VOGONS


Reply 2720 of 3064, by elfoam

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I can answer any questions you guys have about soldering surface mount, I'm not the worlds greatest surface mount builder but I'm a few levels above the skill needed to assemble these cards so ask away. Good solder and good flux is the most important thing. Technique you can learn but you can't learn your way out of bad solder.

Reply 2721 of 3064, by Sunoo

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Dr.Yak wrote on 2022-04-06, 13:32:

Same problem here 😅
My current level is: puts everything on fire when not dealing with through-hole component.

My last SMT project has a short somewhere, and I’ll probably never find it, so I can only improve, right?

In a lot of ways that was more complex than this looks though. So fingers crossed.

Reply 2722 of 3064, by Synoptic

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Dr.Yak wrote on 2022-04-06, 13:32:
Sunoo wrote on 2022-04-06, 12:57:

I guess I’ll get to find out if my SMT soldering skills have gotten any better since my last project.

Same problem here 😅
My current level is: puts everything on fire when not dealing with through-hole component.

Shock__ is the one making this decision. I am totally open to ship to other continents, but I want to make the North America work first and then we'll see what's happening with Europe.

Reply 2723 of 3064, by Shponglefan

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Synoptic wrote on 2022-04-06, 12:47:

Preorders are up at www.micronick.com/argus

Pre-order submitted.

Now to wait patiently... 😁

My YouTube channel (retro game music)

Reply 2724 of 3064, by Shponglefan

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Sunoo wrote on 2022-04-06, 12:57:

I guess I’ll get to find out if my SMT soldering skills have gotten any better since my last project.

I'm in the same boat. I'm debating if I want to contract out the soldering of this board, because I don't want to risk messing it up.

My YouTube channel (retro game music)

Reply 2725 of 3064, by DrYak

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elfoam wrote on 2022-04-06, 13:38:

I can answer any questions you guys have about soldering surface mount, {...} Good solder and good flux is the most important thing.

Reply 2726 of 3064, by Dr.Yak

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Synoptic wrote on 2022-04-06, 13:58:

Shock__ is the one making this decision. I am totally open to ship to other continents, but I want to make the North America work first and then we'll see what's happening with Europe.

Okay, I'll patiently wait.

Reply 2727 of 3064, by elfoam

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DrYak wrote on 2022-04-06, 14:22:
[…]
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elfoam wrote on 2022-04-06, 13:38:

I can answer any questions you guys have about soldering surface mount, {...} Good solder and good flux is the most important thing.

I use leaded solder since it's much easier to use but if you have health/environmental concerns about leaded solder and can use the lead free that's ok. I normally use gel flux
in syringes from aliexpress but due to the... unknown health effects of Chinese flux (it does work well) I also have some pure Rosin flux from a US company called SRA which works well enough. not quite as good as the dubious chinese gel fluxes :p. The solder I use (and most motherboard builders use) is Kaina 60/40 CF-10 leaded from Aliexpress in .6mm, it's about as good as solder gets.

Reply 2729 of 3064, by terryfi

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I went through the BOM and I have few questions, I appreciate answers from people who already assembled card or used the BOM .

1- When I search Digikey for 311-20ARCT-ND and 311-2.2ARCT-ND part numbers, it finds parts with 20ohm and 2.2ohm instead of 20Kohm and 2.2Kohm resistor shown in BOM, are the part numbers wrong or there are typos in values?

2- Is M29F800FB55M3F2 good replacement for IW78C21M1?

3- As others also mentioned the 16Mhz oscillator with exact value 16.9344 MHz is out of stock in Digikey, if we use 16.00 Mhz oscillator instead, will the card work? If yes, what would be side effect, slightly higher pitch sound?

Reply 2730 of 3064, by Sunoo

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terryfi wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:08:

3- As others also mentioned the 16Mhz oscillator with exact value 16.9344 MHz is out of stock in Digikey, if we use 16.00 Mhz oscillator instead, will the card work? If yes, what would be side effect, slightly higher pitch sound?

Looks like Mouser may have a proper crystal in stock: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CTS-Elec … onents/ATS169-E

Reply 2731 of 3064, by Tiido

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All the pitches will be significantly lower with 16MHz crystal, MIDI input/output most likely stops working. Any software that expects correct timings is going to fail.

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 2732 of 3064, by TheMobRules

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terryfi wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:08:

2- Is M29F800FB55M3F2 good replacement for IW78C21M1?

You can use a 29F800 if you set the option when building the card, but keep in mind that you first need to write the Wavetable ROM code into the chip, which is not publicly available. On the other hand, the IW78C21M1 is a mask ROM that was used in the original cards, so there is no need to program the chip, this makes it the best option if you can get it (I believe most of us who built the previous batches of ARGUS cards got it from UTSource).

Reply 2734 of 3064, by terryfi

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Check https://www.micronick.com/argus/#!/ARGUS-BARE … 9451/category=0, 14 sold , 6 left I think it will happen

Sunoo wrote on 2022-04-07, 00:44:

Is this batch definitely being made? I don’t want to start stockpiling parts if we don’t end up meeting some needed threshold of orders or something.

Reply 2735 of 3064, by terryfi

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TheMobRules wrote on 2022-04-07, 00:37:
terryfi wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:08:

2- Is M29F800FB55M3F2 good replacement for IW78C21M1?

You can use a 29F800 if you set the option when building the card, but keep in mind that you first need to write the Wavetable ROM code into the chip, which is not publicly available. On the other hand, the IW78C21M1 is a mask ROM that was used in the original cards, so there is no need to program the chip, this makes it the best option if you can get it (I believe most of us who built the previous batches of ARGUS cards got it from UTSource).

Yes I noticed I would need copyrighted ADPCM ROM but didn't know that IW78 was already programmed thanks for letting me know.
I have read a lot of posts in this thread explaining EEPROM programming, sound patches and general progress of the project really necessary to assemble and debug the board; it is quite a lot.

I also found the schematic of some ARGUS prototypes, Interwave datasheets, and many useful photos, maybe we should put all these resources together in one page for people participating in the first batch.

Last edited by terryfi on 2022-04-07, 14:04. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 2736 of 3064, by 640K!enough

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terryfi wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:08:

1- When I search Digikey for 311-20ARCT-ND and 311-2.2ARCT-ND part numbers, it finds parts with 20ohm and 2.2ohm instead of 20Kohm and 2.2Kohm resistor shown in BOM, are the part numbers wrong or there are typos in values?

When in doubt, forget all of the existing carts and/or part numbers posted (most are not quite complete), and refer back to the original documents posted by shock__. The values listed there are correct, and you would do well to make sure any other lists match what he originally called for.

terryfi wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:08:

2- Is M29F800FB55M3F2 good replacement for IW78C21M1?

As others have mentioned, the IW78C21M1 contains the 1 MiB instrument bank, consisting of parameters, other metadata and (mostly) 8-bit linear PCM samples (forget any other nonsense you may have read on Wikipedia). The data are not in the public domain, and nobody here has the authority to distribute them. The only way that is not known to be in violation of their copyrights is to acquire the original masked ROM. Whether they'd actually be inclined to take legal action is another matter (at least two of the three companies still exist). Any other parts mentioned are flash memory ICs, contain no data, and will produce no sound with software designed to use the on-board bank.

terryfi wrote on 2022-04-06, 21:08:

3- As others also mentioned the 16Mhz oscillator with exact value 16.9344 MHz is out of stock in Digikey, if we use 16.00 Mhz oscillator instead, will the card work? If yes, what would be side effect, slightly higher pitch sound?

Tiido has given you the answer to this one. If you're going to bother trying to build the card, it's not worth trying to substitute a part that is that far out of specifications. At best, you will get sound that plays at the wrong pitch. Since the InterWave can be sensitive to timing, other things may begin to fail (timers, MIDI data rate, etc.), and the chip may even stop responding outright. Do yourself a favour and use the right parts.

Reply 2737 of 3064, by Shponglefan

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Sunoo wrote on 2022-04-07, 00:44:

Is this batch definitely being made? I don’t want to start stockpiling parts if we don’t end up meeting some needed threshold of orders or something.

There's only 3 pre-orders left after just the first day so I imagine the target should get reached and we'll see things fulfilled.

My YouTube channel (retro game music)

Reply 2738 of 3064, by Synoptic

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Shponglefan wrote on 2022-04-07, 12:56:
Sunoo wrote on 2022-04-07, 00:44:

Is this batch definitely being made? I don’t want to start stockpiling parts if we don’t end up meeting some needed threshold of orders or something.

There's only 3 pre-orders left after just the first day so I imagine the target should get reached and we'll see things fulfilled.

I hope too!
Go spread the word!

Reply 2739 of 3064, by MJay99

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Been searching for an MPC connector for another card for a while now, but finally found them:

https://www.digikey.de/en/products/detail/ada … -04-GR/14114181 (cheap)
or, more expensive, from Molex:
https://www.digikey.de/en/products/detail/mol … 5530108/1643388

They're not on any of the previous baskets I've seen, so maybe it saves some time for those, who're looking for a shrouded version.