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Reply 440 of 978, by fitzpatr

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Boohyaka wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:26:
Who would've thought that making proper retro-modern hardware in small batches from scratch today with quality in mind would hav […]
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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:00:

Expensive.

Will prices be coming down in future ?

Who would've thought that making proper retro-modern hardware in small batches from scratch today with quality in mind would have a price. Even at that price, I'm pretty sure their time is really not well-valued.
I personally think obnoxiously calling it expensive as you just did is really offensive and completely out of touch in properly recognizing effort and personal time investment.
You think it's too expensive for your budget? Keep it to yourself.

Asking if prices may come down in the future is fine though. I'm just happy for the guys that the answer is no.

In fairness to Intel486dx33, I agree that it is expensive. However, getting original hardware that even comes close will generally be significantly more expensive [MPU-401AT (good luck), AWE64 Gold (for S/PDIF), and an OPL3/WSS sound card], and it wouldn't offer everything that this does.

That didn't stop me from buying two of them because I believe that it is worth that amount given what it provides, the effort involved, the bill of materials, and shipping being included.

Keropi, what is the PCS header for? I couldn't find any references to it.

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Reply 441 of 978, by keropi

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fitzpatr wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:49:

[...]
Keropi, what is the PCS header for? I couldn't find any references to it.

It is the PC Speaker input - but there are cases than when using it it could degrade the audio quality - so it is left unpopulated. It can be used if you solder a pin header.

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Reply 442 of 978, by fitzpatr

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keropi wrote on 2021-01-28, 17:21:
fitzpatr wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:49:

[...]
Keropi, what is the PCS header for? I couldn't find any references to it.

It is the PC Speaker input - but there are cases than when using it it could degrade the audio quality - so it is left unpopulated. It can be used if you solder a pin header.

I assumed that, but wanted confirmation. For whatever reason, mine is populated with pins, but I'll test the use of it to make sure that it isn't a problem.

Thank you very much!

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Reply 443 of 978, by Intel486dx33

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Boohyaka wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:26:
Who would've thought that making proper retro-modern hardware in small batches from scratch today with quality in mind would hav […]
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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:00:

Expensive.

Will prices be coming down in future ?

Who would've thought that making proper retro-modern hardware in small batches from scratch today with quality in mind would have a price. Even at that price, I'm pretty sure their time is really not well-valued.
I personally think obnoxiously calling it expensive as you just did is really offensive and completely out of touch in properly recognizing effort and personal time investment.
You think it's too expensive for your budget? Keep it to yourself.

Asking if prices may come down in the future is fine though. I'm just happy for the guys that the answer is no.

Well, I am just saying "If these sound card manufactures would have designed a good sound card from the beginning we would not need this fix".

Reply 444 of 978, by appiah4

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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:00:
The card comes in 3 flavors - all prices include registered airmail shipping in a hard box with fully assembled and complete ite […]
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The card comes in 3 flavors - all prices include registered airmail shipping in a hard box with fully assembled and complete items ready for use:

Orheus soundcard : 130eur
Orpheus soundcard with PCMIDI installed: 180eur
Orpheus soundcard with PCMIDI installed and Dreamblaster X2 daughterboard: 230eur

Expensive.

Will prices be coming down in future ?

An apple fan cheaping out in the face of undeniable quality?

Just 🤣

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Reply 445 of 978, by mothergoose729

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keropi wrote on 2021-01-28, 17:21:
fitzpatr wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:49:

[...]
Keropi, what is the PCS header for? I couldn't find any references to it.

It is the PC Speaker input - but there are cases than when using it it could degrade the audio quality - so it is left unpopulated. It can be used if you solder a pin header.

What cases are those? Is it only when the pins are active (aka PC speaker is used) or all the time?

Reply 447 of 978, by fitzpatr

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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 18:49:

That’s $279 for an ISA sound card.
More expensive that 1993 prices.

The Sound Blaster 16 ASP was $349 on release...accounting for inflation, that is approximately $625 today.

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Reply 448 of 978, by kolderman

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fitzpatr wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:02:
Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 18:49:

That’s $279 for an ISA sound card.
More expensive that 1993 prices.

The Sound Blaster 16 ASP was $349 on release...accounting for inflation, that is approximately $625 today.

And that's WITH economies of scale...shit in the 90s was as expensive as heck.

Reply 449 of 978, by Intel486dx33

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fitzpatr wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:02:
Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 18:49:

That’s $279 for an ISA sound card.
More expensive that 1993 prices.

The Sound Blaster 16 ASP was $349 on release...accounting for inflation, that is approximately $625 today.

Yes, And apparently it was NOT very good.
It appears the sound card industry has been milking the audiophile community with flawed sound cards.
That have bugs and problems and admit allot of noise.

Reply 450 of 978, by TheMobRules

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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 18:49:

That’s $279 for an ISA sound card.
More expensive that 1993 prices.

L O L

Do you realize how much an MPU-401AT + a decent wavetable would have cost back then? And that is excluding the Sound Blaster capabilities, of which you have an example in the posts above.

Reply 451 of 978, by Joseph_Joestar

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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 18:49:

That’s $279 for an ISA sound card.
More expensive that 1993 prices.

On one hand, we have a commercial sound card built by a huge company in extremely large quantities using cheap components. On the other hand, we have a fan-made sound card built by hobbyists in a limited quantity using high quality components.

Comparing apples to oranges and all that.

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Reply 452 of 978, by Intel486dx33

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These sound card and computer companies should help mass produce this sound card to lower the costs and bare some of the expense.
They were selling us flawed sound cards from the beginning.

All we want is a compatible sound card to hear the audio as it was meant to be heard.

I have boxes full of ISA sound cards looking for one the good sound.

Reply 453 of 978, by Intel486dx33

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Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:08:
Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 18:49:

That’s $279 for an ISA sound card.
More expensive that 1993 prices.

On one hand, we have a commercial sound card built by a huge company in extremely large quantities using cheap components. On the other hand, we have a fan-made sound card built by hobbyists in a limited quantity using high quality components.

Comparing apples to oranges and all that.

Yes, from the reviews I have seen. The users really like this sound card and the audio is very clean.
It is a nice piece of engineering.

Reply 454 of 978, by darry

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The personal take on the monetary aspect was previously addressed earlier in this very thread .

See Re: Orpheus Soundcard: a new DOS soundcard with SPDIF/OPL3/MPU support .

TLDR : I think that the Orpheus is a great product and that it is worth every penny, but I understand that it is not within everybody's budget .

Reply 456 of 978, by Boohyaka

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Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:10:
These sound card and computer companies should help mass produce this sound card to lower the costs and bare some of the expense […]
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These sound card and computer companies should help mass produce this sound card to lower the costs and bare some of the expense.
They were selling us flawed sound cards from the beginning.

All we want is a compatible sound card to hear the audio as it was meant to be heard.

I have boxes full of ISA sound cards looking for one the good sound.

Indeed, and now you have the chance to buy a brand new, well designed and thought-out card with quality components that sounds great and is pretty much the best DOS soundcard available feature-wise, and you complain about its price that all things considered is not that high. Cheap? ~200 bucks is probably not "cheap" for most people. Is the price inflated? Taking into account it is a small batch made by enthusiasts that didn't cut short on quality, it definitely isn't and there's no way you can argue otherwise.

Reply 457 of 978, by DNSDies

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keropi wrote on 2021-01-28, 16:16:

sadly it is of no use at all - it is really limited in what you can do and it only works briefly for experiments as the windows driver immediately reverts any such change
it really needs the main driver to be patched - something that noone so far was able to do...

That's unfortunate.
According to the Datasheet, the PNP drivers should have a way to utilize external FM synthesizers.
Did you try using the drivers for a different card with the CS9233 or OPL3LS? They should be configured to use external FM.
Acer Magic S23A had the same CS4237b chip Orpheus uses and a CS9233 chip for FM synthesis.

Also, to anyone complaining about price:
The original Sound Blaster retailed for a ROCK BOTTOM price of $125 in 1989.
The Sound Blaster 16 was over $150 in most stores at its release in 1992.

In 2020 dollars, that's well over $260/$270 respectively.
You're getting a GOOD deal for a modern, newly produced ISA sound card that is LEAGUES above those cards. No bugs. Clean sound. SPDIF.
Also, if you don't need intelligent MPU-401, it's only $160~. A BARGAIN.

the only negative is that OPL3 doesn't work in windows, and that seems like a driver issue that could be solved in the future.

Last edited by DNSDies on 2021-01-28, 20:06. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 459 of 978, by keropi

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DNSDies wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:51:
That's unfortunate. According to the Datasheet, the PNP drivers should have a way to utilize external FM synthesizers. Did you t […]
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That's unfortunate.
According to the Datasheet, the PNP drivers should have a way to utilize external FM synthesizers.
Did you try using the drivers for a different card with the CS9233 or OPL3LS? They should be configured to use external FM.
Acer Magic S23A had the same CS4237b chip Orpheus uses and a CS9233 chip for FM synthesis.

Yes it should - furan looked at the driver but sadly none of what was discussed worked for me: Re: Orpheus Soundcard: a new DOS soundcard with SPDIF/OPL3/MPU support
interesting info about the S32A , I wonder what happens under windows - is it sure that the 9233 still responsible for FM? do you have a link to it's drivers?

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