VirtuaIceMan wrote on 2022-03-03, 10:35:

Voodoo2 is a 3D-only card, it'd be Voodoo3 for 2D/3D. Matrox Millennium might be good idea, as I used before, but I have no idea which I had, as they all have various numbers (from II to G450, G550 etc).

Are there any programs I can use to audit the MX440 to see what's causing the D3D problems, maybe nail that down a bit more?

You could add the V2 to the system and keep the MX. Sorry, I didn’t think I had to type that out, haha…

Matrix g400 is a great card with latest drivers, but bad for DOS. It’s a DirectX 6 card but newer drivers need DirectX 7. Definitely performs better with the later drivers, especially in OpenGL.

I'm not so interested in DOS so will see. If the MX440 still fails to do Direct3D with any drivers in Win98SE I might have to return it. Will try with PowerVR removed first though. Something's up.

Check your autoexec.bat. There’s an M3DPCI EXE there. REM That out before uninstalling anything and see if that helps.

Yeah I saw that when reformatting. Will try.

Meatball wrote on 2022-03-03, 10:07:

Do not use 56.64. It needs DirectX 9. You have to go back further:

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/drivers/win9x-5664/

You do not need DirectX 9 instanced to use 56.64. I tested this yesterday with my GeForce 2 Ultra and this driver gave the best performance when paired with a fast Pentium 4.

Kahenraz wrote on 2022-03-03, 11:21:

Meatball wrote on 2022-03-03, 10:07:

Do not use 56.64. It needs DirectX 9. You have to go back further:

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/drivers/win9x-5664/

You do not need DirectX 9 instanced to use 56.64. I tested this yesterday with my GeForce 2 Ultra and this driver gave the best performance when paired with a fast Pentium 4.

What DirectX version do you have installed?

Right some good news: I put on DX7.0a (I was running DX6.1) and now D3D finally works on MX440, both in DxDiag test (where AGP support is also enabled now) and also in Motorhead (that I have to hand). Johnny Herbert crashes to desktop, bit it's a rather flakey game.

P.S. as running the PowerVR Revolution drivers, I'm actually missing the PowerVR PCI line from autoexec.bat

Next up I'll put the M3D back in and have a play. Next is to find the best graphics card drivers for the MX440.

I test ran a LOT of Nvidia drivers last night, alongside the PowerVR Revolution drivers. Here are some of my results, mainly looking at the "problem child" games Moon Racer and Revolte, but noting that Ultim@te Race 1 track starts to go wrong the higher the driver (as well as frame rates feeling less fluid). As mentioned above, also running DX7.0a as it fixes D3D on the MX440 8X card.

I found that freezes in gameplay in Moon Racer and Revolte can be fixed (sometimes only for a moment though) by pressing P, to pause/unpause the game.

40.72 + 41.09 = Moon Racer freezes during racing
43.45 = Moon Racer less freezes but can still happen
45.23 = Moon Racer still can freeze
53.04 = menus not flickery in Moon Racer (they are in previous drivers). Froze on last lap briefly (came back without using P key), then CTD when race over
56.64 = Moon Racer flickery unplayable mess, same issue I had on Radeon 9600
61.76 = Moon Racer flickery unplayable mess, same issue I had on Radeon 9600
66.94 = Revolte now works but freezes (P to unfreeze). However Ultim@te Race 1 track now has black screen in-game.
71.84 = Revolte flickery strobe light now. This was the driver that also made menus slow in Ultim@te Race 1 track, but the game did work before (not tried this time).

So, in short, it seems to be:
- Ultim@te Race 1 track = needs older drivers to be happy
- Purevex = works on any drivers fine
- Virtual On for PowerVR = works on any drivers fine
- Moon Racer = smoother on older drivers but freezes up more
- Revolte = seems to only like a very particular driver; isn't this one a PCX1 era game? Might not even be that happy on PCX2, unless anyone knows different.

I might try newer drivers/tweaking NV driver settings/M3D or PowerVR generic drivers instead of PowerVR Revolution. Could try DX8+, could try installing GeForce 7800GS+ with hacked drivers again perhaps... plenty of options, but I'm starting to lose the will to live 😁

VirtuaIceMan wrote on 2022-03-04, 11:19:

I test ran a LOT of Nvidia drivers last night, alongside the PowerVR Revolution drivers. Here are some of my results, mainly loo […]
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I test ran a LOT of Nvidia drivers last night, alongside the PowerVR Revolution drivers. Here are some of my results, mainly looking at the "problem child" games Moon Racer and Revolte, but noting that Ultim@te Race 1 track starts to go wrong the higher the driver (as well as frame rates feeling less fluid). As mentioned above, also running DX7.0a as it fixes D3D on the MX440 8X card.

I found that freezes in gameplay in Moon Racer and Revolte can be fixed (sometimes only for a moment though) by pressing P, to pause/unpause the game.

40.72 + 41.09 = Moon Racer freezes during racing
43.45 = Moon Racer less freezes but can still happen
45.23 = Moon Racer still can freeze
53.04 = menus not flickery in Moon Racer (they are in previous drivers). Froze on last lap briefly (came back without using P key), then CTD when race over
56.64 = Moon Racer flickery unplayable mess, same issue I had on Radeon 9600
61.76 = Moon Racer flickery unplayable mess, same issue I had on Radeon 9600
66.94 = Revolte now works but freezes (P to unfreeze). However Ultim@te Race 1 track now has black screen in-game.
71.84 = Revolte flickery strobe light now. This was the driver that also made menus slow in Ultim@te Race 1 track, but the game did work before (not tried this time).

So, in short, it seems to be:
- Ultim@te Race 1 track = needs older drivers to be happy
- Purevex = works on any drivers fine
- Virtual On for PowerVR = works on any drivers fine
- Moon Racer = smoother on older drivers but freezes up more
- Revolte = seems to only like a very particular driver; isn't this one a PCX1 era game? Might not even be that happy on PCX2, unless anyone knows different.

I might try newer drivers/tweaking NV driver settings/M3D or PowerVR generic drivers instead of PowerVR Revolution. Could try DX8+, could try installing GeForce 7800GS+ with hacked drivers again perhaps... plenty of options, but I'm starting to lose the will to live 😁

I think I found the best cheap AGP card which is compatible with your system and actually very fast.
The Rage Fury Pro.
Here is a link of my WIP benchmarks with cards I've tested for now.
And it passes the Moon Racer test 😉

Does Revolte work on it? That one seems VERY picky...

VirtuaIceMan wrote on 2022-03-05, 19:54:

Does Revolte work on it? That one seems VERY picky...

It does
The game's installation ruined my PVR driver though.
I had to reinstall it.
The game worked both before and after reinstalling PowerVR Revolution drivers (it ruined it for other games).

This is almost unplayable btw 😁

Guys, I also wanted to test this as a primary card.

My screen says it's "not supported" as a result (even at POST).
Is there something physically similar to VGA ports that aren't ?

What card is it?

http://www.vgamuseum.info/index.php/component … nologies-f65550

Meatball wrote on 2022-03-06, 12:10:

http://www.vgamuseum.info/index.php/component … nologies-f65550

Yes but couldn't find one with the same outputs as mine on the net. Same for datasheets. I should create a topic about this one.

JustJulião, which DX, ATi driver and PowerVR drivers are you running with Rage Fury Pro?

VirtuaIceMan wrote on 2022-03-06, 13:33:

JustJulião, which DX, ATi driver and PowerVR drivers are you running with Rage Fury Pro?

ATi driver : 6.60-010926m
PowerVR driver : PowerVR Revolution 4.1.2
DX 9.0c (probably a good thing if you want to play newer games with the ATi card, otherwise stick to 7.0).

And what RAM on the Rage Fury Pro? I've seen it with 32MB, 128MB, MAXX versions, etc. AGP I assume?

I think by Rage Fury Pro he means the Rage 128 Pro/Ultra. I happen to really like this card as it "just works". Despite having a large collection of NVIDIA cards, this is the one that I always use when debugging and testing Windows 9x machines.

The 128mb looks a bit more pricey than 32mb. Having spent £160 on M3D I didn't want to spend too much on the "2D" card, but having to keep swapping drivers and faffing about with the MX440 might become irritating...