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ISA or PCI sound card?

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Reply 40 of 48, by DataPro

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I downloaded some Win9x AWE64 drivers and after installation, SB16SND.DRV crashes the multimedia control panel... I had also a SYSTRAY.EXE crash at windows start.

I delete SB16SND.DRV in windows directory, I reinstalled Win98SE (it repaired files). As AWE64 wasn't working I deleted the card in Windows Device Manager.
After a new boot, Windows reinstalled AWE64; I just say "no" when it asked for keeping newer drivers and AWE64 is now working without crashing something anymore.

So I got AWE64 and SB128PCI working under Win98SE and SB128PCI working under DOS (tested with DOOM 1).

HP Vectra 562 P166Mhz/256Ko L2 cache/Triton 430FX - 112Mo RAM - 2x 32Go+64Go CF Card - Matrox G2 8Mo - SB AWE64 ISA (PnP) + Roland MT-32 & M-GS64 (SC-88) & JV-1010 - Nec USB 2.0 PCI - Promise Ultra100 TX2 - Hama multicard reader

Reply 41 of 48, by DataPro

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My HP Vectra 500 (Pentium 166Mhz with 112Mb RAM) works well with Win98SE.
I manage to put a SoundBlaster PCI128 and an AWE64 ISA PnP (CT 4500). They both work under Win98SE. I can use SBPCI Midi, AWE64 Midi and both MIDI external with Roland MT-32.
The SB PCI128 use Win98SE Drivers and AWE64 PNP uses default Win98SE drivers (included in the OS) because other drivers crash.

The SB128 works under DOS7.1
Making AWE64 working with DOS was more difficult.
I use AWE64 DOS drivers but I didn't use Install.exe because it also installs Win3.1 drivers in Win98SE system folder, causing serious problems.
I manually put all DOS drivers in C:\DOS\AWE64 folder.
With CTCM.EXE and AWEUTIL I manage to make the ISA card working.
But it was difficult because CTCM always uses IRQ10 and it's not an IRQ that you can choose in Sound Setup of many DOS games.
After reading a lot I figured that I have to check the BIOS. My BIOS offers some feature for PnP OS. In fact you have to disable [Win95 OS] Yes/No or [PnP OS] Yes/No options. It frees some adresses and IRQ.

On next boot my card was set in A220 I5 D1 H5 P330 E620 T6
My AWE64Value PnP is now fully working with Doom and Dune 2 with music on Roland MT-32

I hope my experience should help.

HP Vectra 562 P166Mhz/256Ko L2 cache/Triton 430FX - 112Mo RAM - 2x 32Go+64Go CF Card - Matrox G2 8Mo - SB AWE64 ISA (PnP) + Roland MT-32 & M-GS64 (SC-88) & JV-1010 - Nec USB 2.0 PCI - Promise Ultra100 TX2 - Hama multicard reader

Reply 42 of 48, by DataPro

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Sometime, after playing a DOS Game, I loose sound.

I mean AWE64 is working but there is no sound coming out as if volume was set to zero.

Launching MIXERSET don't help.

Even after a DOS reboot or PC shutdown, sound don't recover.
I have to launch Win98SE to recover sound...for next DOS reboot; I may be an issue with SB128PCI line in...

HP Vectra 562 P166Mhz/256Ko L2 cache/Triton 430FX - 112Mo RAM - 2x 32Go+64Go CF Card - Matrox G2 8Mo - SB AWE64 ISA (PnP) + Roland MT-32 & M-GS64 (SC-88) & JV-1010 - Nec USB 2.0 PCI - Promise Ultra100 TX2 - Hama multicard reader

Reply 43 of 48, by King_Corduroy

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ISA, I don't care whether you are using DOS or Windows 9x you should be using an ISA card. 🤣

Check me out at Transcendental Airwaves on Youtube! Fast-food sucks!

Reply 45 of 48, by guest_2

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Very old post I know, but why even bother with a PCI soundcard in Windows 9X if you don't care about '3d audio' (which I don't)
I had a Soundblaster Live! (CT4760) installed which was fine for Windows gaming but DOS and anything in Windows which required Soundblaster 16 emulation was terrible - sounded terrible and ran terrible.
I have a Soundblaster 16 ISA card now (CT2230) and decided to remove the SB Live! for the installation part. My plan was to re-install it for Windows 9X gaming

So far the CT2230 plays DOS and Windows games perfectly upto and including later Windows games like Unreal Tournament... why even bother with the SB Live! PCI card?

Reply 46 of 48, by Joseph_Joestar

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guest_2 wrote on 2021-03-18, 08:57:

So far the CT2230 plays DOS and Windows games perfectly upto and including later Windows games like Unreal Tournament... why even bother with the SB Live! PCI card?

Here are a couple of reasons, excluding 3D sound support:

  • PCI sound cards generally have less self-noise than their ISA counterparts and don't pick up bus interference as easily
  • Some ISA sound cards have poor DirectSound (not 3D) support. This can result in crackling and popping when playing Win9x games. Creative's cards tend to be less prone to this than those of other manufacturers
  • Loading soundfonts. Sure, you can do this on an ISA card as well, but you are limited by the amount of the card's on-board memory. SBLive and Audigy cards use system RAM instead, meaning that you can load higher quality soundfonts which are 100+ MB in size
  • Digital Out (SPDIF) is uncommon on ISA cards, while many PCI cards have it. This doesn't matter much for regular gaming, but it makes recording clean, noise-free audio a lot easier. That can be important for someone who makes YouTube videos for example

Of course, it's always an option to use both a PCI and an ISA sound card in the same system. That way, you have great DOS compatibility and excellent performance in Win9x games as well.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / YMF719 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 2100+ / ECS K7VTA3 / Voodoo3 / Audigy2 / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3400+ / Asus K8V-MX / 5900XT / Audigy2
PC#4: i5-3570K / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 970 / X-Fi

Reply 47 of 48, by guest_2

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Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2021-03-18, 09:21:
Here are a couple of reasons, excluding 3D sound support: […]
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guest_2 wrote on 2021-03-18, 08:57:

So far the CT2230 plays DOS and Windows games perfectly upto and including later Windows games like Unreal Tournament... why even bother with the SB Live! PCI card?

Here are a couple of reasons, excluding 3D sound support:

  • PCI sound cards generally have less self-noise than their ISA counterparts and don't pick up bus interference as easily
  • Some ISA sound cards have poor DirectSound (not 3D) support. This can result in crackling and popping when playing Win9x games. Creative's cards tend to be less prone to this than those of other manufacturers
  • Loading soundfonts. Sure, you can do this on an ISA card as well, but you are limited by the amount of the card's on-board memory. SBLive and Audigy cards use system RAM instead, meaning that you can load higher quality soundfonts which are 100+ MB in size
  • Digital Out (SPDIF) is uncommon on ISA cards, while many PCI cards have it. This doesn't matter much for regular gaming, but it makes recording clean, noise-free audio a lot easier. That can be important for someone who makes YouTube videos for example

Of course, it's always an option to use both a PCI and an ISA sound card in the same system. That way, you have great DOS compatibility and excellent performance in Win9x games as well.

Thanks. I've considered using the SB Live! with WDM drivers, if only for CD audio using Daemon tools. I anticipate a lot of conflicts and headaches if using two soundcards though. Also, wouldnt you need to run wires from one to another to output CD audio from the Live and MF/Midi from the SB 16?

Reply 48 of 48, by Joseph_Joestar

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guest_2 wrote on 2021-03-28, 14:19:

Thanks. I've considered using the SB Live! with WDM drivers, if only for CD audio using Daemon tools.

WDM SBLive drivers are suboptimal under Win98. Using them may cause issues with EAX support in certain games. Additionally, their DOS compatibility is limited to SBPro and they lack FM synth emulation.

I anticipate a lot of conflicts and headaches if using two soundcards though. Also, wouldnt you need to run wires from one to another to output CD audio from the Live and MF/Midi from the SB 16?

Compatibility isn't a problem as long as both cards use different resources. Setting that up can be a challenge though.

As for the CD audio, you only need to connect it to one card. If you want to use both cards at the same time, you need a line-out to line-in cable (3.5mm jacks on both ends) to connect them to each other.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / YMF719 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 2100+ / ECS K7VTA3 / Voodoo3 / Audigy2 / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3400+ / Asus K8V-MX / 5900XT / Audigy2
PC#4: i5-3570K / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 970 / X-Fi