VOGONS


First post, by enaiel

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For a future build, I was thinking of doing a retro Windows gaming PC that runs games from 1997 to 2007, but I hate Windows '98 with a passion. The frequent BSODs are what drove me to Linux all those years back, and the first Windows to not annoy me as much was Windows 2000. I ran it for several years before reluctantly upgrading to XP. I regretted my move to XP as SP3 for some reason broke compatibility with several hardware and games that I owned that worked fine before. Anyway, I was wondering if there was a list of Win95/98 games that were incompatible with Win2K? The closest I could find was this on Ars Technica by @DosFreak: Windows 2000 Game Compatibility List-7 months later. Is there an updated list somewhere on Vogons?

DOS PC: Socket 370 / VIA C3 1.0 GHz / Voodoo2 + Trident Blade3D / SBPro + YMF744 + AWE64 + SC-7
Best DOS Games: CGW 150, PC Gamer 50, Worthwhile 100

Reply 1 of 17, by gerry

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I couldn't find anything with a quick search, though in addition to that list you found there are other dotted around the web after a search

one thing I've noticed is that a lot of games that work on XP will work on 2000 anyway if you try, even if not officially supported, its just the installer sometimes complains

XP generally does an ok job with 'run as windows 98' settings and I've not encountered hardware compatibility problems between XP and 2000 - but that's more likely because i haven't got the hardware that causes the issue

1997 to 2007 is quite a stretch in any case - it's from quake 2 to crysis - but there's no reason not to try

Reply 2 of 17, by DosFreak

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Haven't updated it in years but alot newer than that thread:
PC Game Compatibility List

Also don't forget about ntcompatible althought it's pretty fugly nowadays.

DOSBox Compilation Guides
DosBox Feature Request Thread
PC Game Compatibility List
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
Running DRM games offline

Reply 3 of 17, by chinny22

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I don't hate 98 but its no longer my OS of choice.

Depending on your hardware why not dual boot 98/2k?
I do majority of my 9x gaming in 2k and drop back to 98 for dos game compatibility and the few windows games that don't like 2k (which do work according to DosFreak's list!?)

Reply 4 of 17, by enaiel

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gerry wrote on 2021-05-20, 13:50:

1997 to 2007 is quite a stretch in any case - it's from quake 2 to crysis - but there's no reason not to try

I have a C2D E6750, 7950GT and X-Fi XtremeGamer that should be great for 2001 - 2007, including Crysis. I was hoping I could throw in a Voodoo 3 PCI for games from 1997- 2000. Do you see any potential problems with this?

DosFreak wrote on 2021-05-20, 14:54:

Haven't updated it in years but alot newer than that thread:
PC Game Compatibility List

Also don't forget about ntcompatible althought it's pretty fugly nowadays.

Holy crap! How long did it take you to create that spreadsheet? This is an awesome resource, thanks! I couldn't find a way to filter all games by Win2K on ntcompatible.

chinny22 wrote on 2021-05-20, 17:01:

Depending on your hardware why not dual boot 98/2k?
I do majority of my 9x gaming in 2k and drop back to 98 for dos game compatibility and the few windows games that don't like 2k (which do work according to DosFreak's list!?)

I don't want to dual boot 98 because I don't want to go through the bother of finding a 98 compatible motherboard. I can get a cheap LGA775 motherboard with PCI-e x16 and a couple of PCI slots that still has Win2K drivers, and I'm good to go. That's the theory, at least.

The other option is to stay on XP SP2, since this is all XP era hardware anyway. But Win2K feels a lot more retro 😀

Last edited by enaiel on 2021-05-20, 17:42. Edited 1 time in total.

DOS PC: Socket 370 / VIA C3 1.0 GHz / Voodoo2 + Trident Blade3D / SBPro + YMF744 + AWE64 + SC-7
Best DOS Games: CGW 150, PC Gamer 50, Worthwhile 100

Reply 5 of 17, by appiah4

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There are very few games that won't run properly on Windows 2000. If you don't need DOS, or you are OK with dual booting DOS (what I do in my Dual Celeron build) then Windows 2000 is a great OS.

Retronautics: A digital gallery of my retro computers, hardware and projects.

Reply 6 of 17, by DosFreak

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enaiel wrote on 2021-05-20, 17:27:
DosFreak wrote on 2021-05-20, 14:54:

Haven't updated it in years but alot newer than that thread:
PC Game Compatibility List

Also don't forget about ntcompatible althought it's pretty fugly nowadays.

Holy crap! How long did it take you to create that spreadsheet? This is an awesome resource, thanks! I couldn't find a way to filter all games by Win2K on ntcompatible.

Started with Beta 3 of Windows 2000 so 1999? Stopped updating around the release of Windows 10 so 2015?
I've done alot of work outside of the spreadsheet compatibility wise but haven't gone back and updated the spreadsheet.
Also the million windows 10 builds threw me for a loop as far tracking compatibility....

Think as far as vogons is concerned backporting fixes and tracking latest ports and emulators for pre-Windows 10 would be most useful which I can do quite easily.
Should probably put DRM bypass instructions in there for online stores.
Windows 10 testing mabye LTSB or mabye a build every 5yrs or so.

DOSBox Compilation Guides
DosBox Feature Request Thread
PC Game Compatibility List
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
Running DRM games offline

Reply 7 of 17, by Jorpho

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Things have changed so much over the years that I've lost track of everything. Even oldies like Maui Mallard can be made to cooperate now.

You can start with Win9x games that don't work on XP , perhaps.

In the end, it is probably best to consider what games you actually want to play on this computer that won't play just as well (if not much, much better) on a more up-to-date computer. (If you really can't think of any, then it is quite likely that this "future build" you're thinking of is just going to collect dust.)

Reply 8 of 17, by enaiel

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Good idea, here are the games that I haven't been able to play properly since I had upgraded from Win2K:

* Thief Gold
* Splinter Cell
* NFS: Porsche Unleashed
* F1 2001
* FIFA 2002

Would throwing Win2K on a C2D PC let me play them better? Or are they incompatible with modern hardware and I need something that's more period correct? In which case, should I just dual boot my existing DOS VIA C3 with Voodoo 2 into Win2K for just the Windows games that don't work properly on modern systems? Questions, questions...

DOS PC: Socket 370 / VIA C3 1.0 GHz / Voodoo2 + Trident Blade3D / SBPro + YMF744 + AWE64 + SC-7
Best DOS Games: CGW 150, PC Gamer 50, Worthwhile 100

Reply 9 of 17, by gerry

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enaiel wrote on 2021-05-20, 17:27:
gerry wrote on 2021-05-20, 13:50:

1997 to 2007 is quite a stretch in any case - it's from quake 2 to crysis - but there's no reason not to try

I have a C2D E6750, 7950GT and X-Fi XtremeGamer that should be great for 2001 - 2007, including Crysis. I was hoping I could throw in a Voodoo 3 PCI for games from 1997- 2000. Do you see any potential problems with this?

no, i think that setup would play everything just fine, you even have that PCI card for anything older that is 'puzzled' by the modernity of the system!

Last edited by Stiletto on 2021-05-24, 20:33. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 10 of 17, by chinny22

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enaiel wrote on 2021-05-20, 22:06:

Would throwing Win2K on a C2D PC let me play them better? Or are they incompatible with modern hardware and I need something that's more period correct? In which case, should I just dual boot my existing DOS VIA C3 with Voodoo 2 into Win2K for just the Windows games that don't work properly on modern systems? Questions, questions...

I think this something like this is the most sensible approach and what I do, the main rigs I use are
My LGA775, GTX590, SB Titanium, WinXP. Latest game is GTA SA and still able to enable max out all settings and driver enhancements without stressing the hardware.
Anything that doesn't like XP runs perfectly fine on my Dual P3 600 V2 SLI, Win2k/98. with 98 only been used for dos and the few games I cant get working in 2k.
None of the games that refuse to work on the XP PC really need the extra speed anyway (NFS Porsche been a common title on both our lists)

So your C3 would fill the same role as my P3. I don't think you'll escape having to install 98 somewhere, but if its limited to only 5 games that's still better then using it as your primary OS.
Installing 2k on the LGA775 may allow a few extra games to run but I think its the OS more then the hardware causing the capability issues. I'd definitely give it a try first though!
2k defiantly has more of a retro feel about it though and LGA775 is pretty powerful for a XP build, 2k will fly!

Reply 12 of 17, by Jorpho

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enaiel wrote on 2021-05-20, 22:06:
Good idea, here are the games that I haven't been able to play properly since I had upgraded from Win2K: […]
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Good idea, here are the games that I haven't been able to play properly since I had upgraded from Win2K:

* Thief Gold
* Splinter Cell
* NFS: Porsche Unleashed
* F1 2001
* FIFA 2002

There are absolutely patches galore for Thief Gold at this point. They wouldn't be selling it on GOG and suchlike if it required Win2K. I see Splinter Cell is also on GOG, but there seem to be lots of threads about it here about how it is very particular about exactly what hardware it needs.

I'm not sure about the others, but I think NFS: Porsche Unleashed and F1 are also frequent topics of discussion.

should I just dual boot my existing DOS VIA C3 with Voodoo 2 into Win2K for just the Windows games that don't work properly on modern systems?

Have you done that before? I thought I read that the Voodoo2 Win2k drivers were lacking.

Reply 13 of 17, by enaiel

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Jorpho wrote on 2021-05-21, 15:43:

Have you done that before? I thought I read that the Voodoo2 Win2k drivers were lacking.

Oh really? You just dashed my hopes and dreams of living in a '98 free world 🙁. I guess I'll just dual boot the DOS PC into Win98 then and create this overkill LGA775 C2D Win2K PC as a separate project.

DOS PC: Socket 370 / VIA C3 1.0 GHz / Voodoo2 + Trident Blade3D / SBPro + YMF744 + AWE64 + SC-7
Best DOS Games: CGW 150, PC Gamer 50, Worthwhile 100

Reply 14 of 17, by The Serpent Rider

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I have a C2D E6750, 7950GT and X-Fi XtremeGamer that should be great for 2001 - 2007, including Crysis.

*chuckles*

Get up, come on get down with the sickness
Open up your hate, and let it flow into me

Reply 15 of 17, by enaiel

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The Serpent Rider wrote on 2021-05-22, 12:23:

I have a C2D E6750, 7950GT and X-Fi XtremeGamer that should be great for 2001 - 2007, including Crysis.

*chuckles*

Lol, okay, maybe not great. I ran Crysis back then on this 7950GT and I got around 30 fps at medium settings. All I can say is, at least it DOES run Crysis 😀

DOS PC: Socket 370 / VIA C3 1.0 GHz / Voodoo2 + Trident Blade3D / SBPro + YMF744 + AWE64 + SC-7
Best DOS Games: CGW 150, PC Gamer 50, Worthwhile 100

Reply 17 of 17, by Rikintosh

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No voodoo will go well with a core2duo. The ideal would be a Pentium II or III, with a maximum of 256mb of ram and win98 for voodoo games

Another build, for 2001 - 2005 games, in a pentium 4 configuration w/ Win 2k/XP. And finally your current core2duo for 2006 - 2010 games w/ Win7.

I'm developing a game manager frontend for Win 9x, take a look: https://rikintoshsmultimediamanager.blogspot.com/