The short answer is that in the simplest configuration, nothing should be in your config.sys except for the DEVICE[HIGH] statement for your CD-ROM driver, and nothing should be in autoexec.bat except environment variables (and doskey if you'd like). Put MSCDEX, mouse driver, and other TSRs in c:\windows\dosstart.bat, and use the "restart in MS-DOS mode" feature when you want real mode. This way, things like ISAPNP devices are initialized and that can cut down on any needed drivers. That ISAPNP initialization is a difference between "restart in MS-DOS mode" versus pressing F8 at boot and choosing command prompt only, or creating some overly-complex menu setup.

Technically, through things like Devload, you could even move the CD-ROM driver to dosstart.bat, but for some reason that was not supplied in stock Win9x.

Unnecessary software in config.sys and autoexec.bat, at best, just wastes memory in DOS boxes while you are running Windows. At worst, things like Int 13h hookers can force Windows to use the BIOS calls for disk access instead of direct access to the hardware through the protected mode driver, hurting performance.

Windows acts as the EMS and UMB provider while it is running, and temporarily takes over from any EMM386-style utilities using an API called GEMMI and returns control back to them when returning to real mode. With an empty config.sys, there is no EMS and no UMBs while in real mode, and EMS but no UMBs while in Windows. If you put DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\EMM386.EXE NOEMS in config.sys you get the opposite--no EMS but UMBs, and will increase free conventional memory both in DOS boxes as well as in "restart to MS-DOS mode". If you want EMS+UMBs at the same time you can look up how to configure EMM386.

You really shouldn't have to be dropping to real mode to run games. The feature is there (and if needed, there is even built-in functionality to reboot into a custom config.sys and autoexec.bat setup just for one specific PIF) but it's for things like custom DOS extenders that are not DPMI compliant. You can read more about it here: https://ptgmedia.pearsoncmg.com/images/978032 … _bonus_ch02.pdf

@jakethompson1 - possibly the best/most succinct explaination of this ever?

jakethompson1 wrote on 2024-02-10, 20:59:

The short answer is that in the simplest configuration, nothing should be in your config.sys except for the DEVICE[HIGH] stateme […]
Show full quote

The short answer is that in the simplest configuration, nothing should be in your config.sys except for the DEVICE[HIGH] statement for your CD-ROM driver, and nothing should be in autoexec.bat except environment variables (and doskey if you'd like). Put MSCDEX, mouse driver, and other TSRs in c:\windows\dosstart.bat, and use the "restart in MS-DOS mode" feature when you want real mode. This way, things like ISAPNP devices are initialized and that can cut down on any needed drivers. That ISAPNP initialization is a difference between "restart in MS-DOS mode" versus pressing F8 at boot and choosing command prompt only, or creating some overly-complex menu setup.

Technically, through things like Devload, you could even move the CD-ROM driver to dosstart.bat, but for some reason that was not supplied in stock Win9x.

Unnecessary software in config.sys and autoexec.bat, at best, just wastes memory in DOS boxes while you are running Windows. At worst, things like Int 13h hookers can force Windows to use the BIOS calls for disk access instead of direct access to the hardware through the protected mode driver, hurting performance.

Windows acts as the EMS and UMB provider while it is running, and temporarily takes over from any EMM386-style utilities using an API called GEMMI and returns control back to them when returning to real mode. With an empty config.sys, there is no EMS and no UMBs while in real mode, and EMS but no UMBs while in Windows. If you put DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\EMM386.EXE NOEMS in config.sys you get the opposite--no EMS but UMBs, and will increase free conventional memory both in DOS boxes as well as in "restart to MS-DOS mode". If you want EMS+UMBs at the same time you can look up how to configure EMM386.

You really shouldn't have to be dropping to real mode to run games. The feature is there (and if needed, there is even built-in functionality to reboot into a custom config.sys and autoexec.bat setup just for one specific PIF) but it's for things like custom DOS extenders that are not DPMI compliant. You can read more about it here: https://ptgmedia.pearsoncmg.com/images/978032 … _bonus_ch02.pdf

Thank you. The goal was to use this machine like one with DOS+Win 3.11,setting up DOS 7.1 and using Windows ocasionally.

@jakethompson1
Thank you for your great explanation. The ISAPNP difference was news to me. I guess I never experimented enough with "Restart to MS-DOS mode" to understand it back in the day.

George Razvan wrote on 2024-02-11, 07:26:

Thank you. The goal was to use this machine like one with DOS+Win 3.11,setting up DOS 7.1 and using Windows ocasionally.

My retro system is configured the same way for the same purpose. Since I do not boot to Windows by default, I opted for the opposite approach - of having optimally configured DOS startup files. On a Super Socket 7 setup it gives me enough UMBs for everything I want to run + EMS. The extra memory usage in a Windows DOS box does not bother me, since I do not generally run DOS games from there. It does limit me to a specific set of drivers and TSRs that Windows is aware of and can work around, so as to avoid the following issue:

jakethompson1 wrote on 2024-02-10, 20:59:

things like Int 13h hookers can force Windows to use the BIOS calls for disk access instead of direct access to the hardware through the protected mode driver, hurting performance

George Razvan wrote on 2024-02-10, 19:39:

Hey everyone, […]
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Hey everyone,

I have a couple of questions about the drivers loaded in AUTOEXEC.BAT/ CONFIG.SYS

1)I`m trying to get sound ,booting directly in dos mode (OS is Win 95B). Do I need to install the dos drivers,or just use SET BLASTER in AUTOEXEC.BAT? Sound card is Aztech Nova 16,with 2316R chipset.

2)I know Win95 processes AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS,do dos drivers (mouse,sound,etc) loaded interfere with Win drivers after loading WIN? Or uncessarily use conventional memory? Does EMS,XMS drivers reduce memory accesibile by windows?

3)All my dos games work ok in Windows, but I like to run`em in real mode (something I have done only on DOS+Win 3.11). Any other tips`n`tricks? Like best start-up files config?

Tks!

For real real mode, I recommend to create a boot menu. So either boot directly to DOS (with several options, like only himem.sys or with emm386) or to Windows.
There is a guide from "Phil". Also here in Vogons you can find a lot of sample configurations.

As CoffeeOne has stated, try using a boot menu configuration:
How to create a boot (start up) menu under Windows 9x/ME

George Razvan wrote on 2024-02-10, 19:39:

All my dos games work ok in Windows, but I like to run`em in real mode (something I have done only on DOS+Win 3.11). Any other tips`n`tricks? Like best start-up files config?

Don't worry many of us do this, it just feels more correct I guess?
Personally I create a shortcut on the desktop to command.com and modify the autoexec/config.sys setup from within the pif.

I used this as a template for my setup, Its fun to try the different recommendations out and decide which ones you do/don't want to use
https://www.mdgx.com/mem7.htm

jesolo wrote on 2024-02-11, 21:18:

As CoffeeOne has stated, try using a boot menu configuration:
How to create a boot (start up) menu under Windows 9x/ME

Tks, that should be what i'm looking for.

chinny22 wrote on 2024-02-12, 01:05:

George Razvan wrote on 2024-02-10, 19:39:

All my dos games work ok in Windows, but I like to run`em in real mode (something I have done only on DOS+Win 3.11). Any other tips`n`tricks? Like best start-up files config?

Don't worry many of us do this, it just feels more correct I guess?

Exactly ! Tks, will check it !