VOGONS


Reply 100 of 134, by pan069

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Jo22 wrote on 2021-06-05, 17:49:

One of the differences might be,
that the 286 is not limited to a fixed segment size of 64KB anymore.
I don't know for sure, though.

That is only in 286 protected mode. There is very little software that uses this mode on the 286, let alone games. Bill Gates famously referred to protected mode on the 286 as "brain dead" [1]. The main problem is, once the 286 switches into protected mode, it has no way of switching back to real-mode.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_80286

Reply 101 of 134, by Jo22

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Thanks, I guess. Here's a screenshot of one of the compilers I was thinking of.
It's a C compiler, though. For DOS/Real-Mode. I used it since my childhood.
Supports several memory models and has a /1 and /2 switch for CPUs later than 8086.

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Reply 102 of 134, by pan069

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Those switches for 186 and 286 are just for the support of different instruction sets. I.e. a 186 has a more evolved instruction set over an 86, and a 286 has a more evolved instruction over and 286, and a 386 is 32bit instead of the prior 16bit processors.

When a C compiler generates the byte code, then that byte code targets a specific processor instruction set. I.e. byte code for a 286 using instructions specific for a 286 will probably be more efficient than byte generated for a 186 just using the instruction set of a 186. This is why the x86 family of processors are backward compatible. I.e. a 286 can execute everything that a 186 can execute. But not the other way around.

Memory models don't allow to allocate more than 64kb in real mode. It simply allows your compiler to create an abstraction layer for addressing memory. I.e. give you the illusion that you can allocate larger blocks at a performance penalty. Behind the scenes, the compiler has put in place a mechanism that spans multiple 64kb blocks, giving you the illusion it's one big block of data.

More on memory models: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Memory_Model

Reply 103 of 134, by DigitalMan

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dr.zeissler wrote on 2021-06-04, 17:17:

Could possibly work on plantronics, but require 286+, so not for my EuroPC II with Nec V20.

Most definitely works on my 8088, but I was curious about getting an NEC v20. There is no turbo or way to increase the bus speed on my PC10-II so I'm wondering if that upgraded processor would make any difference. Anyone know?

Reply 104 of 134, by Benedikt

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pan069 wrote on 2021-06-06, 04:13:

Those switches for 186 and 286 are just for the support of different instruction sets. I.e. a 186 has a more evolved instruction set over an 86, and a 286 has a more evolved instruction over and 286, and a 386 is 32bit instead of the prior 16bit processors.

They could also be optimization options.
If you tell the compiler to generate "286 real mode code", the result would then be 186 code optimized to run fast on a 286.

DigitalMan wrote on 2021-06-06, 13:21:
dr.zeissler wrote on 2021-06-04, 17:17:

Could possibly work on plantronics, but require 286+, so not for my EuroPC II with Nec V20.

Most definitely works on my 8088, but I was curious about getting an NEC v20. There is no turbo or way to increase the bus speed on my PC10-II so I'm wondering if that upgraded processor would make any difference. Anyone know?

With 8088 code, the speed gains provided by a V20 are not going to be overwhelming, but a processor upgrade could be combined with a hardware mod like the PC-SPRINT that runs the CPU at a higher clock speed than the rest of the system.

There is also still some room for speed optimizations in the Plantronics driver itself.

Reply 105 of 134, by dr.zeissler

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Benedikt wrote on 2020-08-15, 11:37:
The list of known-working games is now as follows: […]
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The list of known-working games is now as follows:

  • Codename: ICEMAN
  • Conquests of Camelot
  • Hoyle's Book of Games 1
  • Hoyle's Book of Games 2
  • Hoyle's Book of Games 3
  • King's Quest I (SCI)
  • King's Quest IV
  • Leisure Suit Larry 1 (SCI)
  • Leisure Suit Larry 3
  • Mixed-Up Mother Goose
  • Police Quest II
  • Police Quest III
  • Quest for Glory I
  • Quest for Glory II
  • Space Quest I (SCI)
  • Space Quest III
  • The Colonel's Bequest

I fact, I have not found a single game with 320x200 pixel 16-color mode that doesn't work with the new driver.
The dedicated EGA editions of King's Quest V and certain other games should work, as well, but they are not readily available and the VGA editions are useless in this context.

I do not have enough space on my CF-Card to install all of them... Thankfully my EuroPC can now use the MT32 too 😉 thx Cloudschatze!

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Reply 106 of 134, by Jinxter

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dr.zeissler wrote on 2021-07-24, 14:21:

Thankfully my EuroPC can now use the MT32 too 😉 thx Cloudschatze!

How do you connect the MT32 to your EuroPC?

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Reply 107 of 134, by dr.zeissler

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EuroPC Serial-Port (set to 38400 bps via software) -> Hosa DBK-103 8-pin Mini-DIN to DE9 Synthesizer Host Cable - 3 foot -> Yamaha MU50 "PC-2-mode"
Yamaha MU50 "PC-2-mode" Midi-OUT -> RA50 MT32Mode or MT32 Mini-IN and last but not least "patched mt32drv for Sierra games.

Hope this helps.
Doc

In Action: https://youtu.be/MSvx0ddJREk

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Reply 108 of 134, by Jinxter

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dr.zeissler wrote on 2021-10-18, 20:07:

EuroPC Serial-Port (set to 38400 bps via software) -> Hosa DBK-103 8-pin Mini-DIN to DE9 Synthesizer Host Cable - 3 foot -> Yamaha MU50 "PC-2-mode"
Yamaha MU50 "PC-2-mode" Midi-OUT -> RA50 MT32Mode or MT32 Mini-IN and last but not least "patched mt32drv for Sierra games.
In Action: https://youtu.be/MSvx0ddJREk

Can i use the MPU-232? - https://www.serdashop.com/MPU-232 and connect it directly to an MT32?
Does the patched drivers replace the SoftMpu? - Or do i need the MU50 to do this on an 8088? i Guess the MU50 is the key.

Last edited by Jinxter on 2021-10-18, 21:22. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 109 of 134, by dr.zeissler

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Good question. I think the MU50 does replace softmpu in that setup. Please ask "cloudschatze" for more infos.

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Reply 111 of 134, by Jinxter

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Cloudschatze wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:17:

The MPU-232 can absolutely be used in lieu of something like the MU50 for this purpose, yes. In this capacity, either acts as just an intermediary RS-232 -> MIDI conversion device.

Thanks, but in an 8088 machine the MU50 way is the only possible way, unless you have a available ISA slot?
I have just made a video about different ways of getting MIDI out of an old computer. And i am hoping to find a way for 8088 machines without an available ISA slot - like the EuroPC.

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Reply 112 of 134, by Cloudschatze

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Jinxter wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:23:
Cloudschatze wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:17:

The MPU-232 can absolutely be used in lieu of something like the MU50 for this purpose, yes. In this capacity, either acts as just an intermediary RS-232 -> MIDI conversion device.

Thanks, but in an 8088 machine the MU50 way is the only possible way, unless you have a available ISA slot?
I have just made a video about different ways of getting MIDI out of an old computer. And i am hoping to find a way for 8088 machines without an available ISA slot - like the EuroPC.

No, whether we're talking the MU50 or the MPU-232, it's just a serial connection between the computer and that device (using the appropriate cable), and possibly a MIDI cable connection beyond that depending on the desired target device.

Oh, I think I understand what you're asking. Where SoftMPU requires a 386+ system, the key here, or in the case of any non-386+ system, is the use of modified game drivers/routines that have been patched to directly support serial MIDI output. These drivers can be used with either something like the MU50, or with the MPU-232. (The serial support of both devices is basically identical.)

Reply 113 of 134, by Jinxter

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Cloudschatze wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:27:

Oh, I think I understand what you're asking. Where SoftMPU requires a 386+ system, the key here, or in the case of any non-386+ system, is the use of modified game drivers/routines that have been patched to directly support serial MIDI output. These drivers can be used with either something like the MU50, or with the MPU-232. (The serial support of both devices is basically identical.)

Do you know is there exists patches/drivers for games that will send the MIDI signal to the RS232 port? - If yes, where?

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Reply 114 of 134, by Cloudschatze

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Jinxter wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:38:
Cloudschatze wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:27:

Oh, I think I understand what you're asking. Where SoftMPU requires a 386+ system, the key here, or in the case of any non-386+ system, is the use of modified game drivers/routines that have been patched to directly support serial MIDI output. These drivers can be used with either something like the MU50, or with the MPU-232. (The serial support of both devices is basically identical.)

Do you know is there exists patches/drivers for games that will send the MIDI signal to the RS232 port? - If yes, where?

Ideally, I'd get around to working on an MPU/serial-based implementation of pdw's AdPatch utility for this sort of thing. For now though, I've made a number of them available throughout this thread:
https://www.vcfed.org/forum/forum/genres/tand … dio-shack/71478

And this thread, concerning a few 32-bit/protected-mode titles:
MPU-232 : RS-232 MIDI interface, compatible with SoftMPU

Reply 115 of 134, by Jinxter

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Cloudschatze wrote on 2021-10-18, 21:43:

For now though, I've made a number of them available throughout this thread:
https://www.vcfed.org/forum/forum/genres/tand … dio-shack/71478

Wow, you have patches for quite a few games. Thanks. I will soon be making a video featuring Serge's MPU232 and other methods getting MIDI signal from a Computer.

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Reply 117 of 134, by Benedikt

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RetroBard wrote on 2022-02-21, 15:53:

I just recently found this topic. I was wondering how hard it would be to make a PCPplus driver for the Lucasarts games?

I have actually looked at "The Secret of Monkey Island" before. The main problem I see is that there aren't any drivers, at all.
Presumably it is all in monkey.exe itself, which makes swapping out the video code way too complicated.
If it were open source, things would be different, but it isn't, and porting ScummVM to an XT-class system sounds like a terrible idea, too.

Reply 118 of 134, by RetroBard

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Benedikt wrote on 2022-02-21, 18:33:
I have actually looked at "The Secret of Monkey Island" before. The main problem I see is that there aren't any drivers, at all. […]
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RetroBard wrote on 2022-02-21, 15:53:

I just recently found this topic. I was wondering how hard it would be to make a PCPplus driver for the Lucasarts games?

I have actually looked at "The Secret of Monkey Island" before. The main problem I see is that there aren't any drivers, at all.
Presumably it is all in monkey.exe itself, which makes swapping out the video code way too complicated.
If it were open source, things would be different, but it isn't, and porting ScummVM to an XT-class system sounds like a terrible idea, too.

Did Monkey Island have separate executables for the different graphics modes? Or was it set by typing the graphics mode as parameter for the executable?

Reply 119 of 134, by dr.zeissler

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There were different executables for different versions, but they supported multiple gfx-modes afaik.
The EGA Version could be used the CGA,Hercules too and the the VGA256 supported ega-hires, but I am not 100% sure.

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