Presently I have an SB Live PCI with which I’m using the SB16 emulator drivers under DOS. I have an ISA SB16 on order.
When I get the SB16 can I keep using the Live for the MIDI? Will that still need the emulator drivers loaded?
Long term I want to get an X2GS wavetable board for my SB16. Could that be used in conjunction with an MT32-Pi? (Basically use whichever is better supported by a given game.)
Depends on the SB16 (there are literally tens of versions, post the CTxxxx model number for clarity), both in terms of whether it even has a Wavetable header, and on how bad its MIDI bugs are (all SB16 variants have slowdown bugs, most have minor hanging note bugs, some have awful hanging note bugs).
Tbh, I'd never use an SB16 (or AWE32/64) for MIDI unless I had no other choice. But what your options are depend on the system (do you have a second ISA slot available?) and what you want to run on it (only DOS? or also Win9x games?)
If you have multiple ISA slots, I'd recommend an additional ISA sound card with bug-free MPU-401 MIDI, a wavetable header, full SBPro2 compatibility and (depending on your SB16) real OPL-3. Something like an Aztech 3rd gen (AZT2316) or OPTi 929/930 would be perfect. If you already have OPL-3 on the SB16, an ESS card would be a good option too. The SBLive can remain in the system, just don't bother initializing it for DOS.
If not, question is what you want to do. Only DOS? They you're far better off with a different PCI card. Given your desire for wavetable, I'd suggest an ESS Solo-1 based card like the Terrtec Solo-1 (not all cards have wavetable header installed, but you can solder one in and it just works), but a Yamaha YMF74x-card would also be good, if it has a wavetable header. Both are better in DOS (more combatible, less nasty drivers) than the SBLive. If you want Win9x and EAX they fall short. However the golden rule with PCI and DOS is you only need to initialize what you want to use, so you can keep the SBLive for Win9x and add one of the aforementioned cards for use in DOS without conflicts.
I have a CT2230 on the way. I verified it has a Yamaha OPL3 chip as well as wavetable headers. Not sure on the revision - will have to physically inspect it once it gets here.
I only have one ISA slot, so for maximum DOS compatibility that's where I'm putting the SB16. Do the MIDI bugs impact using the wavetable header or MIDI through the gameport?
I don't plan on using the PCI card long term - right now it's because it's what I have and MIDI has sounded pretty nice and worked under DOS (so far.) I have to load a driver into memory for compatibility, and I was hoping there was a way to bypass that or reduce its memory footprint and keep using it for music once I have an SB16 ISA until I can get a wavetable board.
My setup back in the day was an SB16 + GUS but I don't have the money to do that again...
deepthaw wrote on 2021-09-28, 17:35:Do the MIDI bugs impact using the wavetable header or MIDI through the gameport?
Both. I recommend as dionb said and using a non-SB16 card for MIDI.
deepthaw wrote on 2021-09-28, 17:35:I have a CT2230 on the way. I verified it has a Yamaha OPL3 chip as well as wavetable headers. Not sure on the revision - will have to physically inspect it once it gets here.
See here:
Sound Blaster: From best to worst
CT2230 is one of the better SB16s, particularly if you have the newer CT1703 chip so it's quiet. You just have the MIDI slowdowns (when MIDI and digital audio are played at same time), single-cycle DMA click bugs and the lesser of the two hanging note bugs (only 'legal' notes hang, and stop doing so when same note is played again).
I only have one ISA slot, so for maximum DOS compatibility that's where I'm putting the SB16. Do the MIDI bugs impact using the wavetable header or MIDI through the gameport?
Yes, they're in the ISA-to-MIDI interface, so apply equally to wavetable header and external MIDI via DB15.
I don't plan on using the PCI card long term - right now it's because it's what I have and MIDI has sounded pretty nice and worked under DOS (so far.) I have to load a driver into memory for compatibility, and I was hoping there was a way to bypass that or reduce its memory footprint and keep using it for music once I have an SB16 ISA until I can get a wavetable board.
Which motherboard do you have? With an SB16, I'd really recommend a second card, PCI if needs be, for MIDI.
Depending on options (best case but unlikely: PC/PCI aka SBLink, or various DDMA/TDMA alternatives) you might get away with not using a TSR. Given you have OPL3 on the CT2230, by far the most foolproof option would be an ESS Solo-1 PCI card, i.e. the Terratec Solo-1. Common, dirt cheap and pretty foolproof - and gets you rock solid MIDI. Only if you have a PC/PCI connector would a YMF74x make more sense.
My setup back in the day was an SB16 + GUS but I don't have the money to do that again...
They are viciously expensive these days. I have one bought a few years back when it wasn't quite so bad, which I have paired with an AWE64Gold and a simple ISA Aztech card (4th gen AZT2320 PnP iirc), so I have the best of pretty much all worlds. But you need to be very lucky or have very deep pockets to get that these days. And you need a motherboard with three ISA slots...
I have a labeled, unpopulated spot for pc/pci on my motherboard. I’m tempted to see if I can add the header myself, but I’d have no way of testing it without buying another card.
That's good news! But no, unless someone else has tried it and succeeded on specifically this board and revision (again, which board is it?) the only way to find out is to try, which requires something supporting it on the other end. With that connector a YMF74x card can run without TSR, giving you perfect MPU-401 and SBPro2 compatibility.
dionb wrote on 2021-09-28, 21:43:by far the most foolproof option would be an ESS Solo-1 PCI card, i.e. the Terratec Solo-1. Common, dirt cheap and pretty foolproof - and gets you rock solid MIDI.
I'm not sure how the sound quality compares with the Terratec but I got a Labway LWHA331D60 its a Solo-1 with wavetable header and pc/pci header that I have seen cheaper than the Terratec cards. I know with the solo-1 the pc/pci isnt a big deal but nice to have the option and I have had good luck with Labway cards.
I actually prefer the ESFM over OPL3 in many cases..... heresy I know.
deepthaw wrote on 2021-09-28, 17:35:I have a CT2230 on the way. I verified it has a Yamaha OPL3 chip as well as wavetable headers. Not sure on the revision - will h […]
I have a CT2230 on the way. I verified it has a Yamaha OPL3 chip as well as wavetable headers. Not sure on the revision - will have to physically inspect it once it gets here.
I only have one ISA slot, so for maximum DOS compatibility that's where I'm putting the SB16. Do the MIDI bugs impact using the wavetable header or MIDI through the gameport?
I don't plan on using the PCI card long term - right now it's because it's what I have and MIDI has sounded pretty nice and worked under DOS (so far.) I have to load a driver into memory for compatibility, and I was hoping there was a way to bypass that or reduce its memory footprint and keep using it for music once I have an SB16 ISA until I can get a wavetable board.
My setup back in the day was an SB16 + GUS but I don't have the money to do that again...
I use SB16 + SBlive combo in real dos. Initialize both cards, use SB16 for all DAC and FM in games and only combine sblive for games that support dac + GM. Basically only use the sblive as a GM device or nothing.
One problem with both cards enabled is be sure to disable the Adlib part of the sblive emulation. If you don't, FM will output from both cards at the same time and you get the terrible sblive emulated fm on top of the good sb16 fm.
Also from what I remember the Sblive GM emulation with 8MB .ECW SF (not the fm emulation) in DOS sounded much better than the SBAWE32/64 GM in real dos. I will have to check that again.
