VOGONS


First post, by clb

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Hi all,

Looking at VGA Museum at http://www.vgamuseum.info/index.php/cpu/item/367-s3-virge-dx , the S3 Trio Virge/DX has this 50-pin "16-bit VESA Local Peripheral Bus" connector.

From my searches so far, I find S3 to be the only manufacturer that has provided this 50-pin "16-bit VESA LPB" connector.

Does anyone know if there might exist other PCI or AGP video cards from other manufacturers than S3 that would have this connector?

The connector may be broken in three separate parts instead of a single 50-pin connector:
- a 2x13-pin VFC connector, followed by
- a 2x3-pin 8-bit LPB connector (sometimes labeled "Scenic Highway"), and
- either a 2x7-pin or a 2x8-pin "16-bit LPB" connector

So the total pin count can look a bit different (either one full row of 2x25 pins, or separately e.g. 2x13+2x3+2x7 combination).

What I am mostly curious is that even when it seems that VESA standardized this connector, would this have been something that S3 only ever implemented in their products. (in which case it sounds like it was S3's invention, which VESA then took under their umbrella, but did it take wind among other manufacturers?)

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Reply 1 of 9, by imkidd57

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Some of the Cirrus Logic cards have a header which looks partly compatible - e.g. this on UK Ebay which has a 2 x 13 plus a 2 x 3 close by. The latter appears to be a jumper set though.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/325515731823?_trkp … 7Cclp%3A2047675

I don't know enough to tell whether it's a simply a coincidental arrangement.

Reply 2 of 9, by clb

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Thanks - I see only a 2x13 connector on that ebay link, wasn't able to locate a 2x3 header in those images.

Since posting the thread, I have gotten a stronger impression that the 16-bit VESA LPB was indeed just a S3 thing.

What I've been interested in is charting the different proprietary and non-proprietary extension connectors on different graphics cards, and so far I have cataloged:
- VGA Feature Connector: 2x13 pins edge connector standardized: https://www.vgamuseum.info/media/k2/items/cac … f09ef700_XL.jpg
- VESA Feature Connector: actually same as VGA Feature Connector, these names were used interchangeably. 2x13 pin header: https://www.vgamuseum.info/media/k2/items/cac … e975d9f7_XL.jpg
- ATI Multimedia Channel (AMC): 2x20 pins pin header: https://www.vgamuseum.info/media/k2/items/cac … e425d131_XL.jpg
- 8-bit Vesa Local Peripheral Bus: 2x13 pins of VESA Feature Connector + 2x1 pins empty space + 2x3 pins 8-bit LPB = 2x17 pin connector. https://www.vgamuseum.info/images/palcal/s3/2 … -201_top_hq.jpg (there is extra 2x5 pins in that one I don't know what those are)
- 16-bit LPB: 2x17 pins 8-bit LPB + 2x8 pins 16-bit LPB = 2x25 pin connector. https://www.vgamuseum.info/media/k2/items/cac … cde1a863_XL.jpg
- Vesa Advanced Feature Connector: 2x40 pin "SCSI-style" connector: http://www.dosdays.co.uk/topics/images/number … gxe64_pci_1.jpg
- as a unique curiosity, this one Tseng ET4000AX has this odd 2x15 pin "Multimedia" connector: https://www.vgamuseum.info/media/k2/items/cac … 18c0fd2e_XL.jpg . I have not seen any other cards have it.

If anyone knows of cards with other connectors, please expand the list 😀

Reply 3 of 9, by gen_angry

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My Cardex S3 Trio64V2/DX has the 2x13 feature connector, a removed 2x1 'slot', a 2x3 connector, then an inverted 5x2 connector on it. No idea what any of those do but looking at the board markings, the 2x1 and 2x3 'expands' off of the 2x13.

http://www.amoretro.de/wp-content/uploads/car … s3_trio64v+.jpg is what the whole thing looks like from a google search (not my image/card).

Reply 4 of 9, by imkidd57

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clb wrote on 2023-02-15, 10:11:

Thanks - I see only a 2x13 connector on that ebay link, wasn't able to locate a 2x3 header in those images.

It would have helped if I'd added the correct link! See this, which is the one I meant to show:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124190117294?_trkp … 7Cclp%3A2047675

Reply 5 of 9, by clb

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imkidd57 wrote on 2023-02-15, 13:37:

It would have helped if I'd added the correct link! See this, which is the one I meant to show:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124190117294?_trkp … 7Cclp%3A2047675

Thanks, now I see. Yeah, that one looks like a VGA Feature Connector, and then an unrelated header for jumper switch configuration. The connectors form a bus of data, but for jumper switches it is a open/closed loop for configuration.

Reply 6 of 9, by clb

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gen_angry wrote on 2023-02-15, 11:50:

My Cardex S3 Trio64V2/DX has the 2x13 feature connector, a removed 2x1 'slot', a 2x3 connector, then an inverted 5x2 connector on it. No idea what any of those do but looking at the board markings, the 2x1 and 2x3 'expands' off of the 2x13.

http://www.amoretro.de/wp-content/uploads/car … s3_trio64v+.jpg is what the whole thing looks like from a google search (not my image/card).

Very interesting! A female 2x5 pin header connector. That seems like kind of identical with this card https://www.vgamuseum.info/images/palcal/s3/2 … -201_top_hq.jpg , but there the 2x5 connector is male.

I may try to source some of those to reverse engineer if I can guess what they are for. Or if someone has a manual..?

Reply 7 of 9, by rmay635703

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This is OT but
S3 in that era had some s3 branded components that used their special feature connector.

https://www.epanorama.net/documents/pc/vafc.html

https://www.electronicproducts.com/decoder-ca … multimedia-pcs/

Ever present but rarely used for consumer products

https://www.epanorama.net/documents/pc/vga_feature.html

https://forum.vcfed.org/index.php?threads/wha … cards-do.78424/

Feature connector video card input and mpeg1/2 decoders

http://www.bitsavers.org/components/s3/DB018- … rator_Jul95.pdf

Reply 9 of 9, by rmay635703

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clb wrote on 2023-02-19, 08:59:

Thanks. The links are rehashing well known information that was already listed above, although the last PDF is interesting, it goes into more details about LPB than what I have found before.

Having owned many s3 cards in the 1995-1997 era
I owned one of the cards in question
S3 had its own daughter card that used that connector to decode dvd’s for playback.

I don’t know of any 3rd party devices that used the full capability of s3’s own connector.

Living through that time I could never figure out why that connector wasn’t truly standardized across all brands making it sort of pointless unless you bought the card with the daughter card of your choice,
going back to buy a daughter card later was nearly impossible .