mrfusion92 wrote on 2023-03-02, 21:30:This. I use OSSC and a PCIe video capture card.
Which PCIe capture card do you use?
I've used the OSSC and it's successor (the DExx) and the results are definitely really good. The only thing missing are the scanlines/CRT filters.
However, I've always been interested in an HDMI capture card but I think even the -best- ones have a frame or so of lag.
sofakng wrote on 2023-03-02, 21:35:Which PCIe capture card do you use?
I've used the OSSC and it's successor (the DExx) and the results are definitely really good. The only thing missing are the scanlines/CRT filters.
However, I've always been interested in an HDMI capture card but I think even the -best- ones have a frame or so of lag.
It's a Digitnow 4K video capture card. It's not the best at all. But the only cheap one (it was around 100€) I could find that supports the 70 Hz.
About the lag, OSSC shouldn't add any based on what I understand about how it works. The capture card it may definitely have some lag but I just don't notice it.
pentiumspeed wrote on 2023-03-02, 21:10:These two Nec models is not available on ebay. Is there other alternative models for Nec
Like I said, you may look for similar EIZO models. Or maybe look for an 1980FXi, which also was manufactured around 2006. Although I have no info about scaler capabilities on that one, because OSD is older.
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
I bought a theorically excellent 4:3 LCD three times. Eizo Flexscan L565.
Twice shipped, once taking it in person. None of them pleased me with quality. I think not all technologies age well. Backlight or brightness seem uneven and even excluding that, it just doesn't look good, like "washed out". I got the exact same issue on all of them, so I think this is related to its TFT technology (I think it's TN technology). It was greatly praised back in the day.
My very simple Hyundai is much better. I also have a Dells at work (I can get the model number if needed) which all have very good image and still working. But it has black bezels, not suitable for me for being paired with old hardware.
Always pick your LCD personally and ask for seeing it working in person, because even honest sellers often just get used to the image and don't see its issues.
So we should make a list of suitable and good TFT's that can be used for Retro-Gaming in Dos and Win9x.
Retro-Gamer 😀 ...on different machines
Modern 1440p/2160p displays with black frame insertion =P
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
JustJulião wrote on 2023-03-03, 09:39:I bought a theorically excellent 4:3 LCD three times. Eizo Flexscan L565. Twice shipped, once taking it in person. None of them […]
I bought a theorically excellent 4:3 LCD three times. Eizo Flexscan L565.
Twice shipped, once taking it in person. None of them pleased me with quality. I think not all technologies age well. Backlight or brightness seem uneven and even excluding that, it just doesn't look good, like "washed out". I got the exact same issue on all of them, so I think this is related to its TFT technology (I think it's TN technology). It was greatly praised back in the day.
My very simple Hyundai is much better. I also have a Dells at work (I can get the model number if needed) which all have very good image and still working. But it has black bezels, not suitable for me for being paired with old hardware.
Always pick your LCD personally and ask for seeing it working in person, because even honest sellers often just get used to the image and don't see its issues.IMG_20230303_102943.jpg
Hi,
That's very decent quality for that age but unfortunately the backlight film layers is ruined by excessive time exposed to very hot heat. We see that often on ipads when anyone ruined the LCD's backlight film layers by heating too long to get it apart.
How it works in DOS games, with 70hz resolution, also in 640x480?
Cheers,
Great Northern aka Canada.
I was digging through my old LCDs and there is one 4:3 LCD monitor I don't mind: the HP LP2065. It's a 20" screen with 1600x1200 resolution (proper 4:3 aspect ratio).
It's an older TFT display so contrast isn't great and it does have that "washed out" look that JustJulião mentioned. It's just the nature of older TFT panels unfortunately.
That said, it works well in various resolutions I've tried it with and supports 70Hz input for DOS gaming (see screenshots). Though it does have a 60Hz panel so you will get judder. It's not what I would call great, but in absence of a proper CRT, it's not the worst display in the world.
I should note I own three of this particular model and this is the best of the bunch. The other two have some backlight issues I need to sort out.
I've also tested others like the Dell 2007FPb, NEC Multisync 2170NX, Eizo Flexcan L771, etc. The HP LP2065 is my favorite of the bunch.
"washed out pixels" by the colors or while the screen is too big?
Because I use old TFT's everywhere I got used to it. If I am looking for contrast and black-values you are right it's more like darker grey than black,
but I don't care. I will definitely not use bulky CRT's anymore even if I have them and also I am not using anything above 17" because it don't fits in my Desktop-Setups and the lowres-images are too big on those 19"/20+" screens. But that's only my opinion.
It's OK for me:
XT/CGA (PLT) https://youtu.be/MSvx0ddJREk
A2K VGA https://youtu.be/P2z_6hgYvcs
Retro-Gamer 😀 ...on different machines
good makes of lcd monitors from 1998-2004 are philips, benq, taxan, fujitsu siemens, liteon, goodmans and samsung.
look into them
I manage a pot-pourri of video matter...
FSC panels are from LG. I use Nec 71vm everywhere because they can sync to most anything, even 15khz/24khz and 31khz of course.
Retro-Gamer 😀 ...on different machines
Shponglefan wrote on 2023-03-04, 03:41:It's a TFT display so contrast isn't great and it does have that "washed out" look that JustJulião mentioned. It's just the nature of TFT panels unfortunately.
No, it's not nature of TFT, which is general identification for all modern LCD displays (TN, xVA, IPS, PLS). That's probably just an old crunchy S-IPS panel. Or maybe something else, because HP were switching panels without notice, just like DELL.
I've tried it with and supports 70Hz for DOS gaming (see screenshots).
Support in OSD means nothing. I've yet so see any 1600x1200 panel of that era to output 70-75Hz without frame skipping.
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
The Serpent Rider wrote on 2023-03-04, 11:01:Support in OSD means nothing. I've yet so see any 1600x1200 panel of that era to output 70-75Hz without frame skipping.
Correct, I've amended my post accordingly.
I just meant that it will work with DOS based modes (resolutions/refresh), not that it would necessarily produce a judder free image.
Shponglefan wrote on 2023-03-04, 03:41:It's an older TFT display so contrast isn't great and it does have that "washed out" look that JustJulião mentioned. It's just the nature of older TFT panels unfortunately.
The Serpent Rider wrote on 2023-03-04, 11:01:No, it's not nature of TFT, which is general identification for all modern LCD displays (TN, xVA, IPS, PLS). That's probably just an old crunchy S-IPS panel. Or maybe something else, because HP were switching panels without notice, just like DELL.
I pointed a specific TFT technology, TN, which equips the Eizo and I assume don't age well, but it's not the case for all TFT's of this era. The Hyundai I'm mentionning is only one year newer. Dell's are 3 years newer (ok that's starting to be notable). They are perfectly fine.
Here is an interesting list of this era's LCD monitors with a review of this specific Eizo. On other chapters of this comparison there are also different TFT technologies explained, including the TN one.
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/comparis … -15,409-16.html
pentiumspeed wrote on 2023-03-04, 02:42:Hi, […]
Hi,
That's very decent quality for that age but unfortunately the backlight film layers is ruined by excessive time exposed to very hot heat. We see that often on ipads when anyone ruined the LCD's backlight film layers by heating too long to get it apart.
How it works in DOS games, with 70hz resolution, also in 640x480?
Cheers,
To be honest I just got it out for the picture, it's stored. I won't even dare to resell it I think. So I can't reply to your question unfortunately.
I just meant that it will work with DOS based modes
That practically never was a problem, from my experience with old PC LCDs.
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
dr.zeissler wrote on 2023-03-04, 07:54:"washed out pixels" by the colors or while the screen is too big?
Because I use old TFT's everywhere I got used to it. If I am looking for contrast and black-values you are right it's more like darker grey than black,
Yes, I meant washed out in terms of brightness and contrast.
That's the biggest issue I had with LCDs in general is that just look dull in comparison to a CRT. Even modern LCD displays lack the level of brightness that gives CRT screens that visual "pop".
You're right that if one just uses LCDs, you may not end up noticing the difference. But putting a CRT alongside an LCD and the differences becomes readily apparent.
JustJulião wrote on 2023-03-04, 13:45:The Hyundai I'm mentionning is only one year newer. Dell's are 3 years newer (ok that's starting to be notable). They are perfectly fine.
Which specific models are those? I don't own any Hyundai LCD monitors, so it might look to get one for comparison.
I had with LCDs in general is that just look dull in comparison to a CRT. Even modern LCD displays lack the level of brightness that gives CRT screens that visual "pop".
CRTs really suck even in moderately lit environments, because they are grey by nature. And well, typical PC CRT brightness hardly can go beyond 150cd/m2. And after 20+ years, that hardly would reach even 100 cd/m2.
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
Shponglefan wrote on 2023-03-04, 13:49:JustJulião wrote on 2023-03-04, 13:45:The Hyundai I'm mentionning is only one year newer. Dell's are 3 years newer (ok that's starting to be notable). They are perfectly fine.
Which specific models are those? I don't own any Hyundai LCD monitors, so it might look to get one for comparison.
The Hyundai is the ImageQuest L70S. It's not white/beige but it fits the machine it's attached to not too bad.
Dell's are in my working place, I'll check later. But I think it wouldn't help you much because they switched panels even in the same models.
https://www.prad.de/technische-daten/monitor- … t/hyundai-l70s/
https://www.prad.de/technische-daten/monitor- … cusync-lcd71vm/
Not a big difference, but 71vm can do 15/24/31 khz and 50hz native. Please test this on your L70s.
Retro-Gamer 😀 ...on different machines
