I ended up buying an extron 300 a RGB HDMI.
It simply works, it scales everything on the fly, sharp, has no issue with different resolutions switching, nice menu and it adds audio to the HDMI output, it has everything.

Best solution as of now after testing many other ones, it's also relatively cheap.

Kordanor wrote on 2023-11-16, 16:00:

The Retrotink 4k received a pricetag now. Will be 750$.
I will still wait till Reviews for DOS are in and it's available in Europe. Probably dragonbox.de will offer it in germany. Hopefully that will be cheaper than shipping and importing it individually.

That pricetag is kind of crazy..

Well, the datapath, to go-to capture device so far, got a pricetag of 1000$. Just that most of us happened to get some used ones for cheap ^^

appiah4 wrote on 2023-11-20, 11:45:

Kordanor wrote on 2023-11-16, 16:00:

The Retrotink 4k received a pricetag now. Will be 750$.
I will still wait till Reviews for DOS are in and it's available in Europe. Probably dragonbox.de will offer it in germany. Hopefully that will be cheaper than shipping and importing it individually.

That pricetag is kind of crazy..

Yeah, but given the FPGA it uses ALONE made for over half the device's pricetag (Mike had to negotiate some gray-market prices)..

Kordanor wrote on 2023-11-20, 11:50:

Well, the datapath, to go-to capture device so far, got a pricetag of 1000$. Just that most of us happened to get some used ones for cheap ^^

$1000 Datapath is a niche in the retro scene. But unlike the Datapath the Retrotink is made for the scene so you can forget about tangential use benefits when shopping.

iraito wrote on 2023-11-18, 13:48:

I ended up buying an extron 300 a RGB HDMI.
It simply works, it scales everything on the fly, sharp, has no issue with different resolutions switching, nice menu and it adds audio to the HDMI output, it has everything.

Best solution as of now after testing many other ones, it's also relatively cheap.

Looks like real studio equipment 😀

Does it work with 8086-286 and up ( that would be bios and all postings )? the spec says "640x480 to 1920x1200* or 480p, 576p, 720p, 1080i, or 1080p".

I would consider testing one then 😀 its seems to need to have a simple adapter for power input added also.

It does, I tried multiple dos games, early win95 and later ones, everything works even weird resolution switching.

I use it only for capturing, so I can't talk about input lag and such.

i bought a 20 eur amazon wonder, just because of the curiosity: https://www.amazon.de/dp/B0BW9MK247?psc=1&ref … product_details

the setup, what i used:
p3 with asus v6800 as source (not the best analogue output)
ossc for hdmi output
apple mba m1 with obs

what i really surprised:
* it could accept 70hz, and vga input directly
* if i choose the input resolution to 1080p, it shows the correct 4:3 image in the right position
* at 640x480 with the 320x240 content pixel perfect

what does not really good:
* it does not support too much resolution input profile, and if it does not matches to the real source resolution, it makes an internal scale - eg at 640x400 - stretched to 480p or 1080p
* the image is somehow darker

but anyway, for this price it is useful thingy. ok, it cannot make the datapath output quality, but does the job - and if they can do from a 20 eur "cable" a good scaling, why we do not have a cheap scaler on the market?

here is the capture with the "guermok": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U10_rzmdiDk
and with the datapath: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=do2TkVZr_Yo (genoa vision864 video card)

So, discovering the Datapath card may not be as ideal as some think for DOS capture. Tried using JROK's "Ms. PacPC" in fullscreen mode, and a total of 20% of the image for top and bottom are completely cut off. Looks fine on the Datapath via OSSC.

Though (as with amy 4:3 source), my EVGA XR1 Pro always seems to stretch the image to 16:9.

You cannot find more flexible card, than the datapath 😀 just you have to configure it properly.

arncht wrote on 2023-11-28, 16:02:

You cannot find more flexible card, than the datapath 😀 just you have to configure it properly.

The question is, is it better to have an incredibly flexible but also expensive as all hell capture card or an incredibly flexible scaler (extron) with a good modern capture card that costs way less together than the datapath alone?

The datapath is a professional card with own programmable api, just the retro freaks started to buy the old cheap cards. I do not think, somebody here payed the original price, probably it was cheaper than the modern capture card alone w/o the scaler. If the best capture quality is the target with wide frequency support, with a lot of calibration possibilty, you cannot really find better, max similar good.

arncht wrote on 2023-11-28, 17:43:

The datapath is a professional card with own programmable api, just the retro freaks started to buy the old cheap cards. I do not think, somebody here payed the original price, probably it was cheaper than the modern capture card alone w/o the scaler. If the best capture quality is the target with wide frequency support, with a lot of calibration possibilty, you cannot really find better, max similar good.

Gotta be honest though, empirically between datapath, extron and retrothink i don't see much of a difference, the sharpest seems to be the retrothink with the ability to not only making recording possible but to also play on a modern screen with the sharpest possible picture.
The extron offers a lot of manual settings too (and it's an old professional grade scaler for productions) and gives off the same quality as the datapath from what i can see, i ask myself if the device isn't a bit overrated at this point.

The best of the best seems to be the new retrothink without a question.

NightSprinter wrote on 2023-11-28, 14:33:

So, discovering the Datapath card may not be as ideal as some think for DOS capture. Tried using JROK's "Ms. PacPC" in fullscreen mode, and a total of 20% of the image for top and bottom are completely cut off. Looks fine on the Datapath via OSSC.

Though (as with amy 4:3 source), my EVGA XR1 Pro always seems to stretch the image to 16:9.

There isn't just one Datapath card. The VisionRGB-PRO captures the full board, though at least with this Matrox G400 reports the resolution as 772 x 579 and lots of empty space on the sides which I cropped out:

iraito wrote on 2023-11-28, 17:57:

Gotta be honest though, empirically between datapath, extron and retrothink i don't see much of a difference, the sharpest seems […]
Show full quote

arncht wrote on 2023-11-28, 17:43:

The datapath is a professional card with own programmable api, just the retro freaks started to buy the old cheap cards. I do not think, somebody here payed the original price, probably it was cheaper than the modern capture card alone w/o the scaler. If the best capture quality is the target with wide frequency support, with a lot of calibration possibilty, you cannot really find better, max similar good.

Gotta be honest though, empirically between datapath, extron and retrothink i don't see much of a difference, the sharpest seems to be the retrothink with the ability to not only making recording possible but to also play on a modern screen with the sharpest possible picture.
The extron offers a lot of manual settings too (and it's an old professional grade scaler for productions) and gives off the same quality as the datapath from what i can see, i ask myself if the device isn't a bit overrated at this point.

The best of the best seems to be the new retrothink without a question.

it is a capture card, not a scaler. if you can get the same pixel perfect 1:1 output, they are the same, any another scaling settings you can do eg in the obs (it is way more flexible, than the "hw" scalers).

if you want to use as a scaler, there are better options.

vvbee wrote on 2023-11-29, 06:00:

NightSprinter wrote on 2023-11-28, 14:33:

So, discovering the Datapath card may not be as ideal as some think for DOS capture. Tried using JROK's "Ms. PacPC" in fullscreen mode, and a total of 20% of the image for top and bottom are completely cut off. Looks fine on the Datapath via OSSC.

Though (as with amy 4:3 source), my EVGA XR1 Pro always seems to stretch the image to 16:9.

There isn't just one Datapath card. The VisionRGB-PRO captures the full board, though at least with this Matrox G400 reports the resolution as 772 x 579 and lots of empty space on the sides which I cropped out:
ppc.jpg

I have the E2S, and it only sees the fullscreen mode as 640x480 59.94Hz. Hence the screenshot I provided.

NightSprinter wrote on 2023-11-29, 13:52:

I have the E2S, and it only sees the fullscreen mode as 640x480 59.94Hz. Hence the screenshot I provided.

I have both and have recommended the PRO for DOS many times. They were being handed out for $25 shipped a few years back, hard to beat that.

iraito wrote on 2023-11-28, 16:17:

arncht wrote on 2023-11-28, 16:02:

You cannot find more flexible card, than the datapath 😀 just you have to configure it properly.

The question is, is it better to have an incredibly flexible but also expensive as all hell capture card or an incredibly flexible scaler (extron) with a good modern capture card that costs way less together than the datapath alone?

What modern, cost effective card would you recommend? 😀

anne wrote on 2023-11-29, 20:20:

iraito wrote on 2023-11-28, 16:17:

arncht wrote on 2023-11-28, 16:02:

You cannot find more flexible card, than the datapath 😀 just you have to configure it properly.

The question is, is it better to have an incredibly flexible but also expensive as all hell capture card or an incredibly flexible scaler (extron) with a good modern capture card that costs way less together than the datapath alone?

What modern, cost effective card would you recommend? 😀

Personally i'm loving the live gamer ultra from avermedia, nooooot really that cost effective but i had the luck to buy an almost unused one for 100€ it accepts any kind of refresh, color space, vsync up to 4k and it's portable (needed in my case)
But avermedia produces way less expensive cards that go max to 1080p but still have a lot of refresh etc. options and the same crisp and color correct quality.

iraito wrote on 2023-11-29, 20:39:

anne wrote on 2023-11-29, 20:20:

iraito wrote on 2023-11-28, 16:17:

The question is, is it better to have an incredibly flexible but also expensive as all hell capture card or an incredibly flexible scaler (extron) with a good modern capture card that costs way less together than the datapath alone?

What modern, cost effective card would you recommend? 😀

Personally i'm loving the live gamer ultra from avermedia, nooooot really that cost effective but i had the luck to buy an almost unused one for 100€ it accepts any kind of refresh, color space, vsync up to 4k and it's portable (needed in my case)
But avermedia produces way less expensive cards that go max to 1080p but still have a lot of refresh etc. options and the same crisp and color correct quality.

The important question is: how does it handle resolution switching? My EVGA XR1 Pro is almost Framemeister-levels of slow.