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Reply 63 of 112, by appiah4

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mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-06, 19:32:

The ways that cyrpto is different from fiat currency is what makes it valuable. Central banks and governments actively manipulate the value of currencies all the time by holding or releasing reserves of it. That is no secret, it is a matter of public policy that is debated on - out in the open - all the time.

Musk can manipulate the value of a coin by magnitudes by getting people into investing in a joke coin and you are cynical of governments manipulating the value of their currency by a few percentage points? OK, there are some merits to cryptocurrencies but they are more fiat than so called fiat currencies and your argument is completely invalid, and excuse me for saying this, but dumb.

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Reply 64 of 112, by The Serpent Rider

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Meanwhile Chia is on the rise! Looks like we can't escape at least some some shortages of high capacity SSDs.

Get up, come on get down with the sickness
Open up your hate, and let it flow into me

Reply 65 of 112, by mothergoose729

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appiah4 wrote on 2021-05-07, 18:18:
mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-06, 19:32:

The ways that cyrpto is different from fiat currency is what makes it valuable. Central banks and governments actively manipulate the value of currencies all the time by holding or releasing reserves of it. That is no secret, it is a matter of public policy that is debated on - out in the open - all the time.

Musk can manipulate the value of a coin by magnitudes by getting people into investing in a joke coin and you are cynical of governments manipulating the value of their currency by a few percentage points? OK, there are some merits to cryptocurrencies but they are more fiat than so called fiat currencies and your argument is completely invalid, and excuse me for saying this, but dumb.

I didn't make an argument or state an opinion... well beyond saying that the "differences between crypto and fiat currencies is what makes it valuable", which it sounds like you agree with.

I also wasn't trying to correct you, my comment was more in the spirit of "yes, and also this". If you want to elaborate we can discuss it further, but I don't know what about my post you don't like or disagree with.

Reply 67 of 112, by Shreddoc

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mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-07, 19:56:
appiah4 wrote on 2021-05-07, 18:18:
mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-06, 19:32:

The ways that cyrpto is different from fiat currency is what makes it valuable. Central banks and governments actively manipulate the value of currencies all the time by holding or releasing reserves of it. That is no secret, it is a matter of public policy that is debated on - out in the open - all the time.

Musk can manipulate the value of a coin by magnitudes by getting people into investing in a joke coin and you are cynical of governments manipulating the value of their currency by a few percentage points? OK, there are some merits to cryptocurrencies but they are more fiat than so called fiat currencies and your argument is completely invalid, and excuse me for saying this, but dumb.

I didn't make an argument or state an opinion... well beyond saying that the "differences between crypto and fiat currencies is what makes it valuable", which it sounds like you agree with.

I also wasn't trying to correct you, my comment was more in the spirit of "yes, and also this". If you want to elaborate we can discuss it further, but I don't know what about my post you don't like or disagree with.

I believe he's saying that the types of greed-based manipulation of prices and markets which occur in traditional finance are also rife in crypto, to the point where there is now little ethical difference between "Rupert Murdoch pushing his own agenda in his newspaper" and "Elon Musk shilling DOGE on Twitter". Little ethical difference between "sub-prime mortgage funds destroying public finances" and "massive, manipulated liquidation runs on crypto routinely cause billions of damage to small investors while exchanges and hedge funds get rich".

There is no difference between Murdoch owning his newspaper+ empire, or the banks controlling dollars, and Barry Silbert who runs the world's largest crypto hedge-fund Grayscale, and ALSO (omg what a coincidence right!) runs the world's largest crypto media supersite Coindesk. In fact if anything, the sheer, blatant, greedy control over self-interests is even more obvious in crypto, as evidenced by the setups of crypto's biggest controllers such as Silbert. No comic book needed! - his Rupert Murdoch v2.0 setup is plain for all to see.

It's all much the same shit, dude - simply wrapped up in a shiny new package. There is some technical merit in blockchain itself, but the crypto markets as they currently stand, are one of the worst financial cesspools ever.

Ask yourself how many low-class, poor people you know, who own Bitcoin : reality is, that's a proportion only ever decreasing over time -a majority of the world's population are now, quite literally (even 1x exchange withdrawal fee is their week's wage!), permanently priced out of the Bitcoin market.

Technically, it's a cool space. Financially, it's every bit (if not more) as cynically manipulated and greed-driven as anything which exists in this world.

Reply 71 of 112, by mothergoose729

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Shreddoc wrote on 2021-05-07, 23:04:
I believe he's saying that the types of greed-based manipulation of prices and markets which occur in traditional finance are al […]
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mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-07, 19:56:
appiah4 wrote on 2021-05-07, 18:18:

Musk can manipulate the value of a coin by magnitudes by getting people into investing in a joke coin and you are cynical of governments manipulating the value of their currency by a few percentage points? OK, there are some merits to cryptocurrencies but they are more fiat than so called fiat currencies and your argument is completely invalid, and excuse me for saying this, but dumb.

I didn't make an argument or state an opinion... well beyond saying that the "differences between crypto and fiat currencies is what makes it valuable", which it sounds like you agree with.

I also wasn't trying to correct you, my comment was more in the spirit of "yes, and also this". If you want to elaborate we can discuss it further, but I don't know what about my post you don't like or disagree with.

I believe he's saying that the types of greed-based manipulation of prices and markets which occur in traditional finance are also rife in crypto, to the point where there is now little ethical difference between "Rupert Murdoch pushing his own agenda in his newspaper" and "Elon Musk shilling DOGE on Twitter". Little ethical difference between "sub-prime mortgage funds destroying public finances" and "massive, manipulated liquidation runs on crypto routinely cause billions of damage to small investors while exchanges and hedge funds get rich".

There is no difference between Murdoch owning his newspaper+ empire, or the banks controlling dollars, and Barry Silbert who runs the world's largest crypto hedge-fund Grayscale, and ALSO (omg what a coincidence right!) runs the world's largest crypto media supersite Coindesk. In fact if anything, the sheer, blatant, greedy control over self-interests is even more obvious in crypto, as evidenced by the setups of crypto's biggest controllers such as Silbert. No comic book needed! - his Rupert Murdoch v2.0 setup is plain for all to see.

It's all much the same shit, dude - simply wrapped up in a shiny new package. There is some technical merit in blockchain itself, but the crypto markets as they currently stand, are one of the worst financial cesspools ever.

Ask yourself how many low-class, poor people you know, who own Bitcoin : reality is, that's a proportion only ever decreasing over time -a majority of the world's population are now, quite literally (even 1x exchange withdrawal fee is their week's wage!), permanently priced out of the Bitcoin market.

Technically, it's a cool space. Financially, it's every bit (if not more) as cynically manipulated and greed-driven as anything which exists in this world.

I don't have much to add on those topics. Hedge funds are not something I understand or find very interesting. My take is a bit more cynical even then yours. Investors like to think that they are smart and make rational decisions in the market but they don't. Gamestonks and dodge coins are great examples of how people get caught up in the hype and make poor investment decisions without requiring anyone to actively deceive them.

Certainly there is room to mix bitcoin into other investment portfolios, hide money and move it around so everyone is confused, and skim off the top. Or whatever they do. Again, I don't really have an opinion. The theory and the technology is more interesting to me, even if the potential is squandered somewhat because people lie or make poor decisions.

Reply 72 of 112, by Shreddoc

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mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-08, 19:28:
Shreddoc wrote on 2021-05-07, 23:04:
I believe he's saying that the types of greed-based manipulation of prices and markets which occur in traditional finance are al […]
Show full quote
mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-07, 19:56:

I didn't make an argument or state an opinion... well beyond saying that the "differences between crypto and fiat currencies is what makes it valuable", which it sounds like you agree with.

I also wasn't trying to correct you, my comment was more in the spirit of "yes, and also this". If you want to elaborate we can discuss it further, but I don't know what about my post you don't like or disagree with.

I believe he's saying that the types of greed-based manipulation of prices and markets which occur in traditional finance are also rife in crypto, to the point where there is now little ethical difference between "Rupert Murdoch pushing his own agenda in his newspaper" and "Elon Musk shilling DOGE on Twitter". Little ethical difference between "sub-prime mortgage funds destroying public finances" and "massive, manipulated liquidation runs on crypto routinely cause billions of damage to small investors while exchanges and hedge funds get rich".

There is no difference between Murdoch owning his newspaper+ empire, or the banks controlling dollars, and Barry Silbert who runs the world's largest crypto hedge-fund Grayscale, and ALSO (omg what a coincidence right!) runs the world's largest crypto media supersite Coindesk. In fact if anything, the sheer, blatant, greedy control over self-interests is even more obvious in crypto, as evidenced by the setups of crypto's biggest controllers such as Silbert. No comic book needed! - his Rupert Murdoch v2.0 setup is plain for all to see.

It's all much the same shit, dude - simply wrapped up in a shiny new package. There is some technical merit in blockchain itself, but the crypto markets as they currently stand, are one of the worst financial cesspools ever.

Ask yourself how many low-class, poor people you know, who own Bitcoin : reality is, that's a proportion only ever decreasing over time -a majority of the world's population are now, quite literally (even 1x exchange withdrawal fee is their week's wage!), permanently priced out of the Bitcoin market.

Technically, it's a cool space. Financially, it's every bit (if not more) as cynically manipulated and greed-driven as anything which exists in this world.

I don't have much to add on those topics. Hedge funds are not something I understand or find very interesting. My take is a bit more cynical even then yours. Investors like to think that they are smart and make rational decisions in the market but they don't. Gamestonks and dodge coins are great examples of how people get caught up in the hype and make poor investment decisions without requiring anyone to actively deceive them.

Oh absolutely. Public retail investors are grist for the mill, the way it is everywhere. Things are just that much more exaggerated in the crypto space - a function of the space's "freedom".

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mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-08, 19:28:

Certainly there is room to mix bitcoin into other investment portfolios, hide money and move it around so everyone is confused, and skim off the top. Or whatever they do. Again, I don't really have an opinion. The theory and the technology is more interesting to me, even if the potential is squandered somewhat because people lie or make poor decisions.

I totally agree in the sense that, as tech enthusiasts our interest is technical, and the money is almost a distraction. A very strong distraction, for many - this mixture of developing technology and ever-more-serious money is understandably novel and exciting.

The investment side is starting to emerge as a not-uncommon sentiment, now that the boom-and-bust cycle has become so obvious by way of repetition over 10 years. I suspect the cycle pattern may alter as a result, but that's it's own rabbit hole.

Overall I think if a person is able to keep the tech side separate from the business side - in terms of their own dealings - then that is probably a good thing. The fact that the two don't necessarily move in tandem is a source of trouble for many.

Reply 73 of 112, by The Serpent Rider

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So it seems Amazon and Newegg HDD stocks are already getting scavenged by miners.

Get up, come on get down with the sickness
Open up your hate, and let it flow into me

Reply 76 of 112, by matze79

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Now HDDs and SSDs soon unaffordable

https://dosreloaded.de - The German Retro DOS PC Community
https://www.retroianer.de - under constructing since ever

Co2 - for a endless Summer

Reply 77 of 112, by schmatzler

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robertmo wrote on 2021-05-07, 05:23:

You can buy 50 Tesla cars with 150 bitcoins.

Not anymore, it seems like:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021- … ting-energy-use

Sometimes I think the success of certain cryptocurrencies solely depends on the endorsement of one crazy billionaire.

Reply 78 of 112, by mothergoose729

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schmatzler wrote on 2021-05-13, 19:45:
Not anymore, it seems like: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021- … ting-energy-use […]
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robertmo wrote on 2021-05-07, 05:23:

You can buy 50 Tesla cars with 150 bitcoins.

Not anymore, it seems like:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021- … ting-energy-use

Sometimes I think the success of certain cryptocurrencies solely depends on the endorsement of one crazy billionaire.

Crypto isn't entirely unique that way either. One of the reasons I don't like to gamble in the financial markets is because of how volatile and illogical it is. There are so many examples of people who should know better acting completely counter logical. Everyone thinks that they are smart and that they have the sauce but at the end of the day we are all just posturing apes. How people "feel" motivates their decisions in everything.

Reply 79 of 112, by Shreddoc

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mothergoose729 wrote on 2021-05-13, 21:55:
schmatzler wrote on 2021-05-13, 19:45:
Not anymore, it seems like: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021- … ting-energy-use […]
Show full quote
robertmo wrote on 2021-05-07, 05:23:

You can buy 50 Tesla cars with 150 bitcoins.

Not anymore, it seems like:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021- … ting-energy-use

Sometimes I think the success of certain cryptocurrencies solely depends on the endorsement of one crazy billionaire.

Crypto isn't entirely unique that way either. One of the reasons I don't like to gamble in the financial markets is because of how volatile and illogical it is. There are so many examples of people who should know better acting completely counter logical. Everyone thinks that they are smart and that they have the sauce but at the end of the day we are all just posturing apes. How people "feel" motivates their decisions in everything.

For many, having money in the game changes the brain chemistry (+ thus the decision-making) markedly. It's a reality rarely discussed and a lesson hard learned, in this kind of space. Some people here will be in the midst of it right now, without even realising yet.