before.

Yes when you are installing 98 and you fdisk the drive then the partition you set should be flagged as the active partition.

Happy New Year! This was one of the hardest things I have ever done with computers, but I am happy to report that triple booting is mostly a success. Thank you ElectroSoldier and LSS for your help!

1) Installed MS-DOS in C. It used the maximum 2047 MB size, which was what I wanted anyway.
2) Used Smart FDisk (in Hiren's 5.12) to create a new E: partition for 98. Smart FDisk because it was the most reliable and straightforward tool out of Hiren's collection.
3) Used the Windows 98 startup floppy to change E to Active. It became C after reboot.
4) Installed 98 - it installed directly into the new C partition and did not touch the now-E: DOS partition. Using DOS in the startup floppy to copy the Win98 installer into my C drive saved a LOT of time.
4a) I was able to "dual boot" by using the Windows 98 floppy to set either of both partitions as Active. Each time the 98 partition became active again, it insisted on running ScanDisk. I let it do preliminary checks but eXited it when it started checking drive sectors.
5) Repeated (2) to create F: for XP and also G: for a shared FAT-32. I probably could have done that in (2) itself but I spent a few vacation days on this project and didn't want to take any chances.
6) Booted into 98 and launched the XP installer from the CD. No error message, likely because it had a partition ready for it.
6a) Afterwards boot.ini in the C: (98) partition was automatically updated to give the choice of starting XP or 98 upon boot.
7) Installed Plop using a floppy. Removed the floppy and rebooted to launch the Plop boot manager interface that shows up before the dual boot in (6a).

The hardest part was all the trial and errors. I also had trials and errors with backing up partitions for quicker reinstall after mistakes. Macrium Reflect in Hiren proved to be rock-solid for me using an USB stick (which my Optiplex GX150 could not boot, but Hiren's interface was able to access and read/write). It also did not complain about my 32 GB partition size being smaller or bigger than my 32 GB USB stick like the other disk image backup software I tried. I made sure to back up each partition after each install and immediately made a copy of each image file just in case of corruption.

I know some people here didn't see the need to triple boot with DOS but I enjoyed this project too much to give up on the idea. I gained a lot of newfound knowledge and appreciation for older computers and operating systems.

Now for a new issue - hope the Plop experts here know an easy fix before I ask Elmar in Plop's forums:
a) Plop is able to easily boot into MS-DOS (set as hda1 with boot flag) and Don't Touch for everything else.
b) Plop is able to boot into the hda2 partition (Windows 98). However I then get that Windows dual boot (98/XP) prompt like a normal dual boot startup. I am not able to boot directly into 98 without the Windows boot prompt.
c) I tried setting a XP profile in Plop for hda3 (hda4 is for the shared partition). hda3 was marked with the boot flag and Don't Touch for everything else. I keep getting a black screen with "Remove disks or other media. Press any key to restart" Having no media and pressing any key causes it to return to the Plop startup.

So for now I have two Plop profiles: one for MS-DOS and another for Windows 98/XP. So if I want XP I choose 98/XP, and then at the Windows boot menu choose SP. Is there an easy way to get Plop to link directly 98 and XP separately without the Windows boot loader? I attempted to edit the boot.ini file to have only one Windows and it did disable the Windows menu. I am still not able to boot into XP. I am guessing it is due to XP's Master Boot Record. Does anyone know what to do?

Side note - this was my first XP installation in several years and now online activation no longer works. Grr. Hopefully the phone call to Microsoft to send me the activation code will go smoothly.

Update - a saint made a small .exe file that takes care of online activation... offline. For those who also need it:
https://old.reddit.com/r/windowsxp/comments/w … y_dead/ilmr5s3/

I use PLOP on my IBM Thinkpad T42 laptop for triple booting with DOS, Windows 98SE and Windows XP. The way to do it "correctly" is to create the 3 partitions beforehand (for example: 1*FAT16, 1*FAT32, 1*NTFS). Dos should be the first created partition, then Windows 98SE and lastly Windows XP. Then configure PLOP to make the 3 entries for each OS. For each OS make sure to hide the partitions for the other OS's. If you install Windows XP for example then it won't see the other OS's and won't create a dual boot menu as it doesn't know that they exists as they are hidden by PLOP (or more technically it sets a partition flag).

If you want you can make a fourth partition beforehand if you like to share files across the OS's. In that case use FAT16 for that and make sure that it's the second created partition after the DOS one. Didn't do that because I use Samba or FTP to share files. Obviously it should not be hidden in PLOP then.

Yoghoo wrote on 2024-01-01, 18:20:

I use PLOP on my IBM Thinkpad T42 laptop for triple booting with DOS, Windows 98SE and Windows XP. The way to do it "correctly" is to create the 3 partitions beforehand (for example: 1*FAT16, 1*FAT32, 1*NTFS). Dos should be the first created partition, then Windows 98SE and lastly Windows XP. Then configure PLOP to make the 3 entries for each OS. For each OS make sure to hide the partitions for the other OS's. If you install Windows XP for example then it won't see the other OS's and won't create a dual boot menu as it doesn't know that they exists as they are hidden by PLOP (or more technically it sets a partition flag).

If you want you can make a fourth partition beforehand if you like to share files across the OS's. In that case use FAT16 for that and make sure that it's the second created partition after the DOS one. Didn't do that because I use Samba or FTP to share files. Obviously it should not be hidden in PLOP then.

Thank you! So I would need to create 4 partitions beforehand and each time I install an OS, make sure all the other partitions are hidden? How do you usually do that? I'm assuming that is what you meant as to my understanding Plop should be installed after all the OSes have been installed. I have to admit I kind of like the double boot prompts (Plop and 98/XP) but more knowledge can only aid me for the future.

True, I did consider making a FAT-16 shared drive. Good tip to make sure it is immediately after the DOS partition. I only plan to use DOS for certain hard-to-run games and applications, so I leaned towards maximum compatibility between 98 and XP and made that partition FAT-32. I can always use XP to import and export files to the DOS partition with minimum need for the command line.

bf_bullpup wrote on 2024-01-01, 18:33:

Yoghoo wrote on 2024-01-01, 18:20:

I use PLOP on my IBM Thinkpad T42 laptop for triple booting with DOS, Windows 98SE and Windows XP. The way to do it "correctly" is to create the 3 partitions beforehand (for example: 1*FAT16, 1*FAT32, 1*NTFS). Dos should be the first created partition, then Windows 98SE and lastly Windows XP. Then configure PLOP to make the 3 entries for each OS. For each OS make sure to hide the partitions for the other OS's. If you install Windows XP for example then it won't see the other OS's and won't create a dual boot menu as it doesn't know that they exists as they are hidden by PLOP (or more technically it sets a partition flag).

If you want you can make a fourth partition beforehand if you like to share files across the OS's. In that case use FAT16 for that and make sure that it's the second created partition after the DOS one. Didn't do that because I use Samba or FTP to share files. Obviously it should not be hidden in PLOP then.

Thank you! So I would need to create 4 partitions beforehand and each time I install an OS, make sure all the other partitions are hidden? How do you usually do that? I'm assuming that is what you meant as to my understanding Plop should be installed after all the OSes have been installed. I have to admit I kind of like the double boot prompts (Plop and 98/XP) but more knowledge can only aid me for the future.

True, I did consider making a FAT-16 shared drive. Good tip to make sure it is immediately after the DOS partition. I only plan to use DOS for certain hard-to-run games and applications, so I leaned towards maximum compatibility between 98 and XP and made that partition FAT-32. I can always use XP to import and export files to the DOS partition with minimum need for the command line.

PLOP will take care of hiding the partitions if setup correctly in PLOP. So create partitions, install the PLOP boot manager and then configure PLOP to hide partitions etc. Don't know the exact steps to configure PLOP btw. Especially hiding partitions etc took some trail and error.

Windows XP will overwrite the PLOP bootsector btw. So you need to reinstall the PLOP bootmanager again after installing Windows XP.

Yoghoo wrote on 2024-01-01, 18:53:

PLOP will take care of hiding the partitions if setup correctly in PLOP. So create partitions, install the PLOP boot manager and then configure PLOP to hide partitions etc. Don't know the exact steps to configure PLOP btw. Especially hiding partitions etc took some trail and error.

Windows XP will overwrite the PLOP bootsector btw. So you need to reinstall the PLOP bootmanager again after installing Windows XP.

Got it. I played with Plop settings earlier today. If a partition is set as "Cleared" then it is pretty much hidden. Don't Touch basically means that Plop will let the OS handle that partition.

Can you install Plop (I do so via floppy) if no OS has been installed yet? Or should one install DOS and/or 98 before installing XP?

bf_bullpup wrote on 2024-01-01, 18:58:

Can you install Plop (I do so via floppy) if no OS has been installed yet? Or should one install DOS and/or 98 before installing XP?

Yes you can (and should if you want the OS's not to "know" about the other OS's installed on the system).

Yoghoo wrote on 2024-01-01, 19:06:

Yes you can (and should if you want the OS's not to "know" about the other OS's installed on the system).

Now the #3 example tutorial finally makes sense.
https://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager/examples.html

Now I will know for next time. Since my final issue with Plop is to have it boot XP independently, if I ever go this route I can create all four partitions and simply use Macrium to restore DOS and 98. I can then hide their partitions with Plop and install XP from the CD. Many thanks.

My only other wish is to be able to see that cool starry field when Plop launches. I only get that grid with text. I can't change the resolution, either. I assume it is a video limitation of my very old motherboard. At least I still have XP's starfield screen saver 🤣.

Thank you Yoghoo for the contribution to this thread. Earlier today Windows 98's registry was screwed up, so I replaced it with its brand-new-installation backup image so I c an start over fresh. Unfortunately it meant the Boot.ini file with the XP information (for that 2nd boot menu, the one right after Plop) was gone. So there was no way for the XP installation to boot - not even setting it to Active using the 98 startup disk worked.

I realized I had badly painted myself into a corner, so I deleted the XP partition. Re-installed Plop. Hid the other three partitions and the XP installation CD was able to recognize my XP partition and everything else were unrecognized partitions. Re-installed.

What happened next was that Windows was installed... in the (1) partition rather than the (3) partition. For those of you who know how Boot.ini works, (1) is the first partition, (2) second, and so on. The DOS and 98 partitions were combined into one unrecognized partition, so the XP installer recognized the XP partition as (1). So when I tried using Plop for the XP partition, I got a Hal.dll is missing error. I found a tutorial to boot into the installation CD and run the bootcfg /rebuild command. It produced a Windows dual boot option for XP (Recovered), which was put in (3) correctly. Alternatively, if I had known, I could have just booted 98 and entered the XP partition to fix XP's Boot.ini entry. I'm glad it was an error that made sense in the end.

So now I have Plop triple booting MS-DOS, 98, and XP - and without that Windows boot menu for 98 and XP. Many thanks to this community for all your insights as I couldn't have done it without you!

Just use BootIt Bare Metal and you'll never look back.

um, could you possibly use that plop floppy to boot dos 6.22 off a 2gb usb thumb drive? you could swap it between any of your systems and never have to triple boot anything ever again. i know it's possible to boot a dos 1.4/2.8mb floppy image on usb via syslinux so why not something bigger? might be interesting to look into.

a_h_adl wrote on 2024-01-08, 04:29:

Just use BootIt Bare Metal and you'll never look back.

Looks nice. But it costs $40 for max 5 machines. PLOP is free and can do almost the same.

stanwebber wrote on 2024-01-08, 09:39:

um, could you possibly use that plop floppy to boot dos 6.22 off a 2gb usb thumb drive? you could swap it between any of your systems and never have to triple boot anything ever again. i know it's possible to boot a dos 1.4/2.8mb floppy image on usb via syslinux so why not something bigger? might be interesting to look into.

One major caveat: when MS-DOS is booted off an USB drive via Plop, its drive becomes read-only. This is a known "feature" in Plop 5.0.15. See the first FAQ:

https://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager/faq.html

I am very happy with MS-DOS in the first partition with full write ability.